Obama and McCain Debate

My precious Obama? I said I support him but no one supports anyone blindly. Because I support Obama you think I'm not independent? I see how you think and understand how this debate was tough for you. McCain and Obama have points I agree and disagree with.

You support ArcticSpirit? Well, OK. The first response she gave was a republican lifting to God and bash of the democratic candidate followed by a lousy "we are supposed to make up our minds from what we see piece" later on the page.
If you READ my response I clearly state it was a 2 sided debate that was done well. If you couldn't pick up the positions they had and where they differed, then it may be your fault not theirs.

Economy became an issue as the television stations and the host (not to mention 90% of people who called organizers) were the ones who made the change to spend time talking about oh...I don't know...the tanking of the stock market, increase in applications for unemployment, tanking of the largest banks, and home foreclosures that are putting our country in major harms way by the hour.

You got nothing out of this because you can't pay attention or don't know recent history.
1.) We were bombed on 9/11 by _________? Bin Laden who is where? In Pakistan and Afghanistan. Not Iraq.
2.) Why did they bomb us? Because of current US policies and the fact that we used his factions to hold off the Russians from over taking the Middle East oil fields in the Cold Wars and never upheld our bargain of support militarily or monetarily, while his people died. Trust me, he is no saint but we Americans always bitch about accountability except when it is our turn. Should he have responded to us that way? No, but when you won't talk to another group because you might disagree with them (and they have nothing to lose) then terrorism can and will arise.
3.) Why did we go to Iraq? Weapons, and what other excuse Bush gave. Alqaeda wasn't there until we went there and they wanted a piece of us. Of course our fight for democracy in Iraq has led to a theocratic (Muslim) government that favors the major religion in Iran. Iraq used to oppose Iran and now they sympathize. Big result currently unleashes a civil war between Sunni, Shea and the Kurds for control of land, due to the oil fields, just so they can survive. Great!
If you would have paid attention to his stand on the military you would have heard him say:
1.) Withdrawal of troops from Iraq in waves, not all at once.
2.) Refocus efforts on Taliban and Bin Laden who are gaining strength in the Northwestern part of Pakistan over the border by:
a.) first work with Afghans to see if they want to do the job; if they feel they can't then support them militarily or take the initiative ourself.
b.) we promised Pakistan help and money for this and then disappeared to Iraq (sound similar to another story above)
This decreases number of troops (1 and 2)
3.) General Petraeus even said the end of this conflict lies in the region it originated from....Afghanistan.

4.) Major discussion on the Georgia and Russia conflict and its relationship to Poland, Czech's, Ukraine and their relationship to Nato was discussed.

What damn debate were you watching? Foreign policy is about where you stand on foreign issues like war, trade, and nuclear proliferation. Both candidates talked about all of the above. I know there is some grand standing but you have to sift through it all.

The big picture here is that these 2 candidates have very different views on dealing with foreign policy and leaders.

What do you mean by flip-flop on the war?

They can't do a history review for you and then give an opinion. There isn't enough time and then you would still be board. They give an opinion, or their view, and hope you understand the history to know what they are saying.

Unbelievably, although I am a Obama supporter, you will notice I did not slam McCain. The reason is because I have an opinion of where I think the country should go based on history, voting records and candidates' visions. If you agree with Senator McCain's views then I have nothing but respect for you. If you have no real reason for why you back McCain (or Obama for that matter) then step out of the vote because you do not know what you are putting in office.

Take the candidates comments on both sides and then actually look into what they are talking about. Actually read on these issues. You will find these debates more interesting.

Nice of John to show up.

Interesting op-ed here given the wonderful write up you graciously blessed us with above.

I implore you, go back to school.

What?

Paying down debt.

Increasing manufacturing domestically.

Importance of judicious foreign policy.

Tax code.

Oversight/deregulation.

Government spending.

Immigration.

Supreme Court.

Civil/human rights.

Constitution.

AAAAAWWWWWW shucks. Why should any one agree with anyone on those issues or even at least negotiate. Screw this country anyway.

Small town America? .......Sounds more like Small Minded America.

he said "continental United States"

yes and the whole "trickle-down theory"

I've always thought that the way our economy is today is a direct result of Regan's fiasco of an overhaul. No president since has done a single thing to try and repair the deep damage that administration did. even though our economy got better during the Clinton years, the trend of rich getting richer and poor getting poorer still held true and does to this day. Thats one thing i like about Obama's economic policies - it might just start reversing the damage.

I've always said, even if there is just the slightest of chances, it's still a possibility.

I agree with what you are saying up until the point where you say Obama won it. I wish with all my heart that it was absolutly undoubtedly true, but unfortunately many many many voters don't see it that way and i think Obama won it in the eyes of forward thinking, future-looking, progressive thinkers, but those people are sadly not in the majority. it'll be a close race and i'm keeping my toes and fingers crossed for Obama

What McCain was trying to say was that now that we are IN Iraq, it's useless to bicker about why we started it.

Neither of these candidates had a part in the initial Iraq strategy, but McCain supported the surge at a time when it was unpopular to.

It doesn't matter why the war started as much as what we should do now.

CHEERS TO THAT! you are absolutly right!

If you think that sucks, Most Iraqi children can't read their own county's name and have never seen a map.

Who cares. Domestic policy first and respectable foreign policy that moves to the forefront as deemed necessary second.

if we have the means to knowledge (like we do), there's no reason we should embrace them (like we don't). knowing where the country with whom we're warring is should be a prerequisite for voting in this country. it makes sense that iraqi children have never seen a map, what with all of the infrastructure we've destroyed.

I don't think the uneducation in Iraq is due to our occupation, it's more due to the extremists blowing up schools and killing female teachers and students.

I don't even really understand what you mean by that nobamajon. How is addressing your opponent and your audience Asskissing? Remember what your teacher always taught you when giving the class a presentation? it should be something like this: Look up, Make eye contact and when debating another classmate directly: look at them and acknowledge their argument before you present your own.

its not asskissing - its how you hold a proper and respectful discussion.

Nobamajon, after being in the senate for awhile, McCain is the king of asskissing.....comes with the territory. Did you not see those incredible jaw muscles flare in the debate?

Now give me some props there....you now you saw that jaw clenching like he was trying hold back some prune juice or chitlins (can't be racist.....remember?). Well, maybe that remark was racist.........but fair and balanced?

In the beginning of the debate, I don't know if you recall, but Jim Leher requested that the candidates create more of a dialog, rather than a stale Q and A. In Senator Obama calling Senator Mcain "John", I saw it as him trying to pull him into a discussion, trying to reason with him. Whereas Mcain was very cold and kept saying 'What senator Obama doesn't understand,' at the beginning of each statement. It reminded me of conversations I often have with my father (who happens to be quit conservative and often times gets easily heated over a simple subject.)His favorite thing to say to me is 'It's difficult to understand,' and basically belittles my opinion. Fortunately I am able to get him to see past that by bringing up very logical and relevant points, which is what I thought Obama was attempting in the debate.

I will say, I think you bring up some very valid points, and I think we should all hold the candidates accountable for each and every aspect of their campaign.

Gee, arcticspirit, that was one of the most unbiased reviews I have ever read!!! That was so well done and I think.......uh....I think I just crapped some bull in my pants.

1.) These guys call each other by first name when discussing the issues that affect you and me on the senate floor. Obama has met with foreign leaders and amazingly can remember their names.

2.) No one appeared nervous or like someone got under their skin. They both did well to maintain poise.

3.) They corrected each other quite a bit and talking time was dead even. No one interrupted any one.

4.) I would love to know how your trip to fact check went. I'll bet it was about dead even there.

5.) If McCain could have put Obama away, he would have you moron. He went in to the debate 9 points down. He is not typically described as a gentleman by his cohorts.

I am no doubt an Obama supporter but you all just witnessed 2 great debaters with a wealth of knowledge and an uncanny sense of rhetoric that even Aristotle would have loved to include in his commentary.

Call this what it was. A great debate...... and drop the biases.

nobamajon,
i think it's awesome that so many conservatives are harping on obama for being too laid back and casual, like an average joe, while mccain picks sarah palin, your average hockey mom, for his VP. it's really wonderful that you think it's okay to have a hockey mom VP but not a personable politician for president.

Wayne, just because Palin is inexperienced doesn't make Obama any more experienced than he already is (which is not much). You really can't deny that he hasn't been around that long.

this is the last thing I am going to say to, or in regard to arcticspirit.

Are you apoplectic, or just plug stupid? If it is apoplexy, call 911 now.

So, you're saying that what someone "looks like" is what you base your vote on. Nice tactic. So was it Obama's suit, or his well groomed face or was it his tie that made you decide he looked "ghetto?"...oh wait, so you're one of those?
McCain looks as much like a gentleman as an old tortoise.

Thank you Joe for being unsophisticated and ignorant enough to voice what many of your party want to say and for using the closest word to the N word you can mutter and still be politically correct.

This country is a wonderful melting pot full of amazing people of all races doing amazing things everyday. But no matter how many great strides others make there is still room in America for the ignorant, underacheiver, average Joe.

Being from the Ghetto doesn't make you less of a human being no more than being a Navy Officer makes you a gentleman. (Tailhook ring a bell)

Ummm.... just so you know i grew up in what you would call a ghetto area, but you would never know it by looking at me or even listening to me speak.

just to give you an image: 5'5" White girl who dresses like a school teacher and probably has a larger vocabulary than you.

By the way: even if someone is from the ghetto it doesn't mean they are going to spend the rest of their life in prison and they probably know more about the way the good ol' US of A works than you do.

Sure, nobamajon, because you know that repubs would NEVER claim that one of their candidates is being attacked on gender or age!!!! Oops, did I inadvertently mention Palin/McCain? You weren't really thinking that....... were you? There you go thinkin' that racist thing again.

I'm disappointed in your commentary. I've seen your work. This is low. Somewhat funny (Aunt Esther-that's good). I can appreciate the humor.

Given your recent president and leader, who is a republican, and his past......need I say more. I wonder where in the ghetto seen he would be?

your perception of ghetto is severely flawed.

So Obama is just some dumb nigger, right? That's what you want to say so just fucking say it you coward.

Honestly, I thought their discussion was often boring and after listening to their responses I forgot what the question was in the first place, and Im pretty sure they did too. And even if their responses were compelling, whose to say they will follow through on their proposed plans? In general, I think the main thing I got from the debate is a better feeling for the type of person out two potential presidents are. Obama is a warm human being...in my opinion, he acknowledged McCain in a informal yet respectful manner. There are commercials highlighting the fact that Obama often said "I agree with McCain, McCain is right, etc.", but he is acknowledging McCains opinion before providing his own. I think if I met McCain he would blow me off as a young and clueless girl, whereas Obama would look me in the eye and at least pretend to listen and consider what I had to say. I guess its no secret who I'll be voting for...

Good assesment, i've been trying to pin down exactly what it is about Obama that i like and i think it is the fact that he is a gentleman. he's not a war monger but he seems to know when it is appropriate to use military force and he's just a general down-to-earth family man. this election should be a breeze for him. It has been shown that (if you put aside the corruption and string pulling) the reason Bush was able to take office was because people saw him as a normal, humble man with good (??) leadership qualities. The thing is, Obama is a liberal black man in a country of many conservative white folks. We'll see how this goes...

calling someone ghetto is not a valid point on anything political or not... it is a word that reeks racist overtones and it should not be used in describing someone of Obama's caliber. I am a republican and very conservative one at that. but i am voting for the brother because I feel his ideals and spirit is what this country needs. and calling a black man ghetto is racist. Look up the concept on intent and effect. you may not intend racism but the effect is all the same (think dumb ass)