Community | December 01, 2010 | 40 comments

Radiation ripples show the Big Bang may not have been the first, and there could be more to come

source: http://arXiv.org

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bundlebear
THE Big Bang might not have been the beginning of the universe, but just the start of a new chapter.
Scientists have found rings of radiation in the cosmos that may be older than the Big Bang, suggesting that event was just the latest in a series of rebirths, Wired reports.
The theory was proposed by Sir Roger Penrose, a theoretical physicist at Oxford University, and Vahe Gurzadyan of the Yerevan Physics Institute in Armenia, in an article on arXiv.org.
The circles of radiation appear in concentric circles made up of below average temperature in the cosmic microwave background (CMB), which is the leftover glow of the Big Bang.
The CMB — which dates back to 300,000 years after the Big Bang — is a consistent temperature, indicating the density.

According to the mathematical research, pulses of energy created a uniform region of dark matter, seen as circles. These pulses were the result of gravitational waves from previous eons running into the current one.
The researchers posit that a single Big Bang would release huge gravitational energy bursts, not in uniform waves as the circles indicate.
Sir Roger interprets the circles as ripple-like evidence of collisions between multiple supermassive black holes that occurred during the Universe's previous life, or eon, suggesting that there were and will be many more.
"What would normally be regarded as a probable entire history of our universe, starting with its Big Bang... is taken to be but one aeon in a (perhaps unending) succession of such aeons (sic)," the scientists say.
Sir Roger says these circles cannot be explained by the current "inflation theory" which posits that the universe grew rapidly from the size of an atom in the first nanoseconds of the Big Bang.
Inflation would most likely iron out these patterns, or not create them in the first place.
Princeton University cosmologist David Spergel told Wired that "the existence of large-scale coherent features in the microwave background of this form would appear to contradict the inflationary model".
However he added that there was not enough detail to assess the reality of the circles yet.


http://www.news.com.au/technology/radiation-rings-show-big-bang-may-have-been-ju...
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40 comments // Radiation ripples show the Big Bang may not have been the first, and there could be more to come

  • Logos51891
    • +1
      Logos51891  

    • I had always thought that this universe was not the first, and I have no idea why I would think that; it just made sense. How interesting that existence is possibly far older than we thought.

    • 1 year ago
  • UrbanGypsy
    • +2
      UrbanGypsy  

    • Interesting.... I wonder if the universe even had a beginning. HOW MIND BLOWING! Imagine something not even having had a beginning! We might never be able to explain everything, it is just so big and time so vast.

    • 1 year ago
  • CalgarC
  • alexandrek
  • Vierotchka
  • XasthurNortt
  • onemalefla
  • floydyboy
  • Vierotchka
    • +3
      Vierotchka  

    • http://revelations-2012.com/India_Creation.html

      According to Western scholars, the religious tradition that we know as Hinduism is the product of at least 5,000 years of development, with roots stretching back to the Indus Valley civilisation, which prospered about 5,000 years ago.

      However, the origins of this culture are shrouded in mystery and according to Hindu scriptures may be millions of years old. There are many Hindu creation stories but the one given here helps to explain one of the major Hindu beliefs - reincarnation.

      This is not the first world, nor is it the first universe. There have been and will be many more worlds and universes than there are drops of water in the holy river Ganges. The universes are made by Lord Brahma the Creator, maintained by Lord Vishnu the Preserver and destroyed by Lord Shiva. Since the universes must be destroyed before they can be recreated, Lord Shiva is called the Destroyer and Re-creator.

      In Hinduism, nature and all of God's creations are manifestations of Him. He is within and without his creations, pervading the entire universe and also observing it externally. Hence all animals and humans have a divine element in them that is covered by the ignorance and illusions of material or profane existence.

      After each old universe is destroyed nothing is left but a vast ocean. Floating on this ocean, resting on a great snake Ananta, is Lord Vishnu. Some say that a lotus flower springs from his navel and from this comes Lord Brahma. And it is from Lord Brahma that all creation comes.

      Lord Brahma grows lonely and splits himself in two to create male and female. Then he becomes one again and human beings are created. In the same way he creates all the other living things, from the great animals to the tiniest insects.

      Other stories suggest that everything comes from different parts of Lord Brahma's body. All the different animals and all the people come from his mouth, arms, thighs and feet. Everything comes from one - Lord Brahma, who is part of the Supreme One - so everything is part of the Supreme One.

      For this universe, this world and this Lord Brahma, like all those before and all those to come, will be destroyed by Lord Shiva.

      How long is the life of a universe? Its length is beyond imagination. One day to Lord Brahma is longer than four thousand million of the years that we know. Every night when Lord Brahma sleeps the world is destroyed. Every morning when he awakes it is created again. When the Lord Brahma of this universe has lived a lifetime of such days the universe is completely destroyed by Lord Shiva.

    • 1 year ago
  • observer2121
  • Vierotchka
    • +5
      Vierotchka  
    • observer2121:

      Many physicists and astrophysicists have remarked that the Indian (from India) cosmology and mythology accurately describe phenomena that modern physics and astrophysics are only discovering today. I think you know very little indeed about India's ancient culture and knowledge.

    • 1 year ago
  • carslut
    • +1
      carslut  
    • Vierotchka:

      That makes sense when you figure in that the ancients that conceived this scenario weren't privileged to know what we know now. If you break it down it could make sense.

    • 1 year ago
  • floydyboy
  • Vierotchka
  • dreamsenvoy
    • 0
      dreamsenvoy  
    • observer2121:

      All "fairytales" have truth in them,no matter how skewd.Religion brought us out of "the cave" now the neo religion or science is evolving us to the "stars".Right brain and Left brain are best utilized together as one.....just a thought

    • 1 year ago
  • mitekillem
  • fun_size
    • 0
      fun_size  

    • Similiar story was posted a little while back. Very interesting nonetheless. Makes sense that there was no a singular event to begin the universe(and time) since time itself is a human construct and there is no beginning or end to the universe. There just is...

    • 1 year ago
  • coolplanet
  • Vierotchka
  • Vierotchka
    • +1
      Vierotchka  
    • coolplanet:

      The Mayan civilization and culture are not all that old, compared to the Chinese, Egyptian and Indian ones:

      The Maya is a Mesoamerican civilization, noted for the only known fully developed written language of the pre-Columbian Americas, as well as its art, architecture, and mathematical and astronomical systems. Initially established during the Pre-Classic period (c. 2000 BC to 250 AD), according to the Mesoamerican chronology, many Maya cities reached their highest state of development during the Classic period (c. 250 AD to 900 AD), and continued throughout the Post-Classic period until the arrival of the Spanish.
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_civilization

    • 1 year ago
  • coolplanet
    • +1
      coolplanet  
    • Vierotchka:

      I certainly agree that the Maya civilization is younger than the Chinese, East Indian and Egyptian cultures. But their calender dates back to around 26,000 years ago at the time when paleoanthropologists and archaeologists now confirm humans lived in America. The oldest confirmed site in the Americas is Meaddowcroft Rock Shelter in Avalon, Pennsylvania, which dates back almost 30,000 years.
      Some 8,000 years ago Native Americans developed corn, beans, squash, pumpkins, amaranth, potatoes, tomatoes, peanuts, pineapples, papayas, manioc, chives, chilies, cashews, vanilla, cocoa, tobacco and cotton. They also invented the most accurate calenders known to man.
      So the Maya most probably knew this thousands of years ago, like I said.

    • 1 year ago
  • UrbanGypsy
  • coolplanet
    • 0
      coolplanet  
    • UrbanGypsy:

      The Maya did invent the wheel for childrens toys.
      But, due to the swampy Central American terrain, they had no use for the wheel for agriculture or transportation.
      Read all about it in 'Guns, Germs & Steel' by Jared Diamond.

    • 1 year ago
  • Vierotchka
    • +1
      Vierotchka  
    • coolplanet:

      The Mayan Calendar wasn't created 26,000 years ago - using the calculations they used, they could "backtrack" tens of thousands of years, just as we can back-project the position of the planets and the stars using astronomical calculations. My point is that the Indian civilization described the process of universes being created and destroyed, then created again and destroyed again, etc., before the Mayans - to my knowledge, there is no Mayan document describing this process.

    • 1 year ago
  • Vierotchka
  • coolplanet
    • 0
      coolplanet  
    • Vierotchka:

      Jared Diamond writes: "Ancient Native Mexicans invented wheeled vehicles with axles for use as toys, but not for transport. That seems incredible to us, until we reflect that ancient Mexicans lacked domestic animals to hitch to their wheeled vehicles, which therefore offered no advantage over human porters."

    • 1 year ago
  • Vierotchka
  • coolplanet
    • 0
      coolplanet  
    • Vierotchka:

      Well the Inca used Llama and Alpaca to transport stuff up mountains where no wheel could go. Perhaps Native Americans couldn't conceive of using a human for a beast of burdon.

    • 1 year ago
  • echelgreen
  • floydyboy
  • keithponder
  • Vierotchka
    • +4
      Vierotchka  
    • keithponder:

      That is NOT what you said - you said that Big Bangs were happening all over the universe, and I asked you for your source because my astrophysicist friend and his physicist wife (who works in CERN) had never heard of it.

    • 1 year ago
  • keithponder
  • keithponder
    • 0
      keithponder  
    • Image
    • Vierotchka:

      http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/viewnews.php?id=195811

      Radiation ripples suggest many Big Bangs
      ------------------------------------------------------------
      Image credit: NASA

      Scientists have found new evidence suggesting that the Big Bang might not have been the first or last.

      Radiation ripples have been discovered that are thought to actually predate the Big Bang adding support to the idea that we are in but one of several iterations of the universe brought about through a series of Big Bangs.

      "What would normally be regarded as a probable entire history of our universe, starting with its Big Bang. . . is taken to be but one aeon in a (perhaps unending) succession of such aeons (sic)," the scientists say
      --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      Read The Title. This Is Exactly What I Said. Many Means More Than One.

    • 1 year ago
  • Vierotchka
  • Vierotchka
    • +1
      Vierotchka  
    • keithponder:

      Here is what you wrote:

      Have we found the universe that existed before the Big Bang?

      No brainer here. So called Big Bangs are still happening all throughout the Universe.

      Here is my response:

      "So called Big Bangs are still happening all throughout the Universe."

      They are? Please give us some sources for this assertion, because my astrophysicist friend and his physicist wife (who works at CERN) have never heard of that.

      _____________

      So you see, I am right and you are wrong.

    • 1 year ago
  • mitekillem
    • 0
      mitekillem  
    • Vierotchka:

      Not only is the universe vast, and infinite, but it is also infinitely wondrous.
      Can you imagine the possibility that there could, in fact, be many big-bangs?
      The space that the one we came from could not fill the entire vastness of space all alone.
      Somewhere, in an unfathomable distance away, there is an empty space.
      Right next to that, are the remnants of another big-bang, or one waiting to happen.

      If space is infinite, you have to conceive the possibility that the big-bang was not a lone singularity.
      What if it's not a unique occurrence after all?
      After all, if we can create on in a lab, who's to say it doesn't happen naturally in abundance.

    • 1 year ago
  • Vierotchka
    • 0
      Vierotchka  
    • mitekillem:

      So far, no big bang was ever created in a lab. The Large Hadron Collider doesn't create big bangs - that it does is a misconception that has been spread by the media. The media also wrongly calls the LHC an "atom smasher", yet that is absolutely not what it does, neither was it designed to do so.

      As for the entire vastness of space, we don't know that it is infinite. Nothingness is not space, either, and scientists think that beyond our space is simply nothingness... which brings us back to ancient Indian philosophy and practices - the use of meditation (not in the western definition of the word) to achieve nothingness.

    • 1 year ago
  • remanns
    • +3
      remanns  

    • For something that,....uhm,....basically empty,....space manages to be very complex.

      ( I think I need the CliffsNotes ) +^d

    • 1 year ago
  • CalgarC
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