Continual Arrests for ‘Operating Without a Permit’ When City Doesn’t Provide Permit

You might want to mention that you are not an objective source. You are one of the drivers and have a vested interest in the operation, hence you have a clear conflict of interest.
As such, anything you write or say on the matter is suspect.

I figure people can read for themselves.

many thanks. I will read it.

true. But there's always a limit to objectivity.

Ok now i can look at this with some facts:

-"TDAA recommended that the city “Require training and tests for pedicab permits; Limit the hours of operation and busy streets for vehicles; Adopt a cap or a market saturation formula for pedicab permits and consider impact of additional permits on compensation of pedicab and taxicab drivers; and establish a set fare and additional passenger fee” among other pedicab restrictions and regulations."-

the implication is that these are onorus regulations. Hate to tell you but they're totally standard, and the same ones the cab companies already have to abide by.

That's not bureaucratic favoritism, that's basic safety. The pertinent question becomes are these standards that the company is fighting or unwilling to implement? If so they have no ground to stand on.

Assuming this is not the case, Will the cab companies drag this out in court as long as they possibly can? Sure. Again SOP. They can't do it forever though. The amount of time they can pull this is even predictable and mandated. Did the business owner factor that obvious situation into his business model?

I never said that any of these things were unreasonable. I merely stated the objectives of TDAA towards pedicabs and the electric cabs. I was looking into the money and also wanted to give a fair point of view from TDAA. Thank you for picking up on that. The only thing I do not agree with is the fact that the city is refusing to regulate someone who WANTS to be regulated after more than 3 years! I also wanted to draw attention to the fact that this has NOTHING to do with Libertarianism. I am NOT Libertarian, nor is the owner of this company AT ALL. That is all. Thank you again for reading and responding. That is all I was asking for.

well if they are there's got to be a reason it's taking so long.

There is going o be a legal process for such things. it will vary somewhat by city. Find out what it is. I doubt anyone got bribed, it's just not necessary. These processes are not only possible, but easy to derail without breaking the law.

There will be forms and meetings that need to be scheduled, and all sorts of other crap mostly designed to make sure it remains fair and nothing gets left out. There are very subtle things that can be done like petitioning to get meetings from disparate sections of government scheduled at the same time to keep critical people from attending them.

If the cabbies know how the system works, and they probably do, while they won't be able to do the run around forever, they may be able to do it long enough to run the company out of money, which is probably the plan.

You need to find out exactly what the system is, and how it works on the cog and gear level. Then you have to get people to watch it like hawks and make sure it doesn't get messed with. This takes either money or volunteers. There will be seemingly stupid meetings to go to that must never be missed or even be late for. There will be seemingly minor departments and people who's good will must be kept. And forms. It's quite complicated.

Government is slow. On purpose. The collective societal mind needs time to process information and for that information to propagate. When something gets rammed through quickly it's either an emergency or someone is trying to keep someone else from figuring out the ramifications of what is happening.

Grass roots is very helpful in these situations. The cabbies have it. They also have history and money. It's going to be hard.

Lol Owned. So he has an insider view. It isn't too hard to gather that this isn't something bad, nor is his opinion invalid, seeing as he he not only writes a lot, he has a first hand account and experience in the matter. If anything, that validates him MORE.

see my comment above.

"Contributing blogger Jenn Studebaker does part-time work for Electric Cab of Austin."

You call yourself a BlueDog Dem but your only source is some PeaceFreedom libertarian clown and you yourself are part of the scam.

Now does anyone have a link to a legitimate news source, and not some biased, partisan blogger?

How is this for research: You are affiliated with the Electric Cab of Austin, hence, you have no credibility.

An ethical reporter would have been honest about their conflict of interest, and mentioned that conflict up front, don't you think?

Can you not read the numerous other articles about this, or are you deliberately ignoring them? I think that my posts do state I have driven for them. I figure smart people can read for themselves. Good try discrediting me, however.

You discredited yourself when you posted to this site and failed to disclose your bias. You might want to further your education with a class on ethics and journalism. You tried to present yourself here as a fair and objective source, which is simply false.

...and obviously, you are fair and objective. (yes, I am being sarcastic.)

I'm not the one posing as a journalist sweetie, my only mission is a search for the truth. Although I must say I also enjoy exposing libertarian frauds posing as journalists.

(No sarcasm, but I am smiling. Thanks for playing, thanks for the LULZ, and better luck next time!)

The point is...there s no taxi licensing for ELECTRIC VEHICLES! The City Council has been delaying voting on permitting/creating license for electric cabs for over three years. I and others who know how the City works think there is no permit available to be had and CC refusal to create such is influenced by BIG CAB LOBBY that contributes BIG $ to said CC members. Know it's difficult to believe, but here in Texas much of our poltical and justice system is corrupt...BIG MONEY INTEREST. What world do you live in?

Why does their need to be a separate license for electric vehicles? Shouldn't taxis be licensed the same way? Who cares about how they are powered?

He has applied for anything they may give them. The problem is that the city does not recognize these LESVs as cabs or pedicabs and refuses to. They are ASKING to be regulated.

That is the city refusing to let them fit into any category.

Yes, this is libertarian spam wrapped in a package meant to attract the gullible and ignorant.

You sound like a kindergardener. Like, 'you're just a poopy head and I don't like you'.

So if peace, freedom, and prosperity are a "right wing" ideas your posts leads to the inference that war, slavery and economic ruin are a "left wing" ideas.

If you believe in the dichotomy inherent in your posts than you should visit warslaveryandeconomicruin.com to get your partisan perspective.

You don't have a clue what's going on here. It's not difficult. City Hall doesn't want to create any legal permit/license for vehicles not owned by BIG TAXI LOBBY here in Texas. There's alot of $$$$ being spread around to campaigns to prevent competition!

No, It means it's just a name. Like the Patriot act. Giving something a random title doesn't mean that's necessarily what it is about. In fact the more generically wonderful sounding a political group's name is the more unlikely it is to have to do with anything. Who doesn't like peace freedom and prosperity? Why not also add mom and apple pie? Or Barney the dinosaur?

Do you have any information that is uncolored? Give me some articles from real news organizations in the city. There may in fact be a taxi lobby. It's not impossible.

Here's what i do know, because I looked into this group during the last election. This website is or was last time I looked, a political organ for a "think tank" from Ron Paul's home area with a back door connection to him, and to a particular economics viewpoint called I think the Austrian school. I'm not sure about that one, it's been a few years.

that site uses this website as an advertising system to direct viewers to that site where various books and things are sold.

They post partial links that don't go anywhere but to their own site. they've been tagged for it before.

Somehow their posts always shoot up to top ranking within minutes of being posted, and it's generally the same five or six names that comment on it. With the exception of ShanklinMike and Bailey78, all of the screen names are generally some form of pre federal military or political reference. During the last election they acted as what amounted to a PAC for Ron Paul.

I just don't trust anything from peacefreedomprosperity.

This may in fact be a real issue. But until I see evidence from somewhere other than that website I will not trust it.

In the early days Chris Nielsen's business "Capitol Cruisers" would rent the GOLF CARTS out to anyone with a dollar. And can we cut the crap with the "green business" if he was all about the green he'd operate a fleet of pedicabs.

I'm wondering if he uses the EV Charging Stations or charges them at the shop? I hear that they have a 6 month unlimited charging pass for $26. That's a pretty sweet deal if you're in the ILLEGAL GOLF CART TAXI business.

I concur something is hinkey.

I don't understand what your problem is? So what if uses any of the charging stations or rented the cabs out? He creates jobs and offers rides. What is "hinkey" about that? He is asking to be regulated. It sounds like you just don't like his business idea or have a personal problem with him, not a legitimate argument on why the city should be treating his business this way.

Please allow me to answer your questions personally as your assumptions are off base and uninformed. I'm not faulting you for this, I simply want to set the record straight.
1:The City of Austin does not have a medallion system, in fact it's the only major municipality that does not use it, there are 3 traditional (motor vehicle) taxi franchises allowed to operate here with Yellow Cab owning 70% of the permits, it's corrupt by definition.
2:Electric Cab of Austin is a for profit business, unfortunately as a direct result of the City's skulduggery we practically do run on "happy thoughts" at this point.
3:The vehicles are slow moving because that's the way that they are designed. Low Speed Electric Vehicles are manufactured with a maximum speed of 25mph and are intended solely for urban environments on arterial roads, not for highway use.
4:Our service is not illegal, every single lawyer that has reviewed this can tell you that. I suggest you contact Bill Gammon (our attorney) if you have any questions about your unfounded assumptions.

I don't mean to come off as heavy handed and I apologize if it reads that way. I'm actually a leftist that happens to have many "nutty" Libertarian friends, ask them, I rip on them for being "silver hoarding, Ron Paul fanboys" all the time! That being said I respect their convictions even though I disagree with them on some very fundamental levels. I made a speech to them advocating Keynes the first time we met and I thought I was about to be lynched, since then we have a mutual understanding and respect for one another, this is a trans partisan issue.

I see where you get your moniker...I am in fact about "the green" and can tell you that our service relies on very little power from the grid at all. There is a lot of misinformation about EVs out there, they use surprisingly little power ($0.25 for a full charge at maximum @ $0.07 per KwH)

I choose not to operate a pedicab business because I do not feel that those vehicles are as safe as mine, neither does the NHTSA for that matter. Our EVs can traverse hills, long distances, and have reliable propulsion systems that human power simply cannot compete with. That being said I know quite a few pedicab owners and operators and we have our differences but have learned to live with each others businesses in harmony.

We do not operate "golf carts" anymore, not since 2009, and we are not illegal. You might want to check the definition of that word before you use it again, it reflects poorly on your education.

well I admit I can't fault someone for being silver hoarding lately. It's been an extremely profitable psychosis these last few years.

Breaking a minimum legal limited competition market is really really hard. They're going to fight like dogs.

Government is easy to slow down. They are undoubtedly taking steps. Probably at the nuts and bolts level. That's usually how it's done. I'm not sure if you're better off for profit or non profit at this point. The advantage of non-profit is press and both public and governmental sympathy. Also non-profits are very very hard to kill off completely. The advantage of private is freedom of action and privacy. There's all kinds of ways to get up into the business of a non profit and mess with them.

this is going to be a long long fight. Minnesota is known for taking even longer than most areas for this kind of thing but here i wouldn't be surprised if it took ten years to get through. Disgusted, but not surprised.

it took 3 years and direct action from over a hundred local citizens just to get permit parking in our area. And that was against a single business that was a mere city tenant.

Austin has a simple application for a chauffeurs permit. Oh I see the city doesn't include EV's yet. Fight the fight with the city, imo operating without a permit is illegal.

Write what? You're just saying "it's green and someone is unhappy so this is bad. Write and complain even though I'm not telling you anything about what is actually going on"

Give me some real details from a non-creepy website.

How many full time employees does the company have, do they include health benefits and retirement compensation. Does the company rent cabs to non employees. Why not go into the pedicab business and avoid the headache.

If the company is "green and all that" why not operate a pedicab business.

Does the company utilize the EV Charging Stations and if so how many passes has the company registered.

A company that comercially transports people is required to have chauffer licensed drivers. Its the law, so you lose credibility points for claiming people didn't "commit crimes".

You don;t spend much time on the internet do you. My complaint was that the link source was questionable. These look like source links so the question is now moot.

I don't spend any real time with sites like these. I was surprised on how quickly it was attacked. Thank you for looking into the rest of the articles.

I'm new to this website, why is it "creepy"?

I'm seriously asking you, no offense intended.

Again, you have no idea what you're talking about. We not only have access to the charging stations but we were involved in the grant writing process to bring them to Austin through CTCC (Central Texas Clean Cities) of which we are valued stakeholders.

Maybe someone just needs a nap?

this website isn't creepy. it's the shanklinmike peacereedomprosperitything that is. I got into it with them a few years ago during the last election. This is supposed to be an open forum where individuals act as news agrigators, but that group uses it as an advertising medium and behaves like a political PAC. The pattern of commentary, method of posting, and the speed at which they are able to force their posts to the top of the page are all highly suspicious. They're a bit like the local street gang IMHO.

You are boring and redundant.

what kind of crap? They don't actually SAY anything about what is happening.

but you don;t even have any information yet.

I went to the story at the link and read what it said what more is there??

Because, he might just have ethics... ;)

This business stink heavily of regulation dodging. There is probably a really good reason. Probably having to do with admitting his drivers are employees.

well the site listed above has a history of seriously ethics free behavior so I'm disinclined to give him a free pass without information.

What it sounds like to me is he figured out a way to create an unlicensed cab service that doesn't comply with any employment, tax, or safety regulations. And since the city isn't buying his BS he's going elsewhere for support. There's so very little actual information here though that it is hard to tell much of anything.

Are you with the Taxi Lobby? Something bothers me about how you are commenting on EVERY post trying to discredit this story. That seems like a great deal of energy for someone who has no stake in this story or has never read anything about it. Maybe your time would be better invested into doing a little research. I'm sure you have Goggle.

Are you with the Electric Cab of Austin? Why yes you are!

Clearly you have a stake in this story, and will go out of your way to promote your libertarian bias.

Maybe you would be taken more seriously if you were honest and upfront about your affiliations.

Haha! I find the fact that you call me "Libertarian" is hilarious. You have made zero argument on the actual events or facts of this story, but instead attempt to discredit using "scary" words. The owner of this business is a die hard Democrat. He's part of the Gray Panthers among other groups. This is Austin we are talking about, not Oklahoma. It's a blue city. I have no idea what the affiliations are of the website that posted it. Obviously this is an issue that goes across party lines. I linked various news stories on this issue. Maybe you should read them. Are you saying that green business, jobs, and asking for regulation are Libertarian principles? If you were educated, I think you would know that answer.

nope. I just read down the column commenting as I go. I don't even live in texas. My eye was drawn by the link to the article. I don't trust anything that comes out of there.

The assumption of libertarian leaning sis reasonable considering the link source. Peacefreedomprosperity is (or was when last I checked) a hardcore right wing propaganda site.

If someone walked up to you wearing a white sheet and pointy hood and stated talking abou how they loved babies would you question their motives?

We are incorporated as an LLC in the state of Texas and have been for 3 1/2 years, it hasn't helped...

Wrong again, we skirt nothing. Quite the opposite, we have been petitioning to have a new category created to clear up the legal gray area so everyone concerned is satisfied. The problem is the Taxi Lobby is very powerful in this city...

What information would you like to see? I have scores of Federal, state, and city info that I can send to you, please be specific as to what you would need to see to satisfy your skepticism and as long as it's not proprietary I will glady share it with you to help alleviate your concerns.

Actually, she is LOOSELY affiliated, Jenn hasn't worked for me in over a month. She's not a Libertarian either, neither am I, ask anyone with the TCLP, I'm a leftist...Is she biased? YES! Is everyone biased? YES! (including you, obviously) in case you failed to notice her story was an opinion piece as per the category. I don't understand why you harbor such hostility for a pretty simple matter.

Texas is shady, we can agree on that at least

just the description of what was going on and some links outside of the peacefreedomhappybunnies site was sufficient thankyou. i think i'm more or less up to speed now.

Can't you tell when lazloman is being ironic? You haven't been around very long have you?

Boring, boring, boring. Redundant, redundant, redundant. *yawn*

Governments, especially governments in Texas, are drastically underfunded. A three year battle sounds wildly expensive. Someone thinks this guy is dangerous. I don't know if it's the city or the cab companies, but if no one was bothered by this guy he wouldn't be having that level of issue.

You're really misinformed...rather uninformed. At least do a LITTLE research before you open mouth and insert foot. Austin American Statesman, Austin Chronicle, but maybe they're dangerous, too.

links? I'm not saying it didn't happen. I'm saying i don't do peacefreedomandhappybunnies.

I have no problem with governments being underfunded. If they want revenue they ought to produce something of value as we all do to earn our way in this world. I also do not have a problem with you or anyone else volunteering donation to the government of your choice, I'm just saying to leave peaceful people alone. Why do they get to point guns to get their money, but we have to work hard and innovate? What gives them a pass? Certainly not my consent, cause do not give it!

you mean like roads, sanitation, basic safety and lack of war? There are lots of places where the ideal libertarian government exists. Go to one of them for a month, and if you live you can report back and tell me off. I don't think you will though.

I've been to a few.

Ha! Nice one!

So what do you do? Wartyrannyandsadbunnies? See ya, wouldn't want to be ya!

Me I don't have any organization or personal website that I attempt to steer readers to. Or a system to drive articles i post up the popularity tree. If I have an article to post I just post it.

My opinions are my own. Are yours?

I want to be sure I understand you correctly. What you mean is that in modern societies, people have grown accustom to basic conveniences such as roads and sanitation systems. In fact, these things are taken for granted by most people (myself included) that people don't even recognize or appreciate where these services come from, namely the government through taxation. And that without government these services would either not exist, or they would become so outdated and in disrepair that society would quickly unravel into a dangerous chaotic society which you seem to define as a "libertarian" society. Am I understanding you correctly?

Sort of. The libertarian ideal is the triumph of pure capitalism, privately run everything, and a government with almost no power to interfere in private affairs. This is actually a fairly common system. It just works very poorly.

Money has it's own gravity well. It attracts itself. The more money you have the easier it is to take from others. you get large lumps of isolated capital doing very little except paying for stupid pointless luxuries like strings of polo ponies and retail shopping sprees for luxury goods in other nations.

The Libertarian ideal makes the tragic assumption that competition is an unstoppable force that will eventually even everything out. This is almost but not quite true. the problem is that capitalists by definition abhor competition and will fight it at every turn. If they amass enough capital they can crate situations where they can do it regardless of the actual GNP they are producing. This isn't theory. It's been happening world wide throughout history.

What you wind up with is a tiny class of super rich that have effective control of the government and a giant group basically scratching in the dirt and starving to death. No law enforcement, rampant corruption, and a dysfunctional government that cannot compete in international affairs, thus further damaging the nation. It's a downward spiral resulting in a third world banana republic style nation. Time and time again.

The opposite of course is just as bad. communism is if anything even more silly.

America worked well for years because we had a hybrid system. Capital was attracted to profitable investment, but there were systems in place to pull apart calcified cysts of money that were no longer doing anything but supporting hereditary nobility. Primary amongst them were the graduated income tax, which forced capital concentrations to continue to produce value, and the inheritance tax which stressed a business once a generation so it had to prove that it had something to show besides the fact that it had been there for a while. They kept capitalist the pot stirring.

Both of these are gone now and we are going the way of the third world. half of America doesn't pay taxes anymore because they make so little money they have nothing to pay. Education levels are falling rapidly and we soon won't be able to field a work force that can even perform the tasks necessary to maintain an advanced society. We're getting most of our educated workforce from overseas as it is. Other nations however are gaining economic strength and that flow will soon stop. It's already happening with Indian workers.

Out pot is no longer stirring, and our economy is starting to turn into lumpy sludge. The unassailable hard lumps of capital are forming, and their production is going down.

That’s actually not a bad idea to use your adversaries power against them. They will trip over themselves trying to figure out how to go around what the Supreme Court said, that Corporations are people and they do seem to appear to have more rights then us LIVING people have. So if you’re not that person, that is, the corporation, you shouldn’t be held responsible in the same way. The standard that’s used for corporation are going to be different. Maybe some ‘Legal Eagle’ can throw some light in on this subject. Has anyone thought of asking the ACLU or finding a lawyer that’s willing to work on it Pro Bo-no? it’s worth a try. At least it will mind-frack them for awhile and that ought to be fun. Turn around is fair play! If you make them look stupid enough, maybe they’ll get pissed off enough and give a permit Chris a permit. After all those meetings total up to a lot of money
who’s blocking it and why?

Sounds like you left school in the 4th grade before anything complicated came up.

Chris has ACLU representing him! The police keep ticketing and arresting drivers and the ACLU attorney keeps going to court and getting it dismissed! It's Texas politcs! Keep harrassing until they go away! Heard of that tactic before? This time the guys are fighters and the "right" is on their side. It's embarassingly obvious $ and power are at stake and these two nice guys don't have $ and power. They just want to provide a service and possibly make a few bucks.

We have the local ACLU, Gray Panthers, and a hotshot attorney on board, the problem is that the taxi lobby has MAJOR funding and practically owns City Council

While that is not impossible, there is another possiblity. These things are dangerous as hell because they lack basic safety equipment, the things are blocking traffic, and they're using legal chicanery to circumvent congestion and safety laws.

Someone sure doesn't like this guy. It might be the cab companies, and it might be people trying to keep the city running.

Austin currently allows People Crawlers - slow, open vehicles without seat belts that shuttle partying, drinking, "let's get it on" visitors and students all around the central city. We've spent lots of $ to install eletric charging stations throughout this area to encourage green transportation. Other cities allow and license the same type of vehicles. Chris N has been begging the city to create whatever regulations/licenses/etc for OVER THREE YEARS. Get the picture? There's too much $$$ from outside taxicab lobby for city council to create c**p and allow these really nice vehicles to operate.

so they did the paperwork and spent the money to put in the equipment but won't actually allow the vehicles? Are the cab companies barred from competing in this new market? Were these chargers put in FOR the people crawlers? Or were they for other electric vehicles?

Are there any news articles on the subject?

If this is in fact a push job by the cab companies the way they would do it is organize the cab drivers to attend public meetings on the subject. Who shows up at these meetings?

Their is NO permit available for this classification of electric vehicle. That's what they're trying to get the city to create...rules, regulations, licenses. The peopl crawlers are foot peddled by passengers...Chargers are for everyone with an elect car, vehicle.Plenty of news articles..Austin American Statesman archive...Austin Chronicle archive. We recently had city council elections...one incumbent had TAXI DRIVERS FROM HOUSTON STANDING OUTSIDE POLLING LOCATIONS HANDING OUT LITERATURE. Yes they were paid by taxi cos to be there. Fortunately their candidate was defeated in a following runoff. Also covered by local newspapers and TV.