Nobody is condoning death and subjection any more than a time table for withdraw is waving a white flag to the terrorists. It's hyperbolic posts like these from the lunatic fringe on both sides of this debate that widen the divide this country and make any actual discussion of the issues impossible.

What system do you believe I'm defending?

You understand that there are people in this country who have a different point of view than you, don't you? Those people vote. In fact their voting record is a whole hell of a lot better than your side. So when people in the middle, like myself, are accused of being giddy about the murder of children or it's glibly suggested that we like death and subjection...well forgive me if I think that might not be such a great way to make any progress. If you do, by all means, keep on insulting us. And when the republicans are back in power you can just scratch your head and wonder what happened. But hey, we'll still have your pithy comments to read. Maybe we'll all look back and fondly remember the zingers you delivered when President Palin has the troops marching into Tehran.

War sucks. On that we can agree. And if I had a magic wand...I'd wear myself out waving it. But until I do, you think it might be possible for one second to consider that maybe shitting all over people who don't really think that differently than you do might not be the best way to go about finding a solution to this problem? I've read Zinn and Chomsky, but I LIVE in a red state. Half the people I know believe Obama is a secret Muslim and that history will prove George Bush was right. And I KNOW that the louder you call them child murders the louder they will call you terrorists, communists and worse. And we will make no progress at all.

All the self self-righteous certitude in the world won't change that.

"You seem to operate inside the duopole dem/repug & corpo supremacist narrative.
I reject it for as Chomsky explains…"

Yes...because I "operate" in the real world. See, it doesn't seem to matter what you and Chomsky reject or don't...because the two party system is the system we have and there is no realistic change in sight. Short of playing spoiler, no third party is even remotely viable. And as far as the spoiler role goes...how'd that work out for us in 2000? Wonder what would happened if those Nader votes in FLA had gone to Gore. I guess we'll never know, huh? I know it sucks when reality comes crashing in. And with all due respect...a handful of Frank Zappa and Oscar Wilde quotes aren't going to change any of these facts.

And I'm sorry about that.

But when you have a minute, I love for you to explain to me how suggesting that we're giddy at the thought of children being murdered is any way humanist.

Best of luck and Cherio to you.

I agree that "big media" doesn't tell the whole story, who ever said it does? And I know it appeals to your ego to think that you're better informed than everybody else, but just saying something doesn't make it true. Random blog links and unattributed videos aside, the fact that you think Nader was merely a scapegoat shows just what a fantasy land you're living in (he had 97,000 votes...Bush "won" by 500). I don't doubt that the GOP purged voter logs and overall played dirty, but to suggest that Nader's votes didn't have something do with the Gore's loss simply defies logic. And your obfuscation on this proves my larger point. As does your last comment:

"But what if the super-rich people like Warren Buffet and George Soros and Ted Turner all came together to create a better society where the wealthy actually did their part to help the rest of the country?"

Yes, and what if cars ran on fairy dust and Santa Claus gave us all free health care? If you want to live in a fantasy world, that's your business. And if you want to "associate" people with "child chewing", then that's your business too. But the fact that you do AND call yourself a humanist also shows how out of touch you are.

I guess you'd have a pretty good point if I'd ever called you Anti-American. But here in the real world, that never happened.

And I've looked at mtwsfh before...it's an impressive but unattributed catalog of America's misdeeds and mistakes. It's hardly without bias and it conveniently ignores anything good this country has ever done. The blogs agenda and lack of fairness is crystal clear and therefore it's suspect. Your dependence on this site as some kind of font of all truth again proves my point and contradicts yours.

Best of luck to you.

LOL yeah call it preemptive rhetoric ;)

I see that site but as a counter balance to the Mindfuck Inc. intellectual slaughterhouse feast of big media... but I have enough friends with degrees in history to know it is factually accurate and that if the general public was made aware of these facts, their opinion of our darling corpo-supremacists so-called elite & ruling class would not be as forgiving ;)

Live long & prosper ;)

I don't doubt that some of it is true. But if you have historian friends with proof, then why aren't they shouting it from the rooftops...and if they are, then why isn't anyone listening?

See, this goes back to my original point. If you only focus on the mistakes the country has made...it you only call people names and accuse them of being complicit in murder and worse, taking pleasure in it...then you shouldn't be surprised when they look at you like you're a nut and dismiss everything you're saying as hyperbolic propaganda. Until you can learn to accept that maybe, just maybe, you don't have all the answers and learn to talk with people instead of at them, then you'll continue to contribute to the problem and not the solution.

But hey...that's just my two cents. I wish you luck.

Again, stop shooting the messenger & focus on facts, historical facts, they speak for themselves ;)

Any master degree in history will confirm the american empire narrative.
New info from whistle blowers such as John Perkins or Joe Stiglitz are but updated confirmations of what is already known.

You can still watch it in real time with the heroin war in Afghanistan or the banana war in Honduras... Empire building is indeed a bloody fuckin' mess !

Nothing new under the sun though ;)

"They have plundered the world, stripping naked the land in their hunger... they are driven by greed, if their enemy be rich; by ambition, if poor... They ravage, they slaughter, they seize by false pretenses, and all of this they hail as the construction of empire. And when in their wake nothing remains but a desert, they call that peace." – Tacitus / Roman historian

i was waiting for this "guy" to chime in

Glad to be of service ;)

It is the duty of every citizen according to his best capacities to give validity to his convictions in political affairs - Albert Einstein

Italy -1000
Britain - 500

Some other nations, but no #s yet.

Czech Republic
Slovenia
Georgia
Poland
Germany (once their new parliament starts January 28th)

Just like before this President.