Community | July 22, 2011 | 189 comments

CNN Poll: Drop in liberal support pushes Obama approval rating down

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KB723
By: CNN Political Unit

Washington (CNN) – President Barack Obama's approval rating is down to 45 percent, driven in part by growing dissatisfaction on the left with the president's track record in office, according to a new national survey.

A CNN/ORC International Poll also indicates that the Republican "brand" is taking a beating in the minds of Americans.

Read full results (pdf).

The survey's Friday release comes as the Obama administration and top congressional officials continue talks on a potential deal tying roughly $3 trillion in new savings over the next decade to an increase in the nation's debt ceiling. If Congress and the President fail to raise the country's $14.3 trillion limit by August 2, Americans could face rising interest rates, a declining dollar and increasingly jittery financial markets, among other problems.

According to the poll, the president's 45 percent approval rating is down three points from June. Fifty-four percent of people questioned disapprove of how Obama's handling his duties, up six points from last month. His 54 percent disapproval rating ties the all-time high in CNN polling that the president initially reached just before last year's midterm elections.

"But drill down into that number and you'll see signs of a stirring discontent on the left," says CNN Polling Director Keating Holland. "Thirty-eight percent say they disapprove because President Obama has been too liberal, but 13 percent say they disapprove of Obama because he has not been liberal enough - nearly double what it was in May, when the question was last asked, and the first time that number has hit double digits in Obama's presidency."

Looking at that figure another way, roughly one in four Americans who disapprove of the president say they feel that way because he's not been liberal enough.

Obama's approval rating among liberals has dropped to 71 percent, the lowest point in his presidency. And the number of Democrats who want the party to renominate Obama next year, now at 77 percent, is relatively robust by historical standards but is also down a bit since June.

"It's likely that this is a reaction to some of Obama's recent actions, including his willingness to discuss major changes in Social Security and Medicare as part of the debt ceiling negotiations," adds Holland.

Some congressional Democrats appeared to be on the verge of open revolt against their own president Thursday night after hearing some of the details in the $3 trillion plan - a package many of them contend does not do nearly enough to ensure wealthier Americans share in the burden of stemming the tide of Washington's red ink.

Those Democrats are desperately trying to protect some of their party's primary legacies - entitlements such as Social Security and Medicare, programs forged at the height of the New Deal and Great Society.

On the other side of the negotiating table, the poll indicates that GOP is also not faring all that well. Fifty-five percent say they have an unfavorable view of the Republican party, a seven-point increase since March. The Democratic party's favorable rating is not much better, but it has held steady.

And only 37 percent say the policies of the Republican leaders in Congress would move the country in the right direction - a nine-point drop since the start of the year, when the GOP took over control of the House of Representatives.

"Although most Americans say that Obama is not doing enough to cooperate with the GOP, even more say that the Republicans need to cooperate more with the president," says Holland.

The poll was conducted for CNN by ORC International on July 18-20, with 1,009 adult Americans questioned by telephone. The survey's overall sampling error is plus or minus three percentage points.

– CNN Deputy Political Director Paul Steinhauser contributed to this story.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/07/22/cnn-poll-drop-in-liberal-support...

"D'Oh!!!" "WhodaThunk???"
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189 comments // CNN Poll: Drop in liberal support pushes Obama approval rating down

  • JohnA
  • MikeMaddigan
    • 0
      MikeMaddigan  

    • If by not supporting Obama we get President Bachmann...maybe then the American people will finally be hurt badly enough to wake up and fight for fairness and justice at the ballot box? Democratic leaders who continue to support and validate Republican policies will never bring about any meaningful change. By continuing to elect Democrats who act like Republicans what you're agreeing to is this:

      Bill Maher's new rule:

      "If you become President you must tell voters the simple truth...that America's best days are behind us, but that you will help manage our inevitable decline, and do your best to see that we fall as gracefully as possible...and really stick the landing."

      There you have it. So, go ahead. Keep voting for the status quo.

    • 10 months ago
  • jackhole
    • 0
      jackhole  

    • @ timelord999:
      I am truly heartbroken for what you, your family and a multitude of Americans have and continue to endure. I can tell you are a loving man ( regardless of the incoherent attacks) who is facing a dire situation, believe it or not I stand with you, so I will no longer attempt to engage you in any kind of discussion. I do hope that things workout for you and that perhaps one day when your mind is not so clouded by pain we can have fruitful discourse.

      I send you and your loved ones all the positive energy I can muster.

      Be well.

      Most sincerely from one American to another,

      JH.

    • 10 months ago
  • hombre76
    • 0
      hombre76  

    • jackhole and others like him have rightly pointed out that if Obama is a shit sandwich then the GOP are an ocean of radioactive decay and fecies. so the choice is clear as tto wich meal to choke down. But dont for a god damn second think that we are going to do it with out a bunch of bitching anmoaning and down right anger constantly trying to get through to the rest of our party how to make a "Proper" sandwitch in the future that does not have so much Shit in it next time OK?

    • 10 months ago
  • jackhole
    • -2
      jackhole  
    • hombre76:

      Let me be precise, regardless of some political dealing Obama has done more than any Republican president has done combined in the last 3 decades. I don't have to agree with everything he has done in office to cast a vote for him on 2012.

      If ANYONE ( is that ok? ) thinks he can repair overnight the mess caused by the Republicans have caused then THEY MUST be amateur political observers, this mess is going to last beyond the obama presidency. The last thing we need is another Republican at the helm making things worst, and believe it they would.

    • 10 months ago
  • Fishinflick
  • squarethecircle
  • Milieu
    • +6
      Milieu  
    • timelord999:

      Emotionally, I'm with you, but................................... the times have changed. Yes, I worked for Bobby, and John (who was going to use his Knights of Columbus sword to kill Protestant babies), and was there in the South when things blew up when MLK was assassinated.

      Rationally, I have to accept that the Republic Syndicate's below-the-radar work of the last 40 years is bearing fruit that is costing us.

      I call and write Tea Bagger Congresspoopheads on a regular basis but there is no way I can offset the work of ALEC and the Kochs and the Waltons.

      The President is NOT a King, he can only work within the constraints of the Constitution that the Republic Syndicate has hijacked.

      Want to blame somebody, blame the Ignorant, retarded, brain-dead people who voted for Raygun, George II, and George III and allowed the country to get where we are now.

      Blame the @$$Wholes who voted for Ralph Nader who helped put Idiot boy George III in office.

      Blame the lazy @$$e$ who will/are sitting on their butts right now instead of getting out and spreading the word of ALEC and what the Republic Syndicate and their Masters are doing to our country.

      Like you I'm very close to retirement age and I'm sweating what the Republic Syndicate is going to do to Social Safety net. I have Type 1 Diabetes and have had 2 heart attacks, who is going hire me if I lose my job? How am I going to find a job that will even come close to paying for the meds I need just to stay alive?

      But is it Obama's fault? I think not. It's the Effing people's fault for not paying attention to what was being done to them.

    • 10 months ago
  • Buckeye_Bill
    • +6
      Buckeye_Bill  
    • timelord999:

      I'm a few years older than you, which when it comes down to counting straws makes little difference, except I am in the same boat with you when it comes to what we will be receiving in repayment of our contributions to SS and MediCare in ten year's time. Think what it will be like for those 55 years old and younger? They are facing a much grimmer future in my estimation. Just remember, Republicans have been wailing about SS since it began back in the 1930s and MediCare since the 1960s! Their "plan" is for everyone to fend for themselves. An every man, or woman, sink or swim alone plan. But the Preamble to the Constitution expressed a different direction for us as a society. To form a Union to ensure the General Welfare for all its citizens. The very definition of what a society is supposed to do for one another! Republicans have no "plan", really. They have no road map to the future that will include us all. They're "lost at sea", so to speak. It's our duty and responsibility to help put them on the "right track", though. After all, they are our mothers and fathers, brothers and sisters, cousins, nieces and nephews, grandfathers and grannies. Grannies? Yuppers, grannies, too!

      Have you heard this one... "A woman in a hot air balloon realized she was lost. She lowered her altitude and spotted a man in a boat below. She shouted to him, "Excuse me, can you help me? I promised a friend I would meet him an hour ago, but I don't know where I am." The man consulted his portable GPS and replied, "You're in a hot air balloon, approximately 30 feet above ground elevation of 2,346 feet above sea level. You are at 31 degrees, 14.97 minutes north latitude and 100 degrees, 49.09 minutes west longitude. She rolled her eyes and said, "You must be an Obama Democrat". "I am," replied the man. "How did you know?". "Well," answered the balloonist, "everything you told me is technically correct. But I have no idea what to do with your information, and I'm still lost. Frankly, you've not been much help to me". The man smiled and responded, "You must be a Republican". "I am," replied the balloonist. "How did you know?" "Well," said the man, "you don't know where you are or where you are going. You've risen to where you are due to a large quantity of hot air. You made a promise you have no idea how to keep, and you expect me to solve your problem. You're in exactly the same position you were in before we met, but somehow, now it's my fault."

    • 10 months ago
  • SandyBerman
  • Buckeye_Bill
    • +3
      Buckeye_Bill  
    • SandyBerman:

      Here I go regurgitating again. But us old folks do that sometimes. But when someone brings up HHH's name, it harkens back to a time when he was a "man of the people". This audio clip is so reminiscent of the man many have denigrated over the years. AND brings up a delicate "situation" for Republicans concerning their Grand Pooba, Ronnie Raygun, who they saw as their Moses!

      Isn't it amazing how things really never do change with regards politics and how the issues of the past are always with us today?

      P.S. I was an HHH supporter back in '68.

    • 10 months ago
  • figgdimension
  • jackhole
    • -1
      jackhole  
    • timelord999:

      Good for you be angry a lot more people need to be angry. But went you begin a rant calling me an Obamabot don't expect me to take you seriously, news flash if we don't fix what's wrong soon I and everyone else will be affected in the future.

      Obama inherited an 8yr Republican mess and yes he has yielded more than I liked to see him done and YES he has to play politics in a corrupt system big surprise. But he has kept us, so far, from another great depression and works tirelessly to make sure us working class dogs have something to hang on still, will the Republicans do this? Will you vote for them?

    • 10 months ago
  • SandyBerman
  • Buckeye_Bill
    • +7
      Buckeye_Bill  
    • Image
    • jackhole:

      I've read many of your posts and didn't feel you were lambasting timelord999, but I sure didn't want to poke my nose in where it doesn't belong. I have really enjoyed reading most of the comments posted. We may disagree on some points and see what we want to in respect of who Mr. Obama is and what he's done pro or con on issues that matter to us all.

      All I ask of myself and others is to not be so judgemental of our fellow commenters when they say something that doesn't quite mesh with our own understandings of the shortcomings of a President whose hands have been tied since day one. He couldn't do anything by himself. He needed help from his base. But what can be done when there's just enough votes in either the Senate or HOR to quash his attempts to right the wrongs of the past Administration? I blame it more on those damnedable Blue Dogs that were constantly siding with the Republicans thwarting his every move. It's a tired, worn out argument to say that Democrats have had the bully pulpit since 2006 or 2008. It only takes one Republican to stop a bill from coming to the floor for a vote that needs a super majority to pass. The following is something we all should be proud of what this man has done in such a short time:

      Source: http://planetpov.com/2011/02/13/a-short-list-of-pres-obamas-accomplishments/

      There are those on both the Right and Left who assail President Obama for not doing enough as President (or for some on the Right, for doing too much). Some have stated that he has not kept his campaign promises, others say that he has compromised himself and his principles in far too many cases.

      Presented for your review, here is just a fraction of items from the list at Politifact.com of campaign promises kept by Pres. Obama. I recommend visiting their site to review the complete 7 page list, it is impressive http://politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/rulings/promise-kept/ :

      A SAMPLE OF CAMPAIGN PROMISES KEPT BY PRESIDENT OBAMA:
      No. 4: Extend child tax credits and marriage-penalty fixes
      No. 16: Increase minority access to capital
      No. 33: Establish a credit card bill of rights
      No. 36: Expand loan programs for small businesses
      No. 37: Extend the Bush tax cuts for lower incomes
      No. 38: Extend the Bush tax cuts for those making less than $250,000 (couples) or $200,000 (single)
      No. 48: Close the “doughnut hole” in Medicare prescription drug plan
      No. 51: Require insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions
      No. 53: Give tax credits to those who need help to pay health premiums
      No. 55: Require large employers to contribute to a national health plan
      No. 56: Require children to have health insurance coverage
      No. 57: Expand eligibility for Medicaid
      No. 58: Expand eligibility for State Children’s Health Insurance Fund (SCHIP)
      No. 63: Require health plans to disclose how much of the premium goes to patient care
      No. 65: Establish an independent health institute to provide accurate and objective information
      No. 69: In non-competitive markets, force insurers to pay out a reasonable share of their premiums for patient care
      No. 70: Eliminate the higher subsidies to Medicare Advantage plans
      No. 93: Reinstate executive order to hire an additional 100,000 federal employees with disabilities within five years.
      No. 105: Increase the Veterans Administration budget to recruit and retain more mental health
      No. 109: Fully fund the Veterans Administration
      No. 113: Expand the Veterans Administration’s number of “centers of excellence” in specialty care
      No. 121: Fully fund the Violence Against Women Act
      No. 125: Direct military leaders to end war in Iraq
      No. 126: Begin removing combat brigades from Iraq
      No. 132: No permanent bases in Iraq
      No. 161: End the abuse of supplemental budgets for war
      No. 167: Make U.S. military aid to Pakistan conditional on anti-terror efforts
      No. 172: Open “America Houses” in Islamic cities around the globe
      No. 182: Allocate Homeland Security funding according to risk
      No. 195: Seek verifiable reductions in nuclear stockpiles
      No. 196: Extend monitoring and verification provisions of the START I Treaty
      No. 197: Stand down nuclear forces to be reduced under the Moscow Treaty
      No. 215: Create a rapid response fund for emerging democracies
      No. 222: Grant Americans unrestricted rights to visit family and send money to Cuba
      No. 225: Establish an Energy Partnership for the Americas
      No. 229: Expand the Nurse-Family Partnership to all low-income, first-time mothers
      No. 239: Release presidential records
      No. 241: Require new hires to sign a form affirming their hiring was not due to political affiliation or contributions.
      No. 244: Provide affordable, high-quality child care
      No. 247: Recruit math and science degree graduates to the teaching profession
      No. 259: Reduce subsidies to private student lenders and protect student borrowers
      No. 269: Increase funding for national parks and forests
      No. 275: Expand Pell grants for low-income students
      No. 290: Push for enactment of Matthew Shepard Act, which expands hate crime law to include sexual orientation and other factors
      No. 293: Repeal “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” policy
      No. 315: Establish ‘Promise Neighborhoods’ for areas of concentrated poverty
      No. 359: Rebuild schools in New Orleans
      No. 371: Fund a major expansion of AmeriCorps
      No. 411: Work to overturn Ledbetter vs. Goodyear
      No. 422: Create new financial regulations
      No. 427: Ban lobbyist gifts to executive employees
      No. 433: Sign a “universal” health care bill
      No. 435: Create new criminal penalties for mortgage fraud
      No. 449: Raise fuel economy standards
      No. 458: Invest in all types of alternative energy
      No. 483: Invest in public transportation
      No. 495: Double federal spending for research on clean fuels
      No. 500: Increase funding for the Environmental Protection Agency
      No. 507: Extend unemployment insurance benefits and temporarily suspend taxes on these benefits
      No. 513: Reverse restrictions on stem cell research

      Again, please keep in mind that this is only a fraction of the promises he has kept. I don’t think there is another president in recent history who could present such a list.

      Instead of opinion-based memes, I invite those on the Left and Right to consider the facts of what President Obama has accomplished to benefit the majority of Americans and if they maintain a negative view of him, list what items Bush accomplished to benefit most Americans in the first two years of his presidency or what a Repub candidate in 2012 would do in the first two years of theirs.

      My addendum: He got UBL!!! Don't overlook that!

    • 10 months ago
  • WagonMaster
    • +5
      WagonMaster  
    • timelord999:

      I feel your pain and frustration, man. I'm with you.... except: we need to vote to keep the GOP out of the Presidency and help in the dismantling of the Rethuglican party as a major power group...to do this we must vote a straight Democratic ticket, even tho it chokes the shit out of most of we, the dissatisfied. Ugly to say, but the lesser of 2 evils and the devil you know rules apply.

    • 10 months ago
  • Buckeye_Bill
    • +5
      Buckeye_Bill  
    • Image
    • SandyBerman:

      Are you sayng that we all can argue, spit and cuss but when the time comes, we've got to make up and vote for the Party that is the last hope for humanity? Is that what you're saying?

      Gawd...I hope so! I'm grinning ear to ear wanting it to become reality!

    • 10 months ago
  • hombre76
    • -1
      hombre76  
    • SandyBerman:

      seriosly sandy your generations dislike of Hubert was not the reason Nixon won, he won cause he killed robert just like he did John in the first place. Then there was no one left that would have done a thing to help you all the rest where to scared they would be killed at that point.

    • 10 months ago
  • Buckeye_Bill
    • +4
      Buckeye_Bill  
    • timelord999:

      This shall be my last contribution to this thread. I promise! I just wanted to express my empathy for you and your bestest half. I was brought up in the belief that, yes, I AM my brothers' and sisters' keeper, as we all should be. My heart goes out to all that have had to experience any lack of support either financially or physically.

      If I were a Prince, I would wish to be a King.
      If I were a King, I would wish to be a President.
      If I were a President, I would wish to be a Pharaoh.
      If I were a Pharaoh, I would wish to be a Ceasar.
      If I were a Ceasar, I would wish to be a (g)od.

      And if I were a (g)od........Republicans wouldn't like that!

      However, all I am is an ordinary, average guy.

      But things sure as Hell would be a lot better for my fellow human beings! Yes, even for Republicans, too. And maybe they would see the light and end their insane concept of everyone for themselves attitude.

      My motto I live by is, "The worst that life has to offer is better than what death has to give."

      fini

    • 10 months ago
  • jackhole
    • +1
      jackhole  
    • Buckeye_Bill:

      Thanks for that. Actually I have quoted many of those points you have been so kind to list. Normally I welcome a different view and bold lies about the POTUS generally do no make me foam at the mouth, I am a staunch Obama supporter, however I have never been so enamored with the idea of the man that I cannot see his mistakes.

      When timelord999 erroneously labeled me an Obamabot I decided to make my point using my unique charm, but now I see he's not fit to be engaged in any real discourse.

    • 10 months ago
  • SFirman
  • SFirman
  • SFirman
  • SFirman
  • JustTheFacts
  • jackhole
  • JustTheFacts
  • jackhole
  • nardo1224
  • SFirman
  • ithink
    • +3
      ithink  

    • Hey folks wake up he is not talking about cuts on the reciepient end hes talking about the delivery end and that is what is driving the republicans crazy

    • 10 months ago
  • mii
    • +6
      mii  

    • Supreme Court after 2012 could be
      the scariest thing ever if we don't stick
      together. Obama has disappointed in many
      ways, but we still need him in the White House.

    • 10 months ago
  • squarethecircle
    • +1
      squarethecircle  

    • "The most perplexing form of evil, and especially for all idealists, is that kind of evil which comes out of our efforts to do good. Perhaps when we try to do good without love, we create evil." William Irwin Thompson

      "The way is not in the sky, the way is in the heart." Dhammapada

    • 10 months ago
  • Buckeye_Bill
    • +4
      Buckeye_Bill  
    • squarethecircle:

      "One should see the world, and see himself as a scale with an equal balance of good and evil. When he does one good deed the scale is tipped to the good - he and the world is saved. When he does one evil deed the scale is tipped to the bad - he and the world is destroyed."
      Maimonides

      "The heart is deceitful above all things and beyond cure. Who can understand it?"
      Jeremiah 17:9

    • 10 months ago
  • squarethecircle
  • Valence
    • +9
      Valence  

    • Doesn't something scream narcissism in the back of peoples heads? It does in my mind. Every time Obama does something or doesn't do something his "Approval Rating" goes down, i didn't see this much butt-hurt when President George Bush was taking a gigantic Shit on the Face of Mrs. Liberty.

      I don't know about anybody else, but i am for one completely fed up with this whole Bandwagon thing of Hating Obama... "Obama's not doing this, Obama's not doing that, Obama promised this and Obama is not doing that." Shut The Front Door and as in front door, i mean that Hole that spouts Shit ever chance it gets about the President of the United States of America.

      Whens the last time any freaking politician has given a 100% Follow through with their campaign remakes?As the President he is doing what he can do, how about many of you A-Hole's go give some of the congressmen and women some of the Hate because guess what, THEY ARE BEHIND THE SCENES! Whatever power the President has is checked by Congress, so President Obama cannot just do shit with his Fucking Magical Elder Wand. Go pick up a Goddamn Social Studies Book, learn about your own Freaking Government.

      To think i actually liked CNN, with them pushing this B.S.

    • 10 months ago
  • Conniepae
    • +3
      Conniepae  
    • Valence:

      Voted up! I too liked CNN. That day is gone! They are no different than FOX. Murdoch could be leading them too. American talking heads have no credibility! They spin division with purpose. They are leading people to believe spin is fact. They have lead us down this 'earth is flat' memtality. They are an "Assault on Reason" and US! 24/7 news organizations are responsible for tearing this country apart with divisive political rhetoric.

    • 10 months ago
  • Valence
  • jim_b
  • timelord999
  • Valence
  • Conniepae
    • -1
      Conniepae  
    • timelord999:

      Don't stop screaming! Someone has to. Your points are profound. Even if he was doing what he could, the end is going to be the same. The middle class are going to be hurt by the compromises he has made.

      As sad as it makes me. McCain/Palin would have been so much worse. I too will vote for Bernie Sanders in a primary if he runs. I couldn't vote for a Republican, but I have lost faith in our political parties. Too many have sold their souls to corporations, in their quest for campaign money.

      Money talks in America. Sadly, those of us who need voices who speak for us, have been sold down the river, to the highest bidders.

      The best thing that could happen for American politics, would be for Rupert Murdoch's crimes to come to light and hold him accountable. American media is corrupt to the core. Sadly, I can't think of a media outlet I trust. Trust is earned. So is shame. Shame on them all!

    • 10 months ago
  • SFirman
  • FoosMaster
    • +1
      FoosMaster  
    • Conniepae:

      Sadly you and 999 have good points. It does seem that Many politicians, including Obama have sold us out. But to me the Bigger issue is the Republicans and what we KNOW they want to do to us! I to wish for better politicians but there are far too few so it truly does come down to "the lesser of two evils". Until there is a better choice I will continue to vote for “the lesser of two evils” because to vote against my own interests just because I am mad or to even not vote at all because I am mad is just “not in my best interest” and I will not help the Republicans!
      Sure Obama “seems” to be letting us down but I am just not so sure that it has not been all a game of poker being played and Obama could be bluffing. Regardless, there have been many things that have been done or omitted that I am mad about but it has not been all Obama’s fault, I blame the Republicans for nearly ALL of it! It’s not like Obama went into the Healthcare talks wanting to give the insurance companies a gift and to throw away Universal Healthcare, he actually Tried to get Universal Healthcare but didn’t have enough votes for it.
      You and 999 have mentioned that you would like to see Bernie Sanders as President. So would I and nearly every Progressive/Liberal in this country but it is just not possible at this time to run against a sitting president in his own party and the independent party of Bernie Sanders is just not yet strong enough to win him the presidency, yet! So, I ask “would you vote for a Obama/Sanders ticket?” because that is what I have been pushing for. I feel that if Bernie was VP that he would have more of the Presidents ear and be able to fight for Us better and would also be in a better position to run and Win in 2016.
      As I have said before, to me, it is about Defeating the Republicans, not getting the perfect President for my views *(Bernie Sanders), so I will vote for “my best interests” which means voting Against any Republican! If that makes me an “Obamabot” then so be it, I will use my vote ‘Against’ Republicans because to me this truly is about “the lesser of two evils” and I do not want the greater evil in office!

    • 10 months ago
  • jackhole
    • -2
      jackhole  

    • Yeah the idiots discontents are the same malcontents who voted independent or stayed at home during the mid-term elections handing the house to the Republicans.

      If people are pissed at Obama I wan't to see some tangible solutions not hot air or how about protesting what's wrong.

    • 10 months ago
  • KB723
  • jackhole
    • +1
      jackhole  
    • KB723:

      I don't agree with Obama on a lot of things, The wars, Not setting strict guide lines of what was expected of the companies and financial institutions bailed out, currently with not properly funding Nasa.

      But I'm not in a soup kitchen, yet, looking for my next meal. if we follow the current GOP policies I will be asking if they serve bread with the soup soon enough.

    • 10 months ago
  • KB723
  • jackhole
    • +1
      jackhole  
    • KB723:

      Always begin with the realization that DC is politics, the place where lies are bought and sold. Then follow with the premise of "the lesser of two evils" no matter which way you slice it it's a two party system no?

    • 10 months ago
  • KB723
  • Buckeye_Bill
    • +7
      Buckeye_Bill  
    • jackhole:

      There's no such thing as an "independent" voter. It's a fallacy. When you get deeper into who they are, you find out that they do lean one way or the other and either vote R or D 99% of the time. If there were such a thing, why don't they start a third Party and kick the crap out of the other two? I've read where there's 25% of voters that say they are Democrats and 23% say they are Republicans. That leaves quite a large number of voters that could change the way this country is run if they did exist. And when you understand that only 60% or less that actually vote, the numbers just don't support the concept that a large independent group exists. But, when the rubber meets the road, things are much closer than we are led to believe. I think it's less than 10% that call themselves independents in as much as they swing one way and then another depending on who they think sings their song on any given voting day. They don't really understand the ramifications of their vote. They don't follow politics enough to be informed about a particular politician's stand on subject matters. They are easily swayed by irrational things like looks or the way the politician speaks than whether or not the politician has a grasp of economics or foreign policy. Just take into account those that would vote Sarah Palin into the White House! They have to be ignorant to think that would be a good thing. The vast majority of those that are registered Independent really do vote either for a Democrat or Republican time and again and seldom mix their vote up enough to be a true Independent. And in many states they limit their voting power since those states do not allow them to pick a politician in primaries. They are only allowed to vote in the general election.

      Prove me wrong independents. Create a third political Party! Stop whining about how you have such a dilemma over who you want to vote for. Because if there were such a thing as a large block of independent voters, there would be much bigger spreads when it comes to counting the votes at the end of the day.

      But, I do have a disclaimer to throw out. In some states voters can cross political lines to vote for the other side to ensure their politician wins in the general election when they cross back!

      I have another disclaimer. As in Wisconsin, when you piss off enough so-called Republicans, they will cross over to vote in a Democrat when they finally realize their pocketbook is threatened! Because when it comes down to it, even those that call themselves Republicans, will sometimes wake up to the fact that a real Democrat does have their best interests, the working class, in mind. Of course, there's always exceptions to every rule. Like when enough Democrats voted in Ronnie Raygun. But you can't call them an Independent voter because of one vote against their own Party every twenty or thirty years!

      Politics is messy and complicated. I hate the fact that many Republican Governors are making it more difficult for the middle class and poor to vote by disenfranchising voters by making it harder for them to exercise their voting rights. It just goes to show us who is really for the working man/woman!

    • 10 months ago
  • jackhole
  • squarethecircle
  • squarethecircle
  • SFirman
  • hurleyburly
    • +9
      hurleyburly  

    • I can't remember what comedian or talking head said..the only thing Obama would have to worry about is the Obama 08 version..but, it's true. You can't keep running over your base in order to appeal to the independents and expect your base to dust themselves off and grin and shake it off. Count me as one of the disappointed. I have bruises and cuts from this Democratic administration....with friends like these...etc.etc.

    • 10 months ago
  • KB723
  • Vic_Romano
  • KB723
  • Johnny_Los_Angeles
  • KB723
  • squarethecircle
    • +1
      squarethecircle  
    • Johnny_Los_Angeles:

      No shit....sick of it....by all means people if you want to stay uninformed and ignorant I won't impose, but please don't push ignorance as fact on everyone else. I don't like being spoon fed BS when I can consume truth...it's out there you just have to care and look.

    • 10 months ago
  • Fishinflick
    • +8
      Fishinflick  

    • He's gonna win in 2012. There's enough Obamabots out there still buying the brand. The Repugs need him to prevent a class war uprising, and they know it. They'll prop up a few kooks who say outrageous things, so we can get real upset, but they aren't - this is all working out great for them!

      Despite 80% of the population that doesn't want him to touch the big 3, which has nothing to do with the debt ceiling, which has nothing to do with job creation, he'll cut them and Dem spin will make him into just a real regular guy, tryin' his best to get something done. And the faithful will say, he'll get around to us next term, just you wait and see! I'm just waiting to see what the next carrot is...

      You gotta hand it to 'em, Team Obama is brilliant. The 2012 election spin cycle will be dizzying! Everything will come out soft and fluffy in the wash! And you'll still be broke, and underemployed, and the rich will get richer.

      I just don't know when people will wake up and realize that the only way to stop this political dog & pony show propping up the corporate coup is to take the issues to the streets, participate in non-violent civil disobedience, disrupt the conventions in 2012, take responsibility ourselves to speak for ourselves and fight. But don't take my word for it, keep on playin' politics if it gets you off. You may think you have all the time in the world, but you don't. Yer just puttin' off the inevitable.

    • 10 months ago
  • Leen61
  • MikeMaddigan
  • VFORVENDETTA
  • Imzadi
  • squarethecircle
  • timelord999
  • squarethecircle
    • +3
      squarethecircle  
    • timelord999:

      He is a politician in a crooked system. Very few good people decide they want to rule the world and the smart ones already know the President can't affect the "change we need", we have to do that ourselves. We need to all take a step back and not play by their rules. It is us that has the answers.

    • 10 months ago
  • Leen61
  • timelord999
  • Leen61
  • nobsartist
  • Mkkay
    • -2
      Mkkay  

    • I don't understand why Obama's poll numbers are as high as they are! Maybe because black voters are still mostly behind him. I've been done with him for a long time. I will not vote for president, if my only choices are Obama or one of the Republicans. I've even considered writing in 'none of the above' on the 2012 ballot.

      I wish Senator Bernie Sanders would run for President! I would not only vote for him, I would donate to his campaign! It's time for an Independent President. That would shake things up and shock the hell out of the establishment!

    • 10 months ago
  • Misti
  • nobsartist
  • SFirman
  • Misti
  • SFirman
  • Imzadi
  • squarethecircle
  • Mkkay
    • 0
      Mkkay  
    • SFirman:

      I don't understand people who are still behind him. Why are you still behind him? I'd really like to know. As far as I'm concerned he's turned out to be the opposite of what I voted for, in fact, sometimes I call him Bush III, only supposedly, he's a Democrat instead of a Republican!

    • 10 months ago
  • SFirman
    • +1
      SFirman  
    • Mkkay:

      I stand by him for what he has accomplished, the promises that were kept, I know he came into office with a mess and no help from Republicans and the blue dog dems, I never believed he could change Washington or fix our country quickly. I don't know any president that could keep all promises. I don't believe he is any thing like Bush, so I don't think of him as a Republican. I believe for Washington to work there has to be some kind of agreement between the parties.. When I look at the Republicans running I believe he will be better then them. I think by writing someone in or voting independent is like not voting at all.

    • 10 months ago
  • Mkkay
    • -1
      Mkkay  
    • SFirman:

      Thanks for trying to explain, but I still don't understand. What has he accomplished and what promises were kept that you appreciate? I think he has messed up almost everything he's done by caving to Blue Dogs, Republicans and special interests. He never takes a strong position and spells out clearly what he wants and what he won't accept and he never backs his base.

      By writing someone in or voting independent, I'm stating that the Democratic and Republican choices are unacceptable. If more people would actually take a chance and back someone they really want instead of voting for the person they perceive to be the lesser of two evils, maybe we'd actually get some real change in our government.

    • 10 months ago
  • SFirman
    • 0
      SFirman  
    • Image
    • Mkkay:

      I wish I had the energy to type all of his accomplishments and promises kept in just 21/2 years so I am going to put up two sites for you to read. I appreciate all of them. With the rest of this term and another four years he can do much more. Go to the bottom of the page and read all under issues

      http://www.whitehouse.gov

    • 10 months ago
  • SFirman
  • TrishR
    • +6
      TrishR  

    • It seems to have finally dawned on Obama that when the republicans in congress said their Primary Goal was to thwart him in any way they weren't just kidding around.

      I hope the teapartiers are happy when we are all eating alpo while the economy continues to crumble. And at the rate things are going, there won't even be bridges to use for shelter with an infrastructure that's been neglected for so long.

    • 10 months ago
  • squarethecircle
  • COMMONSENSEFORCOMMONGOOD_COM
    • +5
      COMMONSENSEFORCOMMONGOOD_COM  

    • Well, I just watched Obama tell the American people that he offered substantial cuts to medicare, social security and other social programs to republicans in his proposed budget. I will not support Obama in any way now, irrespective of how circuitous of a strategy he might be employing. No amount of rhetoric can undo the image of a leader willing to let the people bleed more than they already have, which his own words have created.

    • 10 months ago
  • MikeMaddigan
    • +3
      MikeMaddigan  
    • SandyBerman:

      As I said in the other thread Sandy, he can never walk it back. The President has been rope a doped. He is on record supporting cuts to Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. The GOP position has not changed. They gave in on absolutely nothing. No tax increases were part of this proposed deal. "Revenue" increases were only a promise to raise some kind of revenue in some voodoo manner, not affecting the wealthy or corporations.

      Obama is now on record calling a wickedly unfair deal "an extraordiarily fair deal." I'm done going down this road. If this is a game I am done with games. How does the President walk back his position in 2012 when the GOP hammers him on his proposed CUTS to the big 3? What kind of Democrat continues to use the Republican talking points, calling Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid "entitlements," instead of calling these programs "insurance" which is what they are? Sorry, but the President has been fooled into having this false argument on a manufactured crisis. From both sides this "game" has ended in a lose/lose, except that we are now willing to make cuts and they are still not ever going to agree on tax increases. How does that play out in 2012 campaign ads?

    • 10 months ago
  • Fishinflick
  • nobsartist
  • tverdell
  • SFirman
  • squarethecircle
  • squarethecircle
    • +1
      squarethecircle  
    • MikeMaddigan:

      it is a game, all for our entertainment, so we can think our vote counts and be distracted by bunk. They are all on the same team and we are the defeated so far. Stop playing by their rules and it all can end sooner than later.

    • 10 months ago
  • Mkkay
    • 0
      Mkkay  
    • SandyBerman:

      You have no way of knowing that for certain. It's pure speculation, or wishful thinking. They could have agreed to it! They still might in the future. Now that he's put those programs "on the table", they're likely to stay there in future budget talks. Those programs should not even be a part of this debate. The Bush/Obama tax cuts, and the wars are the biggest contributors to out our debt and deficit problems. And then there were the drop in the economy, TARP and the stimulus. Social Security shouldn't even be a part of the general budget to begin with!

    • 10 months ago
  • Mkkay
  • hombre76
    • +5
      hombre76  

    • I say the pres needs to do everything in his power to get us jobs cut out these wars and millitary spending and tax the wealthy even if that meens useing the 14th amendment and or pressing the envelope on his executive power to ram through what we need to get americans back to work or we not just as a party but as a nation are fucked.

    • 10 months ago
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