Community | December 12, 2009 | 57 comments

Atheists at Christmas

source: http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5i7tADnxuR79MJPcf7h0C8jxGSMGQD9CG23P80

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DeliaTheArtist
"Christmas is a tough time of year for an atheist.

"All the planned activities at this time of year revolve around the church," said O'Neill, a retiree and an atheist for decades.

O'Neill sought an escape this week, joining a group of her fellow nonbelievers for a weekly "Atheist Happy Hour" at a suburban Mexican restaurant. The group, Atheists for Human Rights, is active year-round but takes it up a notch this time of year with a Winter Solstice party, a charity drive and good attendance for the weekly gathering at Ol' Mexico.

For one thing, it's a chance to share coping techniques during this most religious time of year. They range from the simple, like warning about certain stores that blare religious Christmas songs, to tougher tasks like how to avoid certain topics with certain family members. These atheists describe adjusting some customs to make them their own, like Nancy Ruhland, a pharmacist who sends out Christmas cards to friends and loved ones — but makes sure to find ones without a Christian message or subtext.

A number of the atheists who have issues with Christmas said their feelings come in part from years of discrimination.

Larsen, a mechanic, said his ex-wife suggested his atheism was a character flaw in court filings during a contentious divorce with the custody of their children in dispute (he lost custody). Another man at the Atheist Happy Hour declined to reveal his last name, saying his employer is a conservative Catholic who would not tolerate a committed atheist on the payroll.

Still, most participate to some degree in Christmas celebrations, particularly those from Christian families. Larsen said he and Woelfel would join dozens of his relatives for a Christmas brunch at his parents' house on Dec. 24. But he would likely stay behind when most head to church afterward.

"It's the biggest family event of the year, and for me it's about seeing the family," said Larsen, an auto mechanic. "It's about taking the good and leaving the bad."



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57 comments // Atheists at Christmas

  • Kylsport
    • 0
      Kylsport  

    • It must be tough for athiest, I assume, because the Christmas spirit is infectious and as athiest, we want to make sure that we are not enjoying the season because then, we may realize that we are not thinking for ourselves, but going with the flow. No, we must resist and show adversity to anything positive, to refrain from appearing Christ-like, because in truth, that is who we ultimately despise. You don't see us bashing Islam, because we have seen what they have done in Europe (i.e. France riot, Danish cartoons, et.al.) and find it easier to ridicule Christians and demonstrate a lack of human respect for these swine, because we all know that they "will turn the other cheek". So I encourage you to continue to bash Christmas, as we know our "just" reward awaits us.

    • 2 years ago
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    • Kylsport:

      This is ridiculous pal. Everyone I know who doesn't believe in Jesus, doesn't believe in full honesty.

      They have all asked themselves, maybe after an intense involvement as honest as any involvement of any Christian who ever lived - and have come to the honest decision that it just is not real.
      That's the whole thing about religion, each of us must face what we actually think. It is our very lives and what we will do or what we will have, that is at stake.

      That is why to choose, yes, you believe, or to decide, no, you do not believe it.

      So save the cheap shots - they aren't respectful of any involved, including yourself.

      Honest.

    • 2 years ago
  • Kylsport
    • 0
      Kylsport  
    • Kylsport:

      Hahahaha...I am glad at least someone saw through the sarcasm I used in my post. You know how hard it is to use sarcasm on these posts. Thanks for posting and Merry Christmas, bro!

    • 2 years ago
  • 02
  • 02
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      02  

    • I want Saturnalia again. We'd have all the lights and glistening snow. -Without all the cheezy stuff.

    • 2 years ago
  • think_free
  • jubal
  • ryan8566
  • Lurkistan
  • 02
  • DeliaTheArtist
  • cccocanicola
  • 02
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    • cccocanicola:

      This is the old saying, never discuss religion, politics or money.

      You can meet entirely nice people who, once any of these are raised, become little petulant kids.
      With money, I've seen a full man become the greedy little boy, they never got over.

      Perhaps religion is an area of life, like a little boy's greed, that waits to be grown out of.

    • 2 years ago
  • jadewuzlyke
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      jadewuzlyke  

    • I don't know. Maybe if my family was religious, it would suck. But I absolutely love Christmas, and I'm Atheist. I even used to work at a Christian store a little while ago, spending two Christmases there. They play religious music (not just around the holidays), but there were no words, just instrumentals, so I never even knew it was religious music. The only thing about it was during Christmas, it was annoying getting religious cards from work or coworkers...though the thought was nice. And it was kinda annoying when customers would be like "Have a blessed day," though again the thought is nice.

    • 2 years ago
  • sugarlilly
    • 0
      sugarlilly  

    • christmas is so far removed from anything spiritual in my opinion. its about consumerism and capitalism and keeping up with the latest what-ever-the-fuck we all can't live without. i see christmas as a time to see my whole family all at once. nothing religious, nothing gifts. family & food. a holiday that is SO incredibly far from the religion its supposed to project, should encourage atheists. all these christians believe one thing (supposedly) then their holiday reflects none of it. hypocrisy like this wains numbers and therefore the power religion could have. this is a good thing for atheists.

    • 2 years ago
  • desertcat
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      desertcat  

    • Christmas is not a hard time for atheists. Christmas is not Jesus's last name it is Greek for savior. Buddha, Mithra, Apollo, Zeus etc were called Christ. The tree is welcomed it comes to us from the Germans and their god Wooten. The yule log, mistletoe, holly the Scandinavians. The wise men were priests of Zoroastrian and were looking for the savior Mithras as his birthday is around the winter solstice and celebrated on December 25th. Gift giving to the poor celebrating the season with food and cards comes to us from England. Santa, Frosty, Rudolph comes from the US. Manager with the animals, nope managers were kept in order by their owners as travelers would use them when filled up. Shepherds added to go along with the Christmas carol. Slaughter of the Innocent by Herod, historians can not agree on the year Christ born but they do agree that Herod was dead and the Romans would never allow him to kill those babies. He ruled as king only with their permission.

      In reality Christmas is a hard time for Christians as all their traditions, all their beliefs set around one day are from pagan stories, pagan gods and traditions set in various countries. During the winter solstice the farmer would give thanks to Gaia and other gods for the farming season and leave baskets of food behind for the poor.

      So go ahead and wish someone a Merry Christmas all it is is honoring all the various gods and that makes it politically correct.

      PS: forgot the star, forget it never happen. the ancients would of recorded it as they did with anything unusual in the sky.

    • 2 years ago
  • ibrake4rappers13
  • 02
  • Lurkistan
  • CalPal
  • 02
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      02  

    • Why not "get laid day" - it wouldn't be too many years before we could all see a measurable difference in the world - And it would fun.

    • 2 years ago
  • Argon18
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      Argon18  
    • Image
    • 02:

      http://www.cafepress.com/gl0bal0rgasm

      They already have one, it's on 12/22 called The Global Orgasm for Peace, I've been celebrating it for 3 years now.

      http://www.globalorgasm.org/The_Science.html

      And when you resurface, think about this. Evolutionary psychologists and biologists theorize that the purpose behind most male behavior is to attract females. It is primordial and unconscious. Women have forgotten how powerful their mate choices can be. We are asking women to help redefine “progress” by consciously altering their mating preferences to discourage and de-legitimize overly aggressive behavior and militaristic posturing. It may be the only incentive powerful enough for men to step up the evolutionary ladder to enlightened masculinity. And we ask those women already in relationships to remember their ability to guide men towards their true power.

      Our species is now at the tipping point where human ‘progress’ is finally endangering our survival. It is time for change. It is time for true Partnership between men and women, combining the best of both sexes to heal what the worst has brought about. So we ask you all to take a biological step towards Peace and Partnership after this year’s Global Oh!

      This Solstice, we want you all to combine the power of orgasm with the power of intention

      Global Orgasm for Peace follows in the footsteps of other mass meditation and prayer events which also claimed to be able to change the energy field of the Earth. The Global Consciousness Project (GCP) measures random numbers and claims that large events that create focused attention can create measurable effects on random number sequences. The Global Orgasm's organizers hope to create a positive change in the energy field of the Earth that can be measured by the GCP and that might begin a shift away from war as foreign policy.

    • 2 years ago
  • 02
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      02  
    • 02:

      There has been several threads where the new male has been decried as having been 'feminized.' This would pose the idea that while women are demanding a proper juxtaposition within society and individually, the search has created only the beginning of readjustments.
      The essence of us must be a true spirit - of maleness and femaleness. The whole male, all of its potential for power and creativity. And the whole female.
      The polarity between male and female - which includes within it, the heavy flavor of reproduction as a potential - is -perhaps- the greatest power we human animals can find.

      It is a potential within us.

      And women, so inclined, want a real man. That's what they're looking for in males. The real deal.

      But this is a Xmas thread...

    • 2 years ago
  • Argon18
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      Argon18  
    • 02:

      That WAS the idea of avoiding destructive extremes by balancing into a "whole" instead.

      And if this WAS a Xmas thread then why bring up a "get laid" day?

    • 2 years ago
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  • Argon18
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      Argon18  
    • 02:

      When?
      Monday, December 21, 2009, the Winter Solstice, at 17:47 GMT (or anytime within a 24 hour period)

      What?
      Dedicate an orgasm to Peace.

      Who?
      All men and women - you and everyone you know.

      Where?
      Everywhere in the world, but especially in those countries affected by war or violence - those most in need of peace.

      Why?
      To effect positive change in the energy field of the earth through conscious dedication of orgasmic energy to the vibration of Peace. Our minds and our biology influence Matter and Quantum Energy fields, so by concentrating our thoughts before, during, and after orgasm on peace and loving-kindness, the synergy of high orgasmic physical energy combined with the power of positive visualization could help reduce global levels of violence, hatred and fear. Orgasm is the largest possible instantaneous surge of human biological and spiritual energies. It is a biological gift! What better way to achieve your resolution for Peace?

      And I agree it is festive so it is fitting

    • 2 years ago
  • ENDIF
    • 0
      ENDIF  

    • Yeah, I don't buy it.

      This atheists only beef with xmas is the incessant materialism, the omnipresent xmas media (JINGLEBELLSADINFINITUM!!!11), and the inconvenient obligation of having to think of and buy presents for family. Just like nearly everyone else.

    • 2 years ago
  • 02
  • deadpool
    • 0
      deadpool  

    • I am an Atheist and still celebrate Christmas, I rejoice like any other American holiday.

      I still say Merry Christmas and Happy Chanukah to peers.

    • 2 years ago
  • DeliaTheArtist
  • bombastinator
    • 0
      bombastinator  

    • The non christian Japanese happily picked up Christmas. They call it 'Santa day" and treat Santa like just another minor deity.

      Most Atheists that I know have little problem with Santa Claus for kids and gift giving. Unless they are one of the hard cores that don;t do the tooth fairy either.

      'Happy Santa day' works for pretty much everyone but the Jews then.

    • 2 years ago
  • lifestudentno83
    • 0
      lifestudentno83  

    • If Christianity was correct and that Christmas is the birthday of Jesus Christ, the fact that he was born in Winter, in the Middle East, and out in the cold was nothing short of a "miracle". Historians have said that the winters there were too cold for farmers to be out tending to the fields during the time that Christ was born, meaning either the winter was unseasonably warm or that he was not born during the winter.

      All that aside, people have forgotten what Christmas meant in the first place. It's become nothing more than a selling point to get consumers to spend as much money as they can on worthless junk. As soon as Halloween is over, Christmas begins because stores want to get all your hard-earned cash as quickly as they can. It kind of sickens me how they cheapen the holiday, in addition to cheapening everything with shoddy workmanship before jacking the price up on it.

      I spend Christmas with my family exchanging presents from under a tree. However, I'm not exactly what you would call Christian. Neither is my family, for that matter. None of us have attended service in a Christian church for several years. Does that make us hypocrites? Must I hold true to my Agnostic views and distance myself from everything Christmas, because it's a Religious holiday at heart?

      I just view it as a time to share with loved one and family, and not as the birth of mankind's savior. Is that wrong of me?

    • 2 years ago
  • mindcruzer
  • DeliaTheArtist
    • 0
      DeliaTheArtist  

    • "The days are short, the nights are long, what better time to have a celebration to raise the spirits of people."

      Indeed! Did anyone catch the History of Christmas last year? They'll probably play it again this year on the History channel...they talk about that fact as a reason so many cultures have celebrations in the winter...it's cold, dark, and for many older cultures the winter was a representation of death... there's only one thing that can cure the winter blues, and that's a FRIGGIN PARTY! Surely the history channel puts it more eloquently than I, it's worth the watch!

      Also, as for the "toughness" of the season, I guess it depends on what your situation is. Most of these stories come from people who suffered or could suffer an adverse reaction from being openly atheist. This can be detrimental to people and color their experiences; every time someone says "Merry Christmas" to them they hear "You better believe in Jesus or you're a bad person!" because that's the type of mentality they have endured. There are plenty of complaints from, as Uni put it, the "wing nuts" around this time that Christmas is about CHRIST and whatnot, so I can see where they are coming from. As most of you have shared, I also love Christmas for the celebration, the food, the family and the fun!

    • 2 years ago
  • Argon18
    • 0
      Argon18  
    • DeliaTheArtist:

      But isn't that "toughness" mostly based on projections?

      This can be detrimental to people and color their experiences; every time someone says "Merry Christmas" to them they hear "You better believe in Jesus or you're a bad person!"

      is a classic example of that since the person who said it probably had the intention of good will in the greeting.

      The culture war of the wingnuts is also an example of projection since they are trying to force their views onto others with no regard for what others believe.

      That also goes to what the Grinch learned since his bitterness about Xmas was mostly based on his isolation from the Whos and projecting that bitterness onto the good will of the season

    • 2 years ago
  • DeliaTheArtist
  • Argon18
    • 0
      Argon18  
    • DeliaTheArtist:

      Then why buy into those projections? That only makes you a victim to suffer unecessarily as causualties in "The War on Christmas" to those that want to force their beliefs onto you.

      Isn't it far better to accept the holiday cheer "will always be just as long as we have we" if people "stand, heart to heart and hand in hand?"

    • 2 years ago
  • DeliaTheArtist
    • 0
      DeliaTheArtist  
    • DeliaTheArtist:

      I certainly think so, which is why I don't yell at people who say "Merry Christmas" to me. I just say Merry Christmas back or Happy Holidays or something. But if my atheism had been used against me, like in the case of the guy who lost his custody battle, or if I thought I would be fired over it, I might have a different emotional reaction. It appears from the atheists here on Current that most of us don't have such a "hard time" during the holidays at all!

    • 2 years ago
  • Argon18
    • 0
      Argon18  
    • DeliaTheArtist:

      In custody battles anything can be used against you even accusations of child molesting for a mere pat on the head because they want to find any excuse to win the case for their side so that being an atheist had little to do with it.

      So that isn't a good example because projecting a bad experience onto Xmas for that is just as bad as what the Grinch did.

      I'd agree with the idea of the "hard time" is being exaggerated in much the same way as the wingnuts blow the "War on Christmas" out of proportion.

    • 2 years ago
  • DeliaTheArtist
  • Argon18
  • DeliaTheArtist
    • 0
      DeliaTheArtist  
    • DeliaTheArtist:

      The old cartoon version then, I'm assuming! I never saw the Jim Carey one. Anyway, I'm starting to think I should have just left that first line out, because I didn't mean to color this story as "poor atheists, they suffer during Christmas", just give a little insight into what some atheists are doing.

    • 2 years ago
  • 02
  • thewhompus
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      thewhompus  
    • DeliaTheArtist:

      It seems rather apparent that most of the commentators that argue against the idea of athiests having a hard time at christmas probably live in rather progressive areas. Imagine being an Atheist in rural Texas. Or anywhere in the american midwest. Can't be good.

      For myself, I have DEFINITELY suffered because of my beliefs during the christmas season. And that's in spite of the fact that I expressly avoid discussing those beliefs during this time.

    • 2 years ago
  • 02
  • 02
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    • DeliaTheArtist:

      err, ps: I keep wondering why certain peoples don't up and move from hostile environments.
      Picture a few skeletons standing around a dried up 'Oasis' resigned to fate.

    • 2 years ago
  • thewhompus
    • 0
      thewhompus  
    • DeliaTheArtist:

      you mean we should move overseas? Maybe to a remote island? Yeah, I tried that. The bible thumpers knocked on my door anyway.

      There simply aren't too many places in the world that are friendly towards atheists. I think we're pretty well despised and distrusted by everyone.

      For myself, I also live in a fairly progressive city, but even so it certainly has it's fair share of wackos and bible thumpers.

    • 2 years ago
  • 02
  • pjacobs51
    • 0
      pjacobs51  

    • "Christmas is a tough time of year for an atheist."

      I don't really see it as a tough time, in fact I find it rather humorous.

      This time of year we witness an astronomical event, the winter solstice, based on scientific evidence gathered throughout history. And we see religions like Christianity more or less taking advantage of this event for their own benefit, having nothing to do with the science involved. But I don't really blame them for the misinterpretation. The days are short, the nights are long, what better time to have a celebration to raise the spirits of people.

      Whether it's the Mummers dance or a Christmas Carol, I ride the wave laughing all the way.

    • 2 years ago
  • Argon18
    • 0
      Argon18  

    • I am surprised to say it but I agree with unimatrix0 on this one since by that definition the Jewish also suffer a lot of discrimination at Christmas.

      Does that mean that it is a "tough time of year" for those outside of Whoville also?

      Getting along with family members is always tough with certain sensitive topics of conversation from different political views to supporting different teams in sports so that is no different.

      As I mentioned before since people have always celebrated the Winter Solstice it doesn't really matter what you call it because It doesn't have to be put in dogmatic religious terms as long as the meaning remains.

      Even the Grinch learned that when "He puzzled and puzzled till his puzzler was sore. Then the Grinch thought of something he hadn't before! Maybe Christmas, he thought, doesn't come from a store. Maybe Christmas... perhaps... means a little bit more!"

      "And what happened then? Well, in Whoville they say that the Grinch's small heart grew three sizes that day. And then - the true meaning of Christmas came through, and the Grinch found the strength of *ten* Grinches, plus two!"

      "Welcome, Christmas, bring your cheer. Cheer to all Whos far and near. Christmas Day is in our grasp so long as we have hands to clasp. Christmas Day will always be just as long as we have we. Welcome Christmas while we stand, heart to heart and hand in hand."

      Good will toward all isn't constrained to any religion and that is what the season is supposed to be about.

    • 2 years ago
  • unimatrix0
    • 0
      unimatrix0  

    • This is bullshit. I have been agnostic or atheist all my life and I love Christmas. When I was a kid we always had a wonderful secular Christmas with Santa, the tree, friends and family and all that good stuff.

      As an adult I continue to enjoy and cherish the winter holiday.

      This idea that atheists/agnostics/ free thinkers suffer during Xmas is so much bullshit; It is wing nut propagands from the likes of Fox news and Bill O'Reilly.

    • 2 years ago
  • DeliaTheArtist
    • 0
      DeliaTheArtist  

    • Do we even need to redefine it? Since Christmas started it has been a mishmash of cultures and religions; the date itself was picked out to coincide with the winter solstice to make for easier conversions. Christmas trees, yule logs, gift giving, Santa...none of this stuff has to do with Jesus!

      Also, one of the main reasons I posted this was to draw attention to the "Atheists for Human Rights" group. One of the most frequent criticisms I've heard concerning atheist groups is that they don't come close to providing the moral inspirations and good deeds that church groups do, many of which are federally funded ("faith based initiatives") Well, the call has been heard and the tides are turning. I expect to see many more humanist/atheist groups with focuses on human rights and making the world a better place.

    • 2 years ago
  • 02
    • 0
      02  
    • DeliaTheArtist:

      Maybe someone ought to put together a funded faith-based non-religious group that uses those same funding sources for something good.
      A good piece of that money was just funneling $$ to churches.

    • 2 years ago
  • thewhompus
  • Dejan_Croatia
    • 0
      Dejan_Croatia  

    • i think people like me who are not religious cant redefine christmas i mean im not going to give up giving presents and make a tree but im not going to include all that jesus crap

      think about it. we can redefine this time of the year for non religious people

    • 2 years ago
  • Ajil
    • 0
      Ajil  

    • i would think its one of the best times of year for atheists, and actually because religion gets put into the spotlight. Christmas season allows for so called Christians to becomes materialistic, superificial, hypocrites, greedy and conniving. I dont mean to generalize all Christians, but a good portion of American Christians that dont follow the message from the book, just focus on worshipping the messenger, seem to let go of many virtues that must be followed to be considered a true Christian. I know someone is going to get offended, but if it doesn't apply to you, then let it go, because in the end, you know that its true in a lot of cases. One more thing, Christmas being the celebration of Christ's birthday is the exact same birthday of like 10 prophets before him... its all just astrology. Truth illuminates from the 'heavens'.

      http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-594683847743189197#

    • 2 years ago
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