Community | July 11, 2008 | 26 comments

Hate speech in the bible? Man sues publishers

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JanaPokana
Some editions of the Bible from the 1980s published by Zondervan Publishing and Thomas Nelson Publishing assert that homosexuality is a sin, causing one gay man to sue the publishing houses for emotional damage.

The allegations against the publishers, brought by Bradley LaShawn Fowler of Canton, Mich., could result in $70 million in damages if Fowler wins his case. Fowler is representing himself in federal court against both publishers after a U.S. district judge refused to appoint him an attorney in his case against Thomas Nelson. The judge explained, “The court has some very genuine concerns about the nature and efficacy of these claims.”

According to the Chicago Tribune, the suit against Zondervan claims 1982 and 1987 editions of the publisher’s Bible explicitly declare homosexuality to be wrong in 1 Corinthians 6:9: "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders."

Fowler claims that the word "homosexual" was edited out of the 1989 and 1994 editions but that consumers were not informed, and that because his family pastor uses the older versions, he's been shunned by his family as a result.

Fowler levels similar claims against Thomas Nelson regarding its earlier versions of the New King James Bible, saying he has suffered extreme emotional and sometimes physical discomfort as a result of the antigay passages in the Bible. He wrote that it was the intention of the publishers to cause “me or anyone who is a homosexual to endure verbal abuse, discrimination, episodes of hate, and physical violence...including murder.”
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26 comments // Hate speech in the bible? Man sues publishers

  • balderdashandpiffle
    • 0
      balderdashandpiffle  
    • He's just a chancer out to get money. He should have to pay all court costs (as would happen in the UK) for bringing such a frivolous law suit.

      Most people are aware enough of the Bibles content to take it with a pinch of salt. Taxes offend me, and paying them causes me mental distress should I sue the government for compensation?

      No I am not having a go because he is gay (I am Bi) but because he is a disgraceful chancer who perpetuates the stereotypical oppressed minority that needs protecting at every turn from the cruel world bollocks.

    • 3 years ago
  • soleil10
    • 0
      soleil10  
    • The old and new testament are very clear on homosexuality. Jesus said that a man shall lay down with a woman and become one.

      The new mantra for some gay activists is; If I don't like it. It is hate speech. Because most people are not haters, they are at first shocked and search inside themselves f

      But after You can cry woolf just so many times and be the vicitm. Most people realize they are not hateful and
      they are just being manipulated.

      This post is just part of the spin we get every day. It is part of the mental harassment campaign and brainwashing in the media.

      Soon everyone will learn to blok it

    • 3 years ago
  • tpane
    • 0
      tpane  
    • Tell you what; those offended by the passage in Romans denouncing homosexuality", don't read it. It's just one more sin in a long list of many in the Book. If we went through the entire list I'm sure everyone here would be lacking.

    • 3 years ago
  • Kate_08
    • 0
      Kate_08  
    • I have done some translation before and I disagree when you say that different translations carry the same meaning. When translating you have to be careful with word choice especially when dealing with sensitive information. There are subtle but definite differences when it comes to word choice.

      As for the article...I think it is great for people to see this kind of information. Accepting the fact that everything written in the bible might not be true is important. I went to college in "The Bible Belt" and I got to know some people that practically slept with the bible under their pillows. The bible was their life. Some of those people were nice and fairly open minded but a lot were really rude especially towards homosexuals. I say if you believe that God has a problem with homosexuality leave it to God to deal with.

    • 3 years ago
  • J_Jammer
  • Joe_Leo
  • J_Jammer
    • 0
      J_Jammer [removed]  
    • Has any of you translated before?

      There is a pod on current that talks about translators.

      Each translator can translate the same sentence differently but it still holds the same meaning. It doesn't mean what they did was a lie. (unless you are talking about the murky translation of AJ from Iran...makes me want to learn their language just to know what's going on....more so than German or French. I think it would be cool..oh no better watch out I could be branded a terrorist just thinking of wanting to speak their language).

      He has to prove that homosexual is SO different than the translation that there's no WAY...no WAY it could ever been considered as an accurate translation.

      Meaning someone translated something that said the boy wanted an apple and someone else said the boy said he wanted an orange. That is a significant difference...that is what he'll have to prove. I highly doubt he's bright enough to realize that let alone accomplish it.

      This is what happens when a Church decides to play the PC game instead of sticking with the Word of God game. They get themselves in a load of mess. But not enough of a mess to make this a viable claim. Not.At.All.

    • 3 years ago
  • rwylie
    • 0
      rwylie  
    • J_Jammer:

      What's your view on the translation of the hebrew word 'almah', which means 'young woman', and was used to describe Jesus' mother in the Bible.

      'Bethulah' is the Hebrew word for virgin. You'd think if it was truly an immaculate conception, they would've been sure to show just how miraculous it was and specify that she was a virgin. lol

    • 3 years ago
  • J_Jammer
    • 0
      J_Jammer [removed]  
    • J_Jammer:

      This is the problem. People have to find fault instead of using language commons sense.

      Do you go around calling people Virgins prior to talking about them?

      It's unrealistic to think that one would continue to call someone it over and over again if they already did it once.

      Such as President. He's the President. Thereafter they call him by his first name. Do you then think that they are contradicting because they are not stating President over and over again?

    • 3 years ago
  • rwylie
    • 0
      rwylie  
    • J_Jammer:

      I don't understand what you mean calling people Virgins prior to talking about them. That sentense desn't make sense.

      I'm talking about the first time they introduce her. They do not use the word "Bethulah". This is very odd indeed, if there was actually a virgin birth.

    • 3 years ago
  • J_Jammer
  • rwylie
    • 0
      rwylie  
    • J_Jammer:

      Okay, but then when she becomes pregnant, why wouldn't they emphasize this event which would be amazing to so many people, instead of just calling her a pregnant young woman.

      It takes the miraculous element out of it a bit... A pregnant VIRGIN on the other hand would really inspire awe. Funny that they don't...

    • 3 years ago
  • J_Jammer
    • 0
      J_Jammer [removed]  
    • J_Jammer:

      There are four different accounts. I don't know. I think you mean to say Greek considering those are the Greek scriptures and they were not written in Hebrew.

      There are 4 different accounts. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. Matthew was the Tax collector so his account is more number related. He noticed things because of his line of work. Luke was a physician so his account would most likely state what you said it should state....indication about her state.

      If that word is Greek.

    • 3 years ago
  • rwylie
    • 0
      rwylie  
    • J_Jammer:

      The confusion arose when the Greek Septuagint used the greek word 'parthenos', meaning virgin, to translate Isaiah 7:14 (which uses 'almah' meaning young woman and NOT virgin). This was the ONLY inspiration for the gospellers of the Virgin birth.

    • 3 years ago
  • J_Jammer
    • 0
      J_Jammer [removed]  
    • J_Jammer:

      I can understand.

      People fail to realize that the bible is inspired by God. Not written. Therefore humans write it. They write their style. Each of the 66 books has the style of the person who wrote it.

      Such as if you and I saw the same thing or heard someone speak at a rally and we wrote our writing of what we focused on would be different.

      If what you state is correct then how is Isaiah wrong? She was a young woman.

      When people state there are inconsistencies in the bible I think that they are going to point to someone saying, Look over there at the Devil. Then point to another scripture of the same story stating they said look at God.

      There are other inconsistencies with numbers. Some don't agree on the amount of people that were some place and why doe s that matter? In eye witness accounts the witnesses all focus on different aspects of the story. No two stories are the same even though they saw the same event. Personal backgrounds make what one focuses on different than the next person.

      If the Bible was perfect without a single flaw in numbers and such people wouldn't feel comfortable reading it because it wouldn't be similar to them. Humans are imperfect. God could had angels write the Bible but he chose to have humans because who can relate to a humans? Humans.

      I don't see the problem in calling Mary a young woman when she is a young woman.

      Why do you use he instead of someone's name? Do you not know their name? Why use a pronoun?

      I don't know what people who don't think the Bible is true want from it. I don't think if it were perfect and flawless that people would believe it more. It wouldn't matter. This idea that a single word change has someone not understanding or not believing or questioning is a tad odd.

      I just don't find it as reasonable to have a problem with it as you do...though I understand where you are coming from.

    • 3 years ago
  • rwylie
    • 0
      rwylie  
    • J_Jammer:

      Yes, she was a young woman. But if she was a virgin, which is the real point of the story, then they would have made sure to say so.

      If as you say the Bible was inspired by God, there is one huge flaw to be answered: Why is there not one single thing written in it which could not have been invented at the time it was written, in that there is no mention of anything which would indicate a 'divine' inspiration, like mention of our nearby planets (which we could not observe at the time the Bible was written), or electricity, or DNA. These would be quite tantalising evidence of divinity, but as it stands the Bible contains nothing beyond the intelligence of the people at the time.

    • 3 years ago
  • J_Jammer
    • 0
      J_Jammer [removed]  
    • J_Jammer:

      You're not looking at this with the idea that maybe you're wrong.

      You're looking at this with the idea that you're right.

      So coming up with what you're stating is not the purpose of the Bible. It was not created to convince the skeptics of God. It was created to show his love and how those that want to follow in his way the way in which to follow.

      Why do you allude to not caring as much to be convince as you do to find loop holes instead of outright saying it? Is one suppose to conclude that you are making yourself close minded just by the way you are wording your sentences?

      You would have me believe that a single word (that I don't know if you're telling the truth or not) makes you question a miracle you already don't believe in?

      If you truly care to see you'd see.

      The Bible stated that the Earth was round and hung upon nothing in Job way before Science came to such a conclusion and way before the Church agreed. They were not paying attention to what was there. They were using the Bible to their own detrimental needs.

      It talks about the Mountain goat and how people will not know where it gives birth. And to this day no one knows where it gives birth.

      It stated that the Middle East would never know peace. Unless you know of a time when there has been peace there.

      There are things that are similar to what you suggest, but there are not things that scream it because it's not about providing proof of his Existence. He's dealt with the likes of similar folk such as Pharaoh. He used Moses to speak to Pharaoh and ask for his people to go and do what? Leave and never come back?

      No. He simply asked for them to go out into the wilderness and pray to him. Simple. Pharaoh said no. Moses asked again. No again. The plagues start. No a lot. Then God changed it to he wanted his people to go free. Period. Pharaoh said no until the last plague the death of all firstborns.

      People state that the scripture says he let Pharaoh's heart become harden. As in he made it such, but that's not what the context entails. What it states is that God allowed his heart to harden as in he did not soften it or convince him through other means other than what Moses stated in his presence.

      As for cruelty of killing the firstborns of Egypt....it was Egypt that killed children of the Israelites. It is God's place to exact vengeance for vengeance is his and he reads the heart of men. Plus Pharaoh had ample time to consider and he saw massive amount of proof of who he was dealing with and still he denied it.

      That is why giving the proof you claim you'd need to believe doesn't mean you would and doesn't mean anyone would. If you don't believe now you wouldn't believe after getting all that. You have your own idea of what is going on and no amount of anything would make you state you were wrong unless you decide that you are willing to believe in the possibility. Otherwise you're heart is just as hard as Pharaohs and no amount of proof will alter it.

      He chased after them and saw the walls of water and he still denied God's existence. It's not a matter of proof. It's a matter of pride.

    • 3 years ago
  • rwylie
  • dadapapa
  • JanaPokana
    • 0
      JanaPokana  
    • Even though I am sure Fowler will have a difficult time in court, it is quite interesting what he is trying to do here. Since the term 'homosexual' was only 'invented' in the 19th Century, you can argue that it is inappropriate to use it in a bible translation. And in general, it is important to draw attention to the significant impact of translation when it comes to the way the bible is received. In addition, the editors seem to have no problem in editing out the word 'homosexual' in later editions, so obviously, editorial intervention plays a significant role as well. It just goes to show that the bible is not 'God's word', but just an unfortunately very powerful text that is open to continuous interpretation and, also, manipulation.

    • 3 years ago
  • J_Jammer
    • 0
      J_Jammer [removed]  
    • JanaPokana:

      No.

      You can ask the translators that do the hard work. The Bible does translate in areas to mean that homosexuality is a sin. Man lying with man means what to you?

      That they are taking a nap together?

      That's why languages of the past are translated to the now language so that people grasp it and are not allowed to slide off into a gray area because they feel the need to justify their behavior.

      You're right. No word for that back then. Doesn't mean they cannot describe it to mean the word they used.

      Do not allow your dislike for Religion and the Bible to guide your thinking into the murkiness of this entire ordeal. It would be sad that you'd slip on this slippery slop you so want to climb and make work.

    • 3 years ago
  • soleil10
  • Psychedelic
    • 0
      Psychedelic  
    • JanaPokana:

      I agree. There have always been gays, and they've always been feared. Even in biblical times. Its a shame the writers of the bible didn't have lsd. Although an article I read recently suggest Moses was on hallucinogenic cactus when he went up the mountain.

    • 3 years ago
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  • reneelikeshugs
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