Ron Paul Discusses The National ID Card 3/10/2010

New World Order MY A$$. I do not think that Europe, the BRIC nations would stand for what we do abroad.This is NEW American Order. because we have put ourselves ina corner. what does a frightened nation do with powerful arsenal,laurels, and clout: Anything to to remain top dog by any means necessary. Even if that means turning its own populace into $erfs, with nicer jerkins and Thatched roofs.

IT did not start with Obama. It started with Nixon. Vietnam is still biting us in the ass. Nixon knew that the DOD was burning us fiscally-that and WWII debt compounded the problem. Regan Made it worse with the tax hikes. Bush I instigated Pay-go and. Clinton thought he could offset our economy woes with NAFTA, and forgot the principle of a balanced economy:Diversify.and Murphys Law. Bush II Made even more tax cuts we could not afford and made us MORE not LESS dependent on OIL.

MOST of our SOVEREIGN DEBT is tied to our MILITARY EXPENDITURES. Past. present,and perennial budgetary expenditures. you may not have a rooof under your head or butter tonight, but at least we have the best Cobalt bombs and white phosphorus money can buy.

I meant Reagan;s TAX CUTS

Think about it. Follow the money. All of the banks of the world are intertwined and it all comes back to the banks. Control the money, control the labor, control the people. 97% of money is already virtual. Inflation is purposely controlled to generate "scarcity". Europe is financially tied to us and we're all on the same banking system. They already DO stand for what we do... and they've been bought and sold by the same industry leaders. Seriously, this is modern day slavery and that's not an exaggeration. Slaves were actually required to have food and housing I believe. We can't even get medicare!

as do all the paultard sock puppets.

the members of the cult of Paul are sick puppies - and they will attack anyone who dares question their master, regardless of the truth.

poor dumb bastards

god! i love insulting people, it gives my self-esteem super strength

"It is clear you have a very personal beef... and so you want to smear ... , but your paranoia and misinformation have no place on this thread"

The Constitution, besides, why do we need State ID cards anyways? It just reinforces the xenophobic neocon's immigrant hatred. It makes them think they can actually do something with these cards to eradicate Mexicans from the population. Honestly, you want the republicans to have this card in their power when they get back in office? Coupled with the Patriot....we are screwed. Worst of all, they will use it to try to track those in the black market and use it as a weapon for the war on drugs. I say, no need for state ID's, it's all for tax purposes anyways. All of this is against individual rights. We should have the right to opt out of this program if we wish.....we won't though....government is not voluntary, we are enslaved to it, whether you want it or not. You go ahead and defend Lindsay Graham's neocon bill....count me out!

IF you haven't Read 1984-you wouldnt understand. I find it Ironic since your picture is the Star Trek equivalent of Big Brother and Mustafa Mond combined.

Do you think that it may be that it is because unima is a socialist nanny government shill?

Wow hmm, where to begin-if you have not read what I wrote above I think you would find that comment counter intuitive. the Original Nannies are Nixon, Regan, Bush, Kissenger et al. Are you a Krauthammer in disguise?

I am not trying to reason with Unimatrix I am trying to dissuade others from abandoning reason for madness.uni is just a launchpad to a new idea Although, I do not know this person, I cannot judge him/her- but I disagree with the statement made-exeunt.

I was implying that I think of unimatrix as a shill for the Utopian "Nanny State" that seems now to be the prevalent desire of the Obama hopey and changie crowd... that is my take on it in a nut-shell.

You are an idiot.

First of all, the National ID card will be implemented with an RFID chip just like your passports are now, which is a tracking device. Second, it's a known fact that the government has been tracking cell phones for years now, so that shoots down that argument.

Ron Paul is radical?

Since when is it radical to be honest and fight oppression? Well if standing up for the American people and fighting for our freedoms makes him radical, then you can call me that too.

but you are still an idiot

nicely put

This goes for you too Uni. This term, "radical" which has so masterfully been massaged into your minds to mean anyone that doens't bend over for the state. If it were to be used in it's proper context, it would be used to describe the senators that purposed this. and the organization backing them for that matter.

Ummm...what is with everybody thinking that the United States is gonna turn into the world of "Logan's Run"?

sounds like a sweet sci fi movie.

because it is! haha

no sifi look up RFID chip

"xenophobia and/or racism." Please Explain.

Because I think it’s much more about control. There are other proposals out there to deal with illegal immigration. So why is the National I.D. Card solution being pushed on us?

Because tying a national identity card to the illegal immigration problem is the only way the government will be able to get the American people to accept it. Outside the illegal immigration context no American would wittingly submit themselves to a program that gives the government a greatly enhanced ability to track them.

Illegal immigration is the only context in which the government can impose National Identification cards on us and they are doing everything they can to take advantage of this oppurnitiny. Ron Paul says as much in the beginning.

I just hope the American people recognize that government opportunists are using the illegal immigration crisis to pass ambiguous legislation that may solve the problem but at the price of an American police state.

How does this give the government "a greatly enhanced ability to track them"?

How on earth does this result in "an American police state"?

Right now, who CAN'T be tracked?

In addition to all the artificial IDs listed in my comment above, we have a bunch of natural built-in ones: our DNA, our fingerprints, our retinal scans, our dental prints.

Not only do I not see the horrific results of this that you envision, I don't see any benefits either.

It's just another card.

I just hope it's wallet-sized, and I hope it's pretty. Perhaps a nice hologram. It will waste a bit of government money, but keep some print shops in business.

Why "xenophobia and/or racism?"

It is not as much that racism is the symptom in this scenario. It is the disease that lies beneath.

Although Dr. Paul stops short of calling out his constituents and colleagues for race-baiting - because he would obviously be speaking out directly against his own base and nuking his own 2012 Presidential candidacy - he does actually admit a partial truth in that that the current illegal-immigration hubbub is rooted in certain economic realities.

But American racist attitudes toward Mexicans have been around since the days of Sam Houston, and not just since our recent economic collapse.

Speaking as a Californian, I can't remember a time when militant racists were not lined up on our (Arizona's, New Mexico's, Texas') boarders, taking matters into their own hands. This pro-American/real-American fear-mongering rhetoric is all too familiar for many of us. But now, thanks to the propaganda machine that is FOX News, this biased dialogue is having the effect of emboldening the twisted and historically inaccurate racist beliefs (dormant or not) which exists in every corner of every state.

Clearly, anyone that understands American History (or immigration in general) knows that if we had more jobs than we could fill in the United States, we would be begging for cheap, immigrant labor. But, with many of us losing our homes by the second to big banks, their dirty corporations and the elite class (in general,) it is easy to single out the people with jobs. Even if they aren't making more than $10 a day!

So, why are these people xenophobic and/or racists?

First and foremost, we are a nation of immigrants; to overlook or obfuscate that reality is to completely misunderstand the American experience, and moreover, permitting immigration is the model for our continued role as the leader of the free world. But aside from that (logical) tautology, the factors behind the our current crisis can be summed up into a few obvious talking points:

1. Our educational system has been starved by the Right, and the Left gave up the fight;
2. More than the Republican's dumbing down of the U.S., and the Left's abandonment of the cause, we are, in truth, a land of unskilled idiots. Thanks to corporations, small farms and small business (formerly the strength of our economy) are a distnat memory. We have simply turned into a service-oriented economy, which, as you can tell by making a call to customer support (no matter the industry) is not sustainable in the long haul (and especially, if people in other countries speak better English and work harder than we do.); and,
3. We have a long history of failed international policy w/ respect to Mexico/Central/South America.

"Outside the illegal immigration context no American would wittingly submit themselves to a program that gives the government a greatly enhanced ability to track them."

so you don't have a credit card?

I’ll give you that. There are lot of ways they can track us already but credit cards, state drivers licenses, and social security numbers, are a far cry from a National data base with all your information and an accompanying card to carry around with you

The question to ask is not "what's the big deal about another card." The question is "what are going to be all the applications of this card."

Like most state drivers licenses, the National I.D. will mostly likely have a Swipeable barcode. And like in the case of illegal immigration the card will probably be used to aid in various crime fighting initiatives. Most states require you to swipe your license to buy liquor. Now they will require you swipe your national I.D. as well.

It would be easy to see an initiative passed to help fight credit card fraud that requires you to show and swipe you national I.D. every time you make purchase with you credit card. This would give the federal government a record of purchase instantly.

Also when you get pulled over by a cop, the cop usually takes your license and swipes it in the card reader he has in his car. He may now also swipe your national I.D. recording your arrest in a national data base.

Previously, the federal government would have to get a subpoena from a judge to get information from the credit company . And states could refuse some requests from the federal government for their information.

With the National I.D. the federal government won't need to get subpoena or request information from the states, because Data from national I.D. swipes will be sent right to them, in real time, probably to an office in the NSA or the Department of Homeland Security.

Picture Nazi Germany where citizens were stopped and asked to "show their papers.”. By papers they meant National I.D. papers. Only in present day we would get the added bonus of having to carry a card with a swipeable barcode.

Derk

I agree with you in part, but reserve some exceptions also.

The illegal Immigration issue is and does stir the racial hornets nest bringing out the nasty in people. But it is not racism that’s drives the National I.D. card or the other latest legislative initiatives.

It’s the federal government that's pushing the national I.D. Card act and they are playing off and using racist fears and tensions to get it through.

to answer that question shortly: no I don't have a credit card.

But read my other response to why a National I.D. is a lot worse than a credit card.

And I agree with you!

However, this is clearly being set up as a campaign issue to stoke the fires at the upcoming Tea Party rallies. I just hope that Libertarians don't fall for it.

Great discussion, regardless!

I completely accept that money alone is not the solution to our national education dilemma. This is a crisis of culture. These schools are failing because families, neighborhoods, communities, cities and states are failing to live up to their promises to support, nurture and guide them toward achievement. But when I look around The City, I just see a bunch of little, fast-moving consumers. IM(not so)HO, It's a model that simply cannot be supported over the long haul.

But I am not just trying to point fingers, I am all for figuring out solutions. To me it is imperative that we teach real-life skills - planet-saving skills. Our grandparents made a world that ran on coal, gas and oil. Our children must make a world that runs on the wind, the sun and things I am not smart enough to get (like fusion).

Cheers, and thanks for the thoughtful reply.

Derk