Republicans and Democrats Are Both Terrible For Health Care / lp.org

Government-run health care is crazy no matter how you re-write the proposal.

You also talk about the inefficiencies of government regulation. Though I grant that the FDA and other bodies are controlled by corporations this is the problem not the ideas of them.

Without them you get corporate advertising lies and no public information (as was the case in cigarette companies).

The fact is that corporations are always going to try and over-represent their products, and cut costs at the expense of the environment. Without government intervention the wages are effected by a class struggle in which the persons who in the large majority of cases were born into capital, have all the power.

For those of us who aren't trying to ignore science (like global warming) or that every living thing is in decline, for those of us who acknowledge the simple fact that the planet has boundaries that we cannot consume beyond, we realize that consumption needs to be regulated in order for it to be sustainable. Without a tax that raises the price of polluting businesses will polute if it's cheaper. Without restrictions on getting drugs certified businesses will make shit up. Eventually the consumer might find out, but eventually were dead.

I know it's nice to have the same answer to everything (more free markets), but the real world is greyer then that.

its simple a goverment ran buy the corporations for the corporations.

From your article:

There's only one party that really opposes government health care, and that's the Libertarian Party. We've always been against it, and we'll always be against it. But that doesn't mean we want to force your health care into the hands of big insurance companies or big pharmaceutical companies, or subject it to the monopolizing effects of today's licensing laws.

As our platform states, "We favor restoring and reviving a free market health care system."

You are the party in favor of private insurance and corporate run everything every bit as much as the Republicans. And in the face of massive corporate failures, predictably, you blame the government. The Libertarian party is just a branch of the Republican party, and both are the flashiest, most sequined, cadillac driving, pink and fur clad pimps for our country to be slaves to a monopoly ridden corporate America. Your party is a lie, and if you call yourself a Libertarian, you are an idiot.

Democrats are good; Republicans are bad; libertarians are irrelevant.

i love this picture

The mandatory healthcare clause paired with minimum coverage requirements in H.R. 3200 is used as a cost saving mechanism, which scares me to death. They are taking away our freedom of choice which is exactly the same as making same sex marriages illegal. Or making pot Illegal. Are they going to make unhealthy foods illegal? Are they going to start telling us how many kids we can have? Whats the point of security if we end up sacrificing all of our freedoms??

Ozzykozzy2

How is the US health care system in any reasonable way a free market system. It is one the most regulated sectors of our society with the government paying almost half of every dollar spent on health care. You want true health care reform then eliminate the following problems don't add to the third party payer problem and add the systemic inefficiencies of big government.

The medical industrial complex has a monopoly and artificial limits the supply of health care professionals. In fact a couple of decades ago they lobbied congress to reduce the supply of doctors by 10% to insure future salaries and many schools continue to turn down applicant with perfect GPAs and limit class sizes. The FDA decides what drugs pass after an incredibly inefficient drug trial process, far better statistical approaches are available, that limits entry to those that can afford 100s of millions if not billions to pass new drugs. The FDA is also corrupt many of its members have been successfully convicted of taking bribes from big agro and big pharma for special privileges. The government gave special privileges to blue cross and blue shield, that were created by the medical community to insure high prices, forcing insurance companies to provide coverage for non catastrophic medical events. The government limited pay during WWII so companies compensated employees with more benefits. The government gave health benefits tax exempt status encouraging employers to give a disproportionate amount of compensation in health benefits. This gave a tremendous amount of power to the health insurance companies, created the third party payer problem essentially eliminating much of the pricing mechanisms necessary for a free market system. You don't care how much something costs that you aren't paying for it, insurance pays, and doctors don't care about quality and efficiency because their pay isn't dependent on you, it's dependent on insurance. Government then placed limits on the insurance companies so they couldn't operate across state lines and placed some 2900 mandates on policies in different states. Mandates are universal additions to all insurance in a state and include such universal additions as nutritionists, drug counseling, yoga instructors, personal trainers and such inappropriate options as prenatal care for men or AAA for nonalcoholics. These mandates account for almost 50% of insurance costs in some states. Then their is Medicaid and Medicare that when included with state and local government medical spending pay for almost 50% of all health care costs. Since when the government pays it sets prices below the market doctors are forced to pass these added expenses onto private insurance companies.

Just do what I do don't pay your hospital bill. What can they do? Repo there work?

Libertarians have a simple understanding of microeconomics, and simply ignore anything that falls outside their world view. The US private sytem is the least efficient in the world, and the problem with the bill is that it is not allowing for a single payer system.

A good comparison of healthcare systems is given by the Organization of Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD), which looks at a range of economically developed democracies. It recognized that the U.S. spends more than any country in the world (US$6,102 in 2004, now US$7,290) per person on healthcare, over double the average of the other OECD countries (US$2,438). The U.S. spends 15.3 per cent of it’s GDP on healthcare, compared to an average of 8.6 per cent, more per person on healthcare than the Canadian government. (quoted from my article http://www.themanitoban.com/articles/22472)

Please read the actual report http://assets.opencrs.com/rpts/RL34175_20070917.pdf

The fact is that the free markets aren't competitive where the start up costs are high enough that you end up with very little competition and so private monopolists charge whatever they want. In these industries including healthcare its often much more efficient to have the government step in. (I live in Manitoba where our single provider government run electricity is far cheaper than anywhere else in Canada, not to mention our healthcare cost are under half that of the US while our wait times are similar, and our care is better)

Libertarians need to get past their simple ideology and start looking at reality. This involves studying which is actually more efficient rather than automatically saying private markets are the best. Yes the democrats and republicans suck on health but it is because neither is offering a real public option or a government single payer system which history shows (for those who are interested in the real world and not defending their ideology) that governments in this case are more efficient.

Ron Paul should stick to foreign policy.

lol
libertarians are exactly what we need.

Well, republicans are bad for health care because they are a bunch of propaganda whores and power sluts. They'll do and say anything, regardless of what americans want, to prevent the dems from succeeding.

Meanwhile, the dems can't agree on anything. Some refuse to vote for a bill with a public option, others refuse to vote for a bill without one. Hopefully they can see past it all and produce a bill that accomplishes the goals the american people want: quality affordable health care for all.

We need to fight for transparency and accountability in government. It has been allowed to only serve itself and the interests of greed.

Gee, everyone of your statements are right on, far out and my exact feelings. (And my husband keeps telling me all those people on current are 20 year olds still living at home and don't give a rats ass about paying taxes as long as they think they're gettin' something for free!) I'M NOT ALONE!

The only thing worse than being dependent on doctors, big pharma and insurance companies to obtain healthcare would be, in my opinion, dependence on Democrats and Republicans.

How can anyone actually believe that Congress will improve the state of our nation's health care industry? They can't fight a war. They can't balance a budget. They can't even deliver on the promises they've already made.

I, for one, will not support any Congressional measure on health care reform. Nor will I pay one cent into any system they do create.

If we complain, we are terrorists or crazed people. THEY don't realize this is the first time in my life I have been so very disgusted with our representatives. Bush included! Label me a terrorist but I am FED UP!!

they don't get it!!! Or rather someone they work for MORE than they do us want it!!! Tort reform?? Oh i forgot the LAWYERS don't want that,,,AARP they want it so they can sell more secondary insurance, I could go on,,,I can't wait to vote again is all I can say without getting so angry I want to give me heartburn or something,,,

"We the people..." do NOT want "socialism lite". Nor do we want our tax $$$ going to BAILED-OUT CORPORATIONS and their "bonus program" to (dis)respective employees/CEO's. REAL "health care reform" addresses the ANTI-TRUST provisions and TORT REFORM!!!

Right!
The government, period, is terrible for health care.
That goes for municipal, state and federal government.
For that matter, government in the past 47 years has shown itself to be terrible for energy, education, jobs, housing, food and just about anything else people using their common sense can do for themselves.
We have reached the time where we must tell our government no thank-you, I will take my money back.