Iran

I never thought Iran would actually develop a nuclear bomb, but gullible Americans actually bought into the fear-mongering. Sadly, so did a lot of Europeans.
Thanks to Fareed Zacharia we're finally getting exposed to a reasonable assessment.

agian vierotchka I am glad you can proof read. This post I have slowed down my typing so you would not get hung up on spelling ,sentence fomation or grammar .apparently this subject means alot more to you than it does to me before I leave I would like you to know that the only thing I felt passionately about was being called a racist.I pride my self on not judging people.I do have more than some knowledge on iran and israel .I truly only meant that there will always be war where there is religious hate(if there is no democracy to rein it in).I also said the average American can do nothing about it .when I told you to check with an historian I meant check to look at every other country that has had similiar struggles with religion and state and where iran is on that time line

what I am saying is no separation religion and state you have war .how long has there been war in the middle east?that is not inaccurate .that is as simple as it gets .a lack of democracy translates to war agian simple.Everyones emotions on this subject complicated .If someone canot separate thier emotions from a subject they can not have a nonbiased opinion .Since I have no emotions vested in this subject (past sadness)I'm hardly racist

everyone I need to announce that I am a bad typist and because of that sometimes my spelling misses it's mark .even though this occurs sometimes ,my point is most of the time still valid

vierotchka first my comment was not hate filled it was an assesment of the reality of historically where these countries are at in thier developement .ask any historian you trust.you see it as hate becuase you are emotionaly involved. secondly I am sure that Iran and israels' government has sophisticated weapons thier people do not.I do not hate any one

In Response to message above:
"Israel's request is simply..

STOP FUCKING KILLING JEWS..why cant they do that???

GodsnLiberals"

=========================
My RESPONSE:

i will type up part of John Pilger's book: FREEDOM NEXT TIME.....Chapter 2. pages 111,112 and 113 in the paperback edition.
Here is a snippet....it will answer your question:

Both Begin and Shamir went on to lead the Likud Party and become Prime Minister. In 1982, Begin launched a bloody invasion of Lebanon, which resulted in the deaths of eighteen thousand people., mostly Palestinian refugees. Of the assault on civilians, including the continuous bombing of Beruit and the saturation bombing of all Palestinian refugee camps in southern Lebanon, Begin said, ‘Not for one moment would I have any doubts that the civilian population deserves punishment.’ He described Palestinians as ‘two-legged beasts’. As for the massacre in the Sabra and Chatila camps in Beruit, for which the Israelis were held responsible, Begin dismissed this shame as the anti – Semitism of ‘goyim,’ a pejorative term for gentiles.
The most famous ‘dissident’ is Ariel Sharon, Prime Minister of Israel from March 2001 until his political career was ended by a stroke in January 2006.

One more thing just because I mentioned crude tools of war does not mean I believe the general population is crude and uneducated.I was making a general point of their state of being right now.that also includes Israel.Just because a country is behind in the democracy time line does not mean their citizens are unintelligent. work in progress

the day i see AMERICAN STYLE liberal lifestyle being tolerated in Iran would I agree with Fareed Zakaria

If iran's nuclear program is not designed to built a weapon then why the secrecy??? why not bring in the brightest minds in this planet to help iran "build that power source"..

the proof is everywhere..where is your proof Fareed Zakaria

Based on my earlier post, you know where I stand on the issue, but I have a question regarding Hamas.

I' ve heard various hand-waving about the way in which Hamas conducts its fighting against Israel, namely within the occupied territories, in which schools, residential buildings and hospitals are often booby-trapped with controlled explosives while Palestinian civilians are still inside, so when IDF soldiers enter into building x containing non-combatants it is destroyed by Hamas detonating the explosives.

I know that the scenario in which circumstances have placed Hamas is desperate, but if this is true they can surely avoid their own human rights violations by using civilians as bait.

Highr0ller I was not insulting you I am not saying that there is not educated people or victims in the middle east I am saying that the populous has resorted to violence to solve problems and spread religion not a wholley uncommon phenomanon around the world .That is why there is a lack of interest by the common person .If you look at life with a broader perspective you would not pick sides .It usually becomes an argument of land and beliefs .agian a lesson other countries learned quicker separation of religion and state.It only becomes complicated when you look at the individual problem and try to solve it.Does alot of horrific acts happen on both sides absolutely .I assure you that even without israel there would be wars

I do not view the people of Iran, or their rulers, as threats to national security.
What little I know of Iran is that...the wealth of the nation lies in its people.
The people are progressive, well educated and intelligent. They are ready and able to enter into the new world that is unfolding before our eyes.

are there any liberals, agitators, activitists or homosexuals ???

continued
Israel also willfully obstructed humanitarian personal leaving the poor, injured, and others without basic food, medical, and other essential services - crimes of war and against humanity under international law. Also, after hostilities ceased, the IDF continues obstructing humanitarian aid by maintaining its siege and restricting the work of civil society and human rights organizations.

HRC states that for Gaza and its population to revive, "all of (its) entry points must be opened to ensure freedom of movement for all, the free inflow of industrial and agricultural inputs and cash and the export of products" to buyers outside the Territory. Also that urgently needed fuel, construction materials, spare parts, and other essential supplies and services be allowed to be received normally.

Further, recovery depends on Gazans having income-generating work, including inside Israel and the West Bank as available, and access to education at all levels at home and abroad. The many thousands of injured, homeless, and displaced require special attention and aid, so far not forthcoming because Israel won't allow it and international leaders are silently complicit.

Besides the above-listed needs, HRC stresses that "to improve the lives of (Gazans) living in poverty, psychosocial support....is urgently needed," especially for children who've been severely traumatized by months of deprivation and conflict. "The rights of the victims of human rights violations to have access to remedy and reparations must also be respected.

Adequate Housing As Part of An Acceptable Standard of Living........................

Response to last comment by Sue 4e3

please Sue, don't insult all the people in the Middle East...or me. The Middle East is populated by wonderful kind people, and the Palestinians are very cultured and educated.
Israel is the cancer there....like a wound seeping.
Watch what they do. Expansion by force. Ethnic cleansing. Killing babies, young children, women and men. Do you know how they were given Arab land by an Empire who occupied it by force? Did you see the Israeli war in Lebanon? Did you see the war this year in Gaza?
Read John Pilger.......FREEDOM NEXT TIME.
go to ChapterTwo.."the last taboo."..............and you'll be sick in your stomach reading the results of the killings.
In fact I will type it up and post it in a couple of weeks....everyone should know the details of what happened in Lebanon.

Please........either your a Jew or badly misinformed.

Such a comment is very irratating,

I don't know who I like more. Iraqi or Iranian.

I think alot of peole in the US do read history and see it as clearly as it can be seen and what I said earlier still holds true.If the middle east did not have eachother to be at perpetual war with .who would they be trying to war with than .they are following a natural evolution of country and religion that almost every other country and religion already has.in some cases they are just a few thousand years behind every one else (except scientology oops sorry they do not have thier own country ) but you get the point .If you look real close you get to see all the little bloody squabbles that come from the forementioned problem and it is in this place that all the humanitarians run.these countries hate americans so much because we do not go out in whole village wars with rocks ,clubs , home made bombs , and any other cheap method of death every time we have a problem.and, in the event that one of us does go nuts we do not give it a holy name and call it OK .It's not that I do not have sympathy for those innocents who get caught in the middle .but thier is very little realistically that can be done about that as an individual any way .Here is where the complacency comes from americans (we know, what are you going to do about it)

Read history!! and listen to other world radio. Americans can get a whole new view. The 10 o'clock news is for couch potatos. They don't want to know anything any way.

It has always seemed to me you need your opposite what would one do without the other .push and pull ,give and take, good and evil .Israel is the opposite to Iran .that is why there is no resolve .you can not even try to discuss one without the other.there are haters on all sides.where would the balance be if not.It may sound crazy but it is true .

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I read The Israel Lobby a year ago just because I like Mearsheimer's other works, and it is an extremely concise analysis of lobby and its effects on the U.S and the middle east. The authors support their claims well and argue within the context of the American political system very well.

The recent upturn of anti-Iranian nuclear program rhetoric in Israel/U.S is a useful way of deflecting the world's decreasing tolerance of Israeli expansionism, with Israel even trying to play a power politic card by refusing to resolve the Palestinian issue until the Iranian issue is solved. Seems like American diplomacy/mediation will play a major role, coming to an agreement with both Iran and Israel through our ability to apply considerable international pressure. Hopefully we don't screw it up. :P

Thanks highroller for posting on this topic consistently, as this new round of mid-eastern diplomatic efforts will undoubtedly be filled with media propaghanda. Conventional wisdom in the U.S. needs to be closer to the real happenings.

A lot to answer for, to bad no one in a position of power has the balls to ask the questions

I agree.

AIPAC has a lot to answer for.

Part of the problem is that a vast majority of people learn from the 10 oclock news. When the news is controlled by........the jews........it's hard for them to learn the truth. And even when it is showed to them, they now have been taught by the MSM for so long that israhell is good, Middle East is bad, that they have a hard time dealing with the truth, or accepting it.

I lived in Iran in the last years of the Shah. I know the area well.
Loads of Propaganda and Israel is desperate to be the only military power in the region.

people just never took the time to learn, about iran or israel or jordan or anyone. they made their choices without thought or intelligence and stuck with it as they stick with their faith.

sigh. thanks for sharing, good post.

continued:

Iranians aren't suicidal. In an interview last week, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu described the Iranian regime as "a messianic, apocalyptic cult." In fact, Iran has tended to behave in a shrewd, calculating manner, advancing its interests when possible, retreating when necessary. The Iranians allied with the United States and against the Taliban in 2001, assisting in the creation of the Karzai government. They worked against the United States in Iraq, where they feared the creation of a pro-U.S. puppet on their border. Earlier this year, during the Gaza war, Israel warned Hizbullah not to launch rockets against it, and there is much evidence that Iran played a role in reining in their proxies. Iran's ruling elite is obsessed with gathering wealth and maintaining power. The argument made by those—including many Israelis for coercive sanctions against Iran is that many in the regime have been squirreling away money into bank accounts in Dubai and Switzerland for their children and grandchildren. These are not actions associated with people who believe that the world is going to end soon.