Religion divides people

I wish I could vote this up more than once . Religion/dogma is marketing . It is brand mentality in it's purest form . It says goodness and light on the label , then it harness all the anger and hate you have . Don't buy it .

Ya, Buddy Christ right?

All organized power structures have a purpose . Christian , islam , what have you . Buddhism is a philosophy , so it does not get included here .

Interesting you should mention Buddhism . Sharlet's earlier work which I just, as in just, picked up tonight is titled, Killing the Buddha. I wonder if there's a book called, Capitalizing Heaven there could be.

The question I have is, Is that "purpose" fundamentally evil?

Evil, in this context, has to be defined on how it acts on the greater society through time.
Of course, it is then appropriate to offer various projections of a society without religions in comparison.

So it becomes evils vs potential evils against variations of more enlightened societies.

But then, here we are -

In the Oxford dictionary of world religions , there are over 500 pages of deities . These imaginary friends are helpful when coping with stress . I do not wish to take any imaginary friends away from any one . The inherent evil comes with the books and dogma. Not all of the books are bad , just the parts where it says it is OK to kill or even consider as less of a human , some person who has different imaginary friends , or no imaginary friends . LIke babies , or females ect ... Also the examples of doing such , and pushing of YOUR imaginary friend on to some one else . SICK . In some , perhaps wiser religions , a young person went on a vision quest and connected to the divine is a personal way , through an animal guide or some such . They were NOT to talk about it . NOT to push it on any one else . That is spiritual rape . It is chid abuse to steal that liberty from children . Every person must find their own path , or it is meaningless to their own heart . It teaches people to dishonor their own heart , lie to fit in and stops critical thinking by not asking questions , otherwise known as 'faith' . People become extremists because the are desperate to convince themselves . They are not and haven't been allowed to be authentic within themselves since childhood . If you are disconnected from yourself ,you cannot connect to others . Not even your own children . Depending on how tightly one clings to dogma.

Thats a "RIGHT ON"! +^d

you are right..religion is all about power. it is about maintaining the power structure that has oppressed women and "minorities" for centuries

All those people in the middle, you see driving on the freeway everyday. Are you sure you want to be content with that?

All religions practice exactly what you say you don't like.

'Cept the Imams have s-o-m-e-t-h-i-n-g for you. And it ain't 'everyone get along'

yes people are to be blamed too for abusing their respective religion for personal and communal gain. but that does not mean religion and the idea of "god" is good for humanity..at least upto this point in human history religion has done more harm than good. holocaust, armenian genocide, riots is Gujarat and the list goes on and on

You're another one who thinks your idea of God is real - that your "God" is equal to your ideas. Which also means that your ideas are equal to God.

That's where you're goofing up. If God is as big as your ideas, God is a small, small thing.
Small.

So you have quite a job to do to figure out a better notion of God. In order to do that, first of course, you have to let go of all your beliefs.

It's the idea that as you have utterly inadequate notions of God, completely filling your cup, there is no room for God. You won't allow any more in - when you can easily see that your ideas do not equal to God and are not on par with God. But you refuse to see more.

You have to empty your cup to ever hope to see more.
And if you refuse, you refuse God.

That's quite a Catch 22, huh? Your very religious ideas and demands eliminate the very discovery you hope to attain.

What would God say to you?

Would you kill to prove it ? Discriminate against another ? Indoctrinate children ? How far into the darkness would you go to make others agree that your light is the only light ?

.....huh?

cants you see that you are acting just the same...............

You are describing religion, utterly. There's no man with a beard in an imaginary 'other' plane of existence - where we want him to do what we want.
That is precisely what religious people do. Create an idea of a deity that is to be or act as they want. As they hope - because they hope the whole universe was made just for them - so they don;t have to die.

There's no such thing in heaven or under it. All the specifications religious people make for a God - is the universe. The universe is the house and the maker - the "creation" creating.

It is not less than God itself - only people's dumb, self-centered dreams are less. W-A-Y less.

Just go to one of the 'Hubble telescope' sites and see what is out there, - billions of galaxies stretching on forever. This necessarily means you are way smaller than you have been thinking.
You are just a little, tiny-winy human with a tiny-winy life that will end very, very soon. Best make the most of it. Stop wasting it with stupid tiny-winy little ideas - that are wrong.

dr phil..seriously??

You shouldn't say "they" as if religious people are one huge contingent who think alike, moving and acting in the same manner. I understand the frustration with religion, people who don't live out what their faiths demand, but what harm am I as a Christian in Ohio doing? What harm is the Imam in Pakistan who allows travelers and the homeless to use his mosque and have free meals (which is common practice in many Muslim countries)? What harm is the Nun who runs a battered women's shelter? Religious people are a mixed bag, sure there are many religious conflicts, but these usually have deeper political reasons. Don't lump the majority of reasonable and loving religious people with the extremists. It's extremely (with all due respect) condescending, self righteous, and close-minded.

I see you are leading by example..hahah when it comes to indifference...

so tell what makes athiesm any better?? no vengeful god to punish you when you commit a sin?..a sorta guilt free lifestyle.

as Bonaparte once said.."religion is the only thing keeping the poor from killing the rich"

humm i guess it does serve a purpose..

"It's extremely (with all due respect) condescending, self righteous, and close-minded."

I think you are guilty of the same crime by insinuating that an atheist would not have been able to provide the same care as the Imam or the Nun.

I didn't insinuate that at all, I countered your point that religious people cause more harm than good. Please respond to the bulk of my argument, not just something I didn't even insinuate.

"so tell what makes athiesm any better??"

A lot less world conflict and the propagation of a lie is unhealthy, but I guess this same argument would hold true from a theist's perspective.

'as Bonaparte once said.."religion is the only thing keeping the poor from killing the rich"

humm i guess it does serve a purpose..'

I actually agree with this 100% hahaha.

Maybe you just don't realize you are doing it. Let me explain.

The religion associated with your comments have nothing to do with the good deeds or harmless actions your nun or Imam hypothetically did. Unless they base every action or decision on whether it better or worsens their chances of going to heaven or hell, (which is a terrible way to live) they made these choices because they were empathetic. Is someone less religious less likely to provide good deeds? No, and that's my point.

If you were an atheist like me (hypothetically) would you stop giving to charity? If you answered no, then what good does the Church do that we wouldn't do without it? You ask what harm you are doing and my answer is not much besides enabling those who are harmful, but in contrast, what good are you doing?

It's like watching someone poke themselves in the eye over and over again. Yea your not doing any harm to anyone else, but your just hurting yourself, so stop poking your eye dammit!

You said religious people are causing harm, but when I object to that you say "well what good do you do?" In this argument that doesn't really matter, even though I did give examples of good things religious people do. It's not because of a fear of hell all the time, I do good things because all human beings have the spark of God, it's my duty. I should also mention that Catholic Charities is one of the biggest charities in the world, the Salvation Army is a religious organization, and countless other religious organizations feed and clothe people throughout the world every single day.

You're right, a person's religion does not affect the value of his or her moral character, but religion often acts as a guide for people who want to do good. The Quran, for example, stipulates the amount of money good Muslims are supposed to give to charity. Look at the five pillars of Islam, the Beatitudes in Christianity, or the Ten Commandments in Judaism and Christianity, are these harmful?

Religion is like any other ideology, people will use it as they will. Humans beings have committed unspeakable crimes in the name of socialism and equality, but at the same, people have reached the heights of good will and humanity in the quest for the values.

I agree that people do need guidance on morality, but we will always fundamentally disagree on where those values should come from. I believe that they should come exclusively from societal views because Religion is too rigid to accommodate. It can be argued that an adaptable morality system can devolve into something nasty, but history has shown us the opposite is true.

You're free to your opinion, and I don't think your opinion on this matter makes you naive or causes any harm (which religious people are often accused of).

Also, I'm not sure when a morally relativistic society has existed in history.

Well, the Imam has a back room where they teach them to blow themselves up. Just like Christians used to burn people. There is a time for everything under heaven, it seems.

If the universe is way bigger than the religions and their teachings, and if humans aren't the 'big deal' and center of the God's plan, that people cling to religious teachings to prove to themselves, then what would be a better plan of education for humans? Since, in such a case, religions further grotesque ignorance and accomplish absolutely nothing more?

How could people be in a better world? (seeing that the present notions of "God" are completely wrong, in fact and are certainly one of the main causes for the present state of man) - (which is pretty damn ugly) - ?

That is exactly it - a guilt free life. What could you feel guilty about?

-If-
You have either made mistakes in your past that you feel bad about - in which case, you obviously see what was wrong with that you and are no longer a person who could make such mistakes and should, therefore, well move on; - or you're trapped into thinking you need a God to keep you on the path (a desired ideal but necessarily separate path) in which case, the notion itself is the only thing keeping you from moving on. And therefore not out-growing your own youth.

So, yes, no God, just you. The big surprise is you are every bit as strong as you could ever have hoped for, - on your own.

Religion just keeps people from growing up - and becoming everything they are supposed to be - a full, clear-thinking, self-responsible adult. Your true power.

That's what all these religious types are missing, the true power of themselves.

You have a point . So what should be done ? Extremist are spreading and destabilizing the world .

haha that will be some payback..imagine group of atheists bothering random people that they won't be saved unless they stop believing..

What denomination?

My mother is Baptist, the rest of my family is Catholic and they are all praying to save my soul from eternal damnation, because I am an atheist.

Lets just say, it makes for a hell of a Christmas and Easter dinner, when the accuse me of just showing up for the food and drink ...
Crazy Christians but good cooks.

Oh, with the fanatic stuff, I assume you're talking about maybe a conservative Baptist community, because, after being raised Catholic, I don't think I've ever seen a fanatical Catholic sermon.

I were raised in both, thanks to my parents being divorced. So whenever it was my mother's week, I were dragged to her Baptist church. When it was my father's week I was dragged to the Catholic church.

I say dragged because I would rather stay home and watch Sunday morning cartoons, the best cartoons came on Sunday and the church had to mess this up too.
Religion really knows how to kill enjoyment doesn't it.

Meh, I've had a lot of good experiences connected to religion. I've learned a bit from the Church.

hate is a human emotion..you are playing along with this idiocy that GOD needs to abide to your expectation..

God is a supreme being that provides you with a chance to experience life unhindered..we have this maniacal attachment to our short earthly lives..

there is no god..don't know non existent ones can hate??

Man thinking he is the center of the universe is even worse than any perversion of religious teachings..

tyrants always hide behind things..and often enough its religion..

as a matter of fact..take some time and think and be honest with yourself..are you really ranting because you care...

Religion IS man centered, it insists that man has some grand purpose beyond his pointless biological life. He doesn't, man is irrelevant. Here today, gone tomorrow by universal standards. A nearby supernova from another solar system would kill us all and there would be nothing we could do stop it.

The classic example of how man-centered religions can be is that man goes to heaven but animals "just die." Animals don't go to hell or heaven, they just die.

Why? Plenty of other mammals such as elephants and dolphins display levels of intelligence, sentience and care remarkably similar to human beings. Why do they just die while we party for eternity for doing nothing but believing in a particular religion?

For that matter, who would -want- to live forever? I don't care how much you like partying, twelve trillion years from now you're gonna be damn bored.

The bottom line is that the claims of various religions are transparently human desires over the fear of death. Humans subconsciously know that when they die, that's it, and they're -terrified- of that fact and therefore are willing to believe anything in place of it.

And throw their only and whole and real life away in a mad pursuit of nothing more than a tragically bad habit.
A bad habit they haven't got balls to even face. Pining, frightened small minds that want a God that tells them it's ok after all. - Like little children. With a children's story they have actually gone for.

But holding it, keeps them little children - and miss out on the real power of their lives, their adulthood.

Truly pitiful.

But the issue with the bible is that it is so ambiguous. Even if we ignore the "angry" god of the Old Testament (who lets be honest, he seemed to really like the spilled blood), Jesus ignored a lot of important moral issues. In the entire New Testament, no where does it come out against slavery, rape, or incest.

I do not mean to offend, and if I have, I apologize. I just have a hard time understanding what makes a person value one religious text over another. I was raised Roman Catholic so I was exposed to much of the Christian theology and historical writings that are ignored by other Christians. In my adult life, I have been lucky to travel to the Middle East and visit mosques, traveled to Turkey to see the House of the Virgin Mary, and seen in person the Sistine Chapel. I've been lucky enough to have lived with both a Hindu and a Sikh in college and pretty much they have the same value system.

I guess I always come to the same question whenever I talk to a person of faith...how are you sure that your path is the proper one? Really, aside from Unitarianism, they all seem to deem themselves as the only path to God(s)' good side.

Again, if your offended by this question I apologize and good luck on that ethics paper.

"I do not mean to offend, and if I have, I apologize."

You don't have to be nice to these people anymore. These delusional victims are bringing the quality of life down for all of us and if it takes a bit of relish to make sure they understand that, then so be it..

I'm quoting Stephen Colbert on this one:

"Call me silly, call me sappy
Call me many things, the first of which is happy"

hahahahahahahahhahahhaha..colbert?? the canadian comedian??

wow!! now thats enlightenment for you

Stephen Colbert is from South Carolina. Honestly, do you know anything?

My partner replies to you, with interest :

From memory-
"Jesus came to renew our faith in God and fulfill the prophecy laid out in the old testament, not to tell us if we should or should not commit incest."

And the other part? It's called faith I believe. I should have replied sooner when it was fresh in my head. Did I even answer what you asked? I should have reread your question.

oh! and that was the most non offensive reply! Come on!

Current is much more interested in displaying what the users want to hear...

Kind of like Fox News...

well current tv is a few notches below garbage so....

so the fringe douchebag left can have a news source on par with the fringe douchebag right? I'm all for pot and recycling, but all of this Anti-Christian drek is the same lazy chariacture promotion that liberals complain about with how fox portrays anything un-GOP. I mean, come on people, some idiot chick claims to be in a beauty pageant and wants all gays dead and suddenly she's the spokesperson for Christendom? This video blog in particular isn't bad (its boring as hell, but honest), but so many others on this site are flat out hostile. It almost makes me want to go back over to fox news... almost.

I doubt you've read and seen the knowledge. I don't think anyone could prove religions are based on some scheme by our rulers to keep us down.

Word. it's very Nietsche to think that way. It's saying that Christianity is what self proclaimed Christians do. Christians ARE NOT Christianity.

oh fuck it .. * nietzsche

stop neck talking you dont know and thats how it is, dont stress your soul, life force, spirit in the old testament its prescribeing the main idea if u aint israel isreali israelite u are not chosen the koran if u aint muslim u are not chosen when the creator speaks the solar system, universe, galaxy will hear not one bunch of savages, on one corner of the earth still i create my self i drew a picture of ganesh on a box at this warehouse the bangladesh who seen it look at me with admiration i started smiling only if i knew thier words i would get offerings from them plus my minimum wage i know more than u want me to know

Can you use correct grammar and punctuate because I have no idea what you're talking about.

Missionaries today usually don't give people the choice of aid or accepting their religion, so your point doesn't really stand. One of the biggest charities in the US is Catholic Charities.

Your mistaking religion as the root problem instead of the corrupt people (behind the curtain) running those organizations. Read DRude's post

Religion provides the curtains - that's what they make. That's their job in this life.

Perfectly sensible comment. +1

Well, that is a very simple story! Congratulations, you seem to know the whole workings of God and refined in an extremely simple set of notions.

Of course, that specifically means your notions, are equal to and the same as God.

I didn't know God was so unbelievably simple.

Are you sure you haven't got it a little too simple? Are you really sure?

Only someone with an equal intellect as God could know - according to you, that is you.

Otherwise, you might find a fear that you hadn't figured it all out and might (hold on to your desktop), be wrong! -

And you will not have that, huh?

Yeah, but he was talking about real bread.

we could. but we choose not to

I agree with what you said, but that video is mad fricking gay and not really on topic.

That’s ignorant and you are a homophope. The video is about the most beautiful love of all, the unconditional, unculture -contaminated love between two grown men, and if we follow its message we would all be happier.

No wonder Islamists want to kill us.........

I saw a town meeting once, where gays were challenging some board. Speaker after speaker went on about gayness and why their love was wonderful and about sex, etc.

Since the meeting was on education, I think , a working guy finally stood up and popped the bubble, which brought laughter from all, including the gays when he said: "How 'bout a little more between the ears and a little less between the legs"

Typical: Conforming to a particular type, characteristic or distinctive, pertaining to, of the nature of.

This woman is not "Typical."

Christian's don't starve their babies to death?
Oh, well, that's a relief.

THAT Christian did..but it is not TYPICAL of Christians.

We could have been sailing around the solar system, colonies on Mars 500 years ago if it weren't for Christians and all the rest of em.
Total waste of their whole lives. Their whole living lives, thrown away.

So much chaff if it weren't so destructive and cancerous.

Evil. Now you Christians know that you as an individual aren't necessarily evil - very much like the Christian that starved her baby to death - it's only a few of you.

But the religion, itself, is evil. Evil at large.

I'm not sure how much brains it takes to keep from seeing it squarely. But It certainly has to take some brain power to not look.

Look at all these screw-ball Muslims running around. You can't imagine that they could be doing more productive things with their lives?

If humans actually grow out of this, they'll sure have a long laugh about the banality of their forerunners.

That's all your lives will ever amount to - some banal waste of flesh.

You're working under the assumption that 1. I am a Christian and that 2. That it is religion that is evil in and of itself as opposed to the practitioners.

I wasn't talking about you, even though I pushed 'reply'. It's a matter of content flow.

No, I believe the imposition of the dogma itself is evil, abusive and mis-directs whole populations and eras of time, but that the people are likely not evil.

Some people are evil - however, babies aren't evil - so it must be the way they are raised - yes?

So it is religion - and other misguided forms of dogmatic thought that are at least very responsible for part of our poor state in the world.

Gotcha, and I agree, Dogma is always evil whether religious or secualarly oriented. I think people are born with the capacity for either evil or good..basically a blank slate. Even when the slate has been drawn on, one can still erase and start over.

Again, I am not sure that I would say that it is the religion itself but the people teaching it to the kids in a way that is evil. The point is that religion is based on an individual interpretation of different philisophic writings. Unless you have another working definition for the word religion which I can use as a reference. In my view the text can be interpreted in an infinite number of ways, including evil and benevolent ways. The religion in and of itself is inert, the teachers are the ones who are evil or good as the case may be.

Don't get me wrong, I am not a fan of organized religion.

Religion has had their shot - they have a long and clear history - the results are simply seen.

Even the kindly nun cloistered away - what would she have created, what gifts would she have provided - hadn't it been for religion?

People have done this - this thing called religion.

But just what I know and can determine of reality, precludes, absolutely the tenets of religions. And of course, I'm no god - so the story being sold by religion is fallacy; a fraud, not true, not real.

I say, to the degree that people feel helped by it, they needed another way to grow out of a stressing moment - because they got hooked on lies.

They could be feeling just fine and have a good grasp of real stuff. In full control of their own free mind and will.

How does it benefit ANYONE to have emotional shelter under illusion? especially if it leads to a big stop - in their growth?

Just millions of people stopped on dumb.

That's our lot. Here we could do anything, be anything, but what do we got? A world dumb, slow, plodding - or outright evil.

Sleazy government - sleazy people, always trying to sleaze they're way through life.

And the whole time, the God they search for is all around them - and has never been anything like what religions teach.
Every one of them, holding onto bogus beliefs - when letting go is exactly and the only way that will let them see.

Isn't that just crazy? The very thing they hold on to, keeps them from seeing further.

"the God they search for is all around them - and has never been anything like what religions teach."

I agree wholeheartedly. I think most of the time you find resistance to the anti-religious sentiment is based on a person linking that they believe in "god" to religion. I am spiritual, and believe in "god" (incidentally I think anyone who tries to define what "god" is, is either a liar or ignorant.) but I have no use for any Religion I am aware of.

yuk, yuk, yuk - whered u get that picture?