Mexican government warns against travel to Arizona

That is just a racist rant that has no basis on reality. Where did you come up with 20k versus free babies to Mexicans? Please... Turn neighborhoods into guettos? They are building and rebuilding America, not only neighborhoods but entire regions such as New Orleans. They are cleaning our mess, making our groceries affordable, lowering our crime rate - yeah, you read it right, illegal immigrants are less likely to commit crimes than native Americans - and you support subjecting them to this degrading and inhumane law, which, by the way, is a direct affront to the 4th amendment? Save your discriminatory remarks to the ignorant and extremists, it has no place here. Oh, even Marco Rubio, the face for the tea baggers is against this law, which places you in a very special category.

I can't believe comments like these are thumbed up. If you are so mad at the state or your country look at the true culprits. AMERICAN COMPANY OWNERS who would much rather pay a dirty mexican half the salary they would an "american" (what ever that is) Look at Detroit "motor city" how many mexicans stole jobs on the assembly line? None. But plants were packed up and ship out to mexico and parts of asia so that the new workers can get paid just enough to keep them alive. But thats just capitalism right? We are all getting fucked! it is just very easy to take your frustrations out on whoever is being scapegoated at the moment.

yea that all sound good from your point of you but your talking about a nation of many millions of people, with their own pride in country culture and history. you cant use words like conquer when trying to make that kind of move. i would say enter into an agreement. the problem is that the US has made agreements like this in the past and never kept their end of the bargain. as for the flags you must remember that many proud mexican men have died for that flag and it is special for that reason not so much because of the country it represents. for example the men that are dying now for our flag even though they dont agree with the reasons their country sent them to die.

There are still a lot of racists out there, but this law only affects people being questioned for another possible crime, like when you get pulled over. It's true the law could be abused, but as long as liberals do their part, abuse of law is still abuse of law. Why doesn't anyone talk about the fact that we took this country from the originally oppressive England, and that Mexicans can also FIGHT LIKE SON OF A BITCHES for their country - I'd jump the border just to help them.

I'd shoot a cartel boss right in the f'ing head if I could. EIGHT HUNDRED AMERICAN GIRLS WERE KIDNAPPED IN PHOENIX, AND YOU DON'T GIVE A SHIT if you are against this simple little - tiny - nine-teen-page law. Read it. Oh, I'm Mexican, third generation Tucsonan, educated, and well respected member of my community.

sorry bro but you got a lot of the mexican washed out of you so maybe you should ask your immagrant grandma what she thinks. its sad about the girls but how can you say all that was done by illegal immagrants for sure there is always more to the stories than what you here on the news

really? he hoped on a donkey? they are poor in mexico not in the 1800's.

Tell Pedro to fight for his country.

hee hee hee

mandatory hand out some spliffs rasta style easy........the quinceniera your all invited!

you really have a shallow opinion of Hispanic people if you thinks that's funny.

Heil! FOR ZE FAHZERLAND! HEIL!

bro i just wish we could all just see things for what they are. i understand we all have opinions so why not chill smoke a spliff, peace pipe, of some good yesca and forget that we are all different for a while know that it dont matter. we should not let the buggy man stories that we are told cloud our judgment, this law will make nothing better, trust.

Yeah, dope fixes everything. Instead of going and fixing things, like your own country, sit around and get stoned and snivel about medical marijuana. Meanwhile, the cartel kills some more journalists.

Thanks CD

I'm not your "yo" or your "bro".

My brothers don't smoke dope.

shit, i always get my business done pluse i smoke..... but i can also chew gum and walk all at the same time. and if you legalize it cartels go out of business. thats a win win

I know that you don't know jack shit about Arizona besides what you see on the news. Spanish Americans are terrified about the criminals that are coming across the border. Like I said, That immigration bill might not have been the best solution to the problem, but something had to be done.

Since you seem to be so loving and caring, why don't you drive down to Arizona, load some of these people up in buses, and move them into you neighborhood.

¡Suena quiere un tonto! tipo como y como el adulto no un niño, yo puedo cebada comprende su uso de palabra!

just saying

I'm about an hour and a half from the border. They've torn down our fences (to our houses, not the border), but we still accept them as good people, hard workers, and intelligent. I do too, but if I go to Mexico, I can't get caught with a piece of fruit without being asked for twenty bucks by a corrupt cop. This bill represents a "stand" against what none anywhere in the country but the SOUTHERN borders feel, because many in America just don't speak Spanish, so it's scary to ask some one drinking out of your water hose whether they have good intentions. OH, I HAVE AN IDEA, LET'S PAINT THE GOOD MEXICANS GREEN, AND THE BAD MEXICANS, OR TERRORISTS CROSSING THE BORDER, RED - THAT'LL DO IT. Hmmm...Thanks Keith.

Es facil, legal means "legal", illegal means "illegal".

so your into punishing all for the deeds of some? if i had a job for them i would bring em to my hood most of them are good people.

sorry bro but i couldnt make out your message, something about child and adault understanding words i think you need to work on your spanish a little more. i hope you were'nt trying to put me down.

Wow. We agree on something. Wow.

Oh,........+^d !

Imagine? Who's imagining?

In El Paso you can just walk across for 25 cents. No one ever asked me for id to get into Mexico.

Whoo Hooo! Tell it tibbles

Get Real!

the bill doesnt , but the people who lives there, probably will

i live there. and i agree with the context of the bill.

but yes cops here are racists and that is a big problem but cops are unfair all the time so tell me something new.

whats "real" is the american government taking responsibility and start acting like a the grand old country that everybody here thinks it is, god damnit! other countries actively have soldiers across their borders all the time its not anything out of the ordinary or extreme and we need to post up some national guardsmen. it is not radical at all

I love Mexicans, Canadian jewish, Mexican-Canadian jews (they exist), but they know what it takes to be here legally as we know what it takes to be there legally. The arguments against this bill are politcal "trys" to make this a left-vs-right issue AGAIN. Too bad, as most Americans, and Arizonans, (me too, a Mexican-American in Tucson) like it - why? They (me!) know what's going on. I could illegally cross the border into Mexico, kill some one, and come back without anyone over there recognizing me. How convenient. It happens here, not "happened", but happens HUNDREDS of time a year - Especially to young women (your daughter?). Read up.

very substancial point. clear and informative.

I was pulled over three times in a row on one night, for being brown if anything, one of those times for having a spider on my roof. I wasn't crossing the spider into the country. The officer apologized, he didn't realize they already pulled me over twice that night. I was coming home from work. I would have liked them to ask for my papers, and found I'm legal, and have been for three generations. Maybe they might remember me, and stop treating me like a criminal. They did, they put my picture up at the HQ as "not wanted". It's nice to not be wanted sometimes.

you say this with a straight face i wonder? "yes cops here are racists" whats new is giving raciest cops more room to discrimanate did you really need me to explain that to you? have you seen the old tapes of cops beating people during the civil rights movement well were going towards that again so i guess your right nothing new.

they do it all the time and get away with it, bill or no bill. it sucks i know but i still support the bill

A sad day when america becomes what you would let it be. you have no true concept of what america means. in this countries history there are many dark days but the light at the end of the tunnel was freedom and you and your leaders are hording the light.
your like the guy that see's a crime or some one that needs help and looks away. Im hope your proud of a law that "sucks i know but i still support the bill"

the interests of the corporate globalist agenda are served anyway this plays out, they always come out on top. thats why they are were they are, and we are were they want us.

very true, much like democrats and republicans and the people never seem to notice both parties do the same things.

Chapter 9 just read chapter 9 and maybe you will get a history lesson. Our immigration laws are stellar to Hitler and we are an example of what Germany could be.

Again, where are you getting these assumption and fallacies from! Please, just point me in the direction of you information. And no I do not mean more self-opinionated facts from you.

Can you please put your aluminum foil hat back on, because it is clear you are hearing voices.
It is either that or you are smoking piss from a mad cat - anyway you look at it, you have problems.

Belligerent nationalism comes in the form of "Undocumented immigrants cause crime and unemployment and thus they are ALL criminals and they must all leave, they are crippling and perverting this country" That is what many people here believe, maybe even you

Racism comes in the form of: "You are of brown skin I assume you are an undocumented immigrant" This applies to every single brown skinned person regardless of their status.

For your information this new law consists of both these things.

Also don't be surprised if American Hispanics are required to carry identification cards and badges just as the Jews did under Nazi Germany.

It does promote racism because it gives cops the power to stop brown people for no other reason other than the color of their skin That my friend is racism.

You make an excellent point and I do understand what the bill says but do you think any cop will read it and understand it? Many times they pull people over or accuse someone of doing something only because of how they dress or because of their ethnicity, whether they are Hispanic, Black or Asian.Many cops will stop people based on their ethnicity because they believe this bill gives them the right to do so.

Why just east of the mississippi are they not americans as well.I thought you want to keep the US safe from mexicans.Are you saying that the west is special because it was once Mexico and it has non whites who were drew inside the US border less than 100 years ago and you like hitler are intrigued at how the U.S has taken over and would like to see things done "like other countrys" more violent in other words. are you sad the west isnt white enough for you. What does illegal look like to you. Private prisons cost taxpayers more in the long run so do crap army man jobs for killers

Oh and my reply to oppressed1 applies to you to, "Asking for ID cards happens all over America, for all different reasons.".. here's a scenario for you, lets say god forbid you married a Hispanic woman and you guys had kids. Now lets say you wife took your kids to the park alone, now lets say a police officer thought it was 'reasonable' to ask her for her ID because she spoke Spanish to the children, but she left it at home. This could result in the wife and the children being taken to the station until the entire thing could be sorted out. Do you think that this would be an acceptable level of police power? No it might not be the definition of a police state to you, who I am assuming is white (or at least don't look Mexican), but to a family like this it would be much closer.

You are correct that it might not end up the way in the scenario as I illustrated earlier. I did exaggerate the possibilities to the extreme right to prove the danger of a statute like this. The situation could go either way, but if an officer has a prejudice against Hispanics it cannot be assumed that he will never extend his police power to the limit of becoming harassment. I do agree with you that we have a duty to abide by laws, but I also feel that as Americans who value 'liberty' we have a duty to root out unjust laws. I do not agree with illegal immigration or our current policy, but I do not want to hand over the power the the Police to sort out the mess. Racial profiling has been found to be unconstitutional and I cannot assume rationally that this law will not encourage its use.
You said ' I respectfully abide by the laws of America, even those I disagree with, and I expect foreigners of any nationality to do the same. ' As I said before I agree with you on obeying laws for the betterment of society. However, I cannot support a law where one violates it 'unknowingly or unwillfuly', the problem with a law like this is that it would result in a small percentage of American citizens who look Hispanic or display similar proxies related to being illegal, of being subject to a lifetime of stops by the police. One will never stop suddenly stop looking Hispanic, do we want those who are citizens to resort to wearing American flag badges identifying them as 'legals'. This law will not only intrude on the lives of illegals but also of American citizens who look 'reasonably illegal'. No matter what a persons view towards police, it will be degraded to the point of resentment after being subject to lifetime of stops and interrogations. This in turn will lead to the further feeling of minority communities that no matter what they do to integrate they will never be 'true Americans'. Situations like this lead to tempers flaring and the possibility of violence perpetrated by police or by citizens who have had enough.
This is the problem I have with this law.

Ignore history. Ignorance and apathy. I dont know and I don't care. That is your solution. Plenty of americans look like what could be thought of as mexican. You dont even know of the inspiration for nazi germany Hitler obsessed about the american west. Greed what do you owe?

There are traitors among you.... -_-

Sydney Crosby....

Nice of you to try to inject some humour into this debate.

By "Nazi Germany" do you mean the most technologically advanced and most innovative place of it's time? Or are you making a really weak comparison between a concentration camp and enforcing American laws through ID card checks?
Please tell me in what way an American state could possibly be "Nazi-like"? Is it that you don't know what it means, so you like to say it when you don't understand legislation? I like to think I know a lot about history, especially WWII history, and I can not see anything that Arizona and 'Nazi Germany' could possibly have in common. Please let me know. I am very curious.

That is what you wrote. You didnt know that hitler used the american west as an inspration to fashion his superior beliefs and the systematic killing of millions. The reservations are some of the worst places to live in america. People you concider "Mexican" would be concidered native american if born a few miles north, but they have no entitlement.The world should only care about time after you were born. Everyone agrees that we won the west just like we won Iraq! I meant you are greedy and bloodshed is not far back in our history.

It is the entry into my land without permission and in violation of the laws of my country. I respectfully abide by the laws of America, even those I disagree with, and I expect foreigners of any nationality to do the same.

So tell me how you would find this person. What would tip you off?

MLK said, "We have a moral obligation to disobey unjust laws."
I know your a language Nazi. Do you like the quotation marks? They are just for you!

What would cause you to ask someone for ID in the first place that is the question? Plus Nightclub owners will not detain me and give me a criminal record.

Pulled over for what you look like or pulled over because of your driving. I mean they had cause right?

When you got pulled over and were asked to show your I.D. the officer was required to have 'probable cause' to make that stop. The standard of probable cause requires the officer to think that you more likely than not committed whatever violation is in question. In other words probable cause is a preponderance of evidence beyond 51%+. The law in Nevada requires 'reasonable suspicion' or very similar standard which is 'would a reasonable person, believe it to be so', the problem with this sir is that this standard lays around 20% of likelihood. This means that if an officer can come up with a 'reasonable' answer for harassing, or as he would call it asking for Identification, an 'American Citizen', who looks of Hispanic decent, he would be in the clear. The problem with reasonable suspicion is that is too a low standard of a standard to allow the invasion of privacy, and 'unwarranted searches and siezures' without probable cause. Most police officers are not stupid, they know if they say 'he looked Hispanic (which is proxy for being illegal), and was speaking Spanish, and was in front of a Home Depot', they will be cleared under this standard of suspicion. Many similar arguments can be made to justify the stopping of citizens as well as immigrants, as long as the officer doesn't blatantly say 'i stopped him because he was Mexican'. That oppressed1 is why everyone is butthurt.

I didn't mean to state that this law may only be a violation to the 4th amendment, and let me highlight 'may'. Because a case dealing with this issue has not made it to court yet. But it also has problems as related to the 14th amendment and the equal protection and due process clauses. If i were an attorney I would argue that repeated stops and searches attributed to this law, can amount to a violation of unwarranted searches clause of the 4th amendment. I would also make the argument that 'liberty' is being violated by this statute. The 14th amendment bars violation of liberties without due process, I hold my liberty to be left alone when abiding the law as fundamental, and I am sure many of you and the courts would agree. This law leaves the window open to me being denied my liberty without due process, because all the process that was due was the judgment of a street officer that I looked 'reasonably suspicious' of being illegal.