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soleil10
What gays call marriage is not the same thing as traditional marriage, especially regarding fidelity.

While some same-sex relationships, especially among lesbians, are sexually exclusive, many male couples, including those in marriages, have arrangements with each other that allow for mutually agreed upon infidelity under certain circumstances.

Some couples will allow a partner to cheat while he is out of town, or as long as both partners are present, or - and I am not making this up - as long as the infidelity is on the couch and not the bed

Gay marriage would still harm the meaning of marriage in society if gay infidelity was private. However, many gay couples are quite open about their mutually approved "adultery."

Last summer, after I wrote an opinion piece about this problem in the San Francisco Chronicle, I received more than a dozen letters from gays and lesbians defending their right to define marriage as a non-exclusive relationship.

One of these letters was so brazen, it s worth quoting at length. Like the others, it was signed by name (Richard Dupler of Oakland, California):

I ve been with my partner 10.5 years... We have not been sexually exclusive, ever. The relationship has been open, and honest, from the start.

"We are getting married August 17, and I doubt seriously that the sexual part of our relationship will change. Just because we re calling it marriage, doesn t mean we have to conform to widespread ideals and beliefs about marriage, we only have to follow the law. What works for some likely doesn t work for others.

This freedom to marry, which we take very seriously, should also mean we are free to define that marriage the way we see fit.

I m not suggesting we punish the entire gay community for the non-monogamy of some of its members.
I m saying we shouldn t redefine marriage to include adultery by mutual consent - a very rare arrangement among heterosexuals, but something that barely fazes gays. Even gays and lesbians in monogamous relationships tend to see nothing wrong with consensual adultery, even when a couple has children.

Don t believe me? Ask some gay people you know what they think of marriages in which each partner is openly and publicly allowed sexual indiscretions as long as certain rules are followed. Then ask some straight people. I am confident you will find the same gulf in attitudes I have found.
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46 comments // Are Gay Marriages Monogamous ?

  • Commentor
    • 0
      Commentor  
    • Soleil10:
      This post is about who is using gay marriage to bring next their own demand for rights. Gay activists deny it but the facts are here
      --------------------------------------
      Commentor:
      Is it true?
      Can you absolutely know that it's true?
      How do you react, what happens, when you believe that thought?
      Who would you be without the thought?
      ---------------------------------------
      Soleil10:
      We have a 40 year track record of the so called "sexual revolution". The fruits are here for all to see. .........
      -------------------------------
      Commentor:
      Your answer makes no sense -----
      think about the answers and answer each of the questions!

      also who is the THEY using gay marriage to demand what rights? Polyamorus who want polygamy?

      So what if there is Marriage equity for all forms of *gamy

    • 3 years ago
  • RCS
    • 0
      RCS  
    • Soleil10 strikes again! This is just another narrow-minded, bigoted post meant to incite homophobia. Get a life already!

    • 3 years ago
  • Commentor
    • 0
      Commentor  
    • Image
    • lets try something.....

      "Are Gay Marriages Monogamous ?"
      maybe, maybe not, does it matter?

      How about you at least try to follow "The Work" about your feelings surrounding homosexual marriage Soleil10 ... I have started it for you but I suggest that it would be better if you did it yourself
      -----------------------------------------------------------------

      The Judge-Your-Neighbor Worksheet

      Fill in the blanks below, using short, simple sentences. Don’t censor yourself; don’t be wise or “spiritual.” Take this opportunity to express your negative feelings on paper.

      1. Who angers, irritates, saddens, or frustrates you, and why?
      I am angry at homosexuals because Gay marriage will take away the sanctity of my marriage and society will be destoried .

      2. How do you want them to change?
      What do you want them to do?
      I want them to Understand they are wrong.

      3. What is it that they should or shouldn't do, be, think, or feel? What advice could you offer?
      Homosexuals shouldn't want to be married because they don't know or honor what marriage is about.

      4. What do they need to do in order for you to be happy?
      I need homosexuals to stay out of my life and my bedroom.

      5. What do you think of them? Make a list.
      Homosexuals are
      without morals
      should just choose not to be homosexual
      disusting
      stupid
      just don't understand

      6. What is it that you don't want to experience with that person again?
      I don't ever want to see them be around them or have them bring up marriage ever again
      -----------------------------------------------------------------
      part 2
      ----------------------------------------------------------------
      for each question above
      1 Is it true?

      2 Can you absolutely know that it's true?

      3 How do you react, what happens, when you believe that thought?

      4 Who would you be without the thought?
      -------------------------------------------------------------

    • 3 years ago
  • khromadjo
  • khromadjo
  • Commentor
    • 0
      Commentor  
    • NO MONOGAMY is not being redefined by homosexual marriage.

      Since homosexual people are people more or less like any other group of people there are bound to be some
      that are polyamorus and that would like polygamy

    • 3 years ago
  • Commentor
  • tmfs
    • 0
      tmfs  
    • why aim this at the gay culture? Why not aim this at the thousands, perhaps millions of marriages that go through divorce. You claim marriage to being "sacred", you're wrong. America's perspective on marriage has become completely blurred, you can't blame the homosexual revolution for the loss of sacredness in marriages in our country. It's just plain out ignorant.

    • 3 years ago
  • soleil10
    • 0
      soleil10  
    • tmfs:

      I am not blaming gay marriage for the breakdown of the American family.

      I think Gay Marriage is one of the consequences.

      It is wrong to use the problem with divorce to justify gay marriage.

      Unfortunately, the same people behind the no fault divorce laws, the expansion of promiscuity,immorality, stds and the liberal lifestyle etc.. are the same ones who are supporting gay marriage.
      Thye have not taken any responisbility for the damage thay have cause but are using the damage to justify gay marriage.

      The same people who have resisted this decline in our morality are the one trying to protect marriage today.

      Look at history and the step by step descent to institutionalization of th porn lifestyle.

      This post is about who is using gay marriage to bring next their own demand for rights.

      Gay activists deny it but the facts are here

    • 3 years ago
  • FallenMorgan
    • 0
      FallenMorgan  
    • tmfs:

      So, soleil, what do you propose? Banning porn and divorce? Forcing public dress codes and a curfew? Maybe even ban or limit alcohol? Maybe make pre-maritial sex illegal?

      We make CHOICES and the government should allow us to make these choices.

    • 3 years ago
  • DeliaTheArtist
    • 0
      DeliaTheArtist  
    • I thought so. Sol, you constantly post homophobic stuff, then claim you are NOT homophobic. Everyone here has asked you to provide evidence for your claims, but you have none. This who argument and post is very simply bullshit and just another way to try and convince people that gay marriage is "bad."

      Eventually we will have to see that everyone, no matter your race, gender, sexual orientation, etc is a PERSON and deserves equal rights. Believers in god who want to twist their religion to prevent that from happening make me sick.

    • 3 years ago
  • Godtears
    • Godtears  
    • This comment was removed by its owner.
  • cantucwearebrothers
  • snapypea
    • 0
      snapypea  
    • i am close to three gay couples. they own businesses, have lovely homes and are quite stable, even normal. none of the three are swingers or sex-crazed couch doin-it types. i think your reaction to the san fran write-up is more a reaction to a different style of relationship: the open relationship. please try to separate open relationships from marriage unions between same-sex couples.

    • 3 years ago
  • mako2424
    • 0
      mako2424  
    • Even though you have exactly zero evidence to support the claim, by simply using the rationale that gay marriage shouldn't be allowed because its inherent infidelity undermines the institution of "marriage," then shouldn't Christians also be prohibited from the act since their divorce rates are embarrassingly high? Higher even, than that of atheists? ("Baptists Highest, Atheists lowest divorce rates." Associated Press. 12/30/99)

      Which begs the question, at what statistical point are you basing your argument? Should gay marriage be disallowed if it is shown to be 25% more likely to have an infidelity? What about 10%? 1%? And how is the decided upon threshhold anything but arbitrary?

      These are questions that I would think would need to be addressed before any weight was given to this cockamamie idea. However, without any statistical evidence, the assumption that gay marriages are prone to higher levels of cheaters is exactly that...an assumption...and destroys your entire premise.

    • 3 years ago
  • cantucwearebrothers
    • 0
      cantucwearebrothers  
    • mako2424:

      You're absolutely right mako2424.

      Soleil10 has repeatedly been provided with satistics and research that disprove his thought processes. He's not interested in reason.

      I love the throw back to the bible, btw. Whether it was intentional or not.

    • 3 years ago
  • Commentor
    • 0
      Commentor  
    • mako2424:

      OurG (oh your god) you quoted actual statistics mmm what will soleil10 do with that!

      Oh wait any points made with evidence and not emotions are out of bounds on the homosexual marriage debate.

    • 3 years ago
  • soleil10
    • 0
      soleil10  
    • The point the author makes is that in a traditional marriage, cheating is clearly called cheating, in a homosexual relation being monogamous can mean something else.

    • 3 years ago
  • Vierotchka
  • DeliaTheArtist
  • Brockie
  • cantucwearebrothers
    • 0
      cantucwearebrothers  
    • So apparently...if you step back and take a look at the whole picture...

      If what Soleil10 is trying to say here true...then gay marriage will NOT redefine straight marriage. It will fit into the parameters that are already established.

      People loving each other, wanting their love recognized AND having a high rate of infidelity and divorce.

      There...no discussion needed. Move along people.

    • 3 years ago
  • Brockie
    • 0
      Brockie  
    • Usually when I read stuff like this I just attribute it to the writer being a narrow minded homophobe, and I don't give it another thought. But this pod has opened my eyes to a whole new concept. It's like some sort of bazzar straight person marrage envy. It's like an adult acting like an inmature child saying my kind of marrage is better than your kind of marrage. na-na-na.

    • 3 years ago
  • mr_D_mcentyer
    • 0
      mr_D_mcentyer  
    • this artical is a joke, you obviously have some issues mate. why is it you only point out gay people and not hetros. and why the reason why we havent writen about gay marriges being monogamous is because there is no proof like surrveys questionairrs things like that, the reason being theres no need, its indivaul to the person wether there gay or not

    • 3 years ago
  • DeliaTheArtist
    • 0
      DeliaTheArtist  
    • Yes, same sex marriages are monogamous, Sol, just like heterosexual marriages are. What gives you reason to think they are not?
      Can someone actually give me EVIDENCE that a majority of gay marriages are non-monogamous?

    • 3 years ago
  • FallenMorgan
  • H3ADLINE
    • 0
      H3ADLINE  
    • I'm gay, happily married and monogamous. You're full of shit, soleil10, to suggest otherwise. Most of the other gay couples who I know are also monogamous and have no intention of sleeping around. You offer no proof for your claims, no studies or surveys. Just your moronic innuendo and personal anecdotes, which hardly pass for a persuasive argument.

    • 3 years ago
  • FallenMorgan
    • 0
      FallenMorgan  
    • Soleil, what we're saying is that targeting same-sex marriage as being full of "infidelity" is a bit hypocritical, because a lot of heterosexual couples engage in infidelity.

      Same-sex marriage is a step towards choice, the ability for two people to choose to do as they please as long as they cause nobody serious harm.

    • 3 years ago
  • UrbanGypsy
  • soleil10
    • 0
      soleil10  
    • So far not one person has written that gay marriages were monogamous.

      Mentioning that some hetero sexual people broke their vow of fidelity does not answer the question.

      All we hear is the demand for equality by redefining marriage, or the demand for benefits.

      We hear nothing about the issue of fidelity until death to one person.

      Attacking me or slandering me does not answer the question.

      Are same sex marriage just a step toward polyamory and the end of marriage ?

    • 3 years ago
  • Katanajon
  • soleil10
    • 0
      soleil10  
    • So far not one person has written that gay marriages were monogamous.

      Mentioning that some hetero sexual people broke their vow of fidelity does not answer the question.

      All we hear is the demand for equlality by redefining marriage, or the demand for benefits.

      We hear nothing about the issue of fidelity until death to one person.

      Attacking me or slandering me does not answer the question.

      Are same sex polyamorous ?

    • 3 years ago
  • mercat99
    • 0
      mercat99  
    • soleil10:

      Well then I'll say it. Gay relationships are monogamous. I'm gay and every relationship I've been in has been monogamous. I've never had to deal with the issue of another person coming into the fold. All of my gay friends who were able to get married, before the right was taken away from us, are in monogamous marriages.

      I do know that people, both straight and gay, have open relationships but that is not for me. You're making a generalization based on your opinion of gays. Maybe you should get to know some gay couples and ask them how they feel about monogamy and why. I bet you'd hear some very similar views that you would from straight couples.

    • 3 years ago
  • Vierotchka
    • 0
      Vierotchka  
    • soleil10:

      Gay marriages are as monogamous as heterosexual marriages, and as polyamorous as heterosexual marriages. Why are you so afraid of homosexual people? If you don't like gay marriages, marry someone of your opposite gender.

    • 3 years ago
  • unimatrix0
    • 0
      unimatrix0  
    • This is religious propaganda and has no bearing on gay marriage.

      It is an attempt to defame and smear homosexuals. It is ugly and speaks to the intolerant.

      In addition, the composition is confused and muddled. If there is a point it is not being made. It is rambling and slap dash. Sentence constuction is often confused and labored.

      The submission is inelegant and should be voted down. Current should not be bothered with such vulgar trash.

    • 3 years ago
  • spoonieday
    • 0
      spoonieday  
    • first, you are making broad generalizations that are very offensive. I just wanted to let you know in case you hadn't realized. Just because a person, or a few people, from a broad group engage in an activity does not mean they all do. Also, just because you don't like something or it isn't something that you would want to do doesn't mean it is necessarily wrong.

      Heterosexual couples also engage in open marriages, but more often one spouse just cheats on another and hopes not to get caught. Are you arguing that these people have more of a right to be married than people who would be honest about it?

      I am married and my marriage is not effected by anyone else's marriage, it is between me and my spouse. If my married friend cheats on his wife, it does not somehow change my marriage, so what difference would it make if he was cheating on his husband instead? All the people who are married in this world could do all kinds of bad things and it wouldn't change my relationship with my husband.

      the argument that gay marriage hurts the institution of marriage is silly because marriage is not an institution- nor can it really be spoken of as one thing. marriages have taken many different forms across the span of human history and continue to be very different today across the globe and within individual societies. how one form could be argued as superior to the others I don't understand. People adapt to their circumstances and their traditions adapt with them. no one wants to take marriage away from heterosexual couples or keep anything from them, so what's the problem?

    • 3 years ago
  • RCS
  • jh64487
    • 0
      jh64487  
    • hahaha, soleil, this is the second ridiculous article you've posted recently. (and by that i mean biased, dumb, and mean).

      a) straight couples have swingers too

      b) this is a poorly written op-ed piece, not some sort of ground breaking sociological study

      c) hehehe, it's not like straight people have it together do they? 1 out of every 2?? focus on yourself instead dude

    • 3 years ago
  • DeliaTheArtist
    • 0
      DeliaTheArtist  
    • This article is way biased.

      Where's the evidence that gay people are less monogamous than straight people?Just because this guy says so? I call bullshit. Give me some real proof before you claim this as a fact and base an entire argument on it!

      More importantly, what does ANYONE's religious beliefs have to do with gay marriage? Why should the "Jewish Case", as this article claims to be, the "Christian Case" or any other organized religion's "case" dictate the legal system? Other people's marriages are not your business.

    • 3 years ago
  • Katanajon
  • DeliaTheArtist
  • mercat99
    • 0
      mercat99  
    • DeliaTheArtist:

      I'm with Delia here. You can't just say there's evidence and not present any. Give comparative statistics or something more than "there is a lot of evidence".

      And if there ARE so many open relationships in the gay community, don't you think it has something to do with the fact we've never been given the right to marry?

      Besides, gays are fighting for LEGAL recognition of marriage. How does sexual behavior come in to play with that?

    • 3 years ago
  • Katanajon
    • 0
      Katanajon  
    • DeliaTheArtist:

      I am sure their are monogamous ones, don't put words in my mouth. I have no evidence, just, I used to be active in our aids community and knew a lot of homosexual couples, all I know is what they told me. So it is hear say really. Maybe nowadays their more monogamous.

    • 3 years ago
  • DeliaTheArtist
  • FallenMorgan
  • cantucwearebrothers
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