No food stamps for junk food: Florida bill would ban buying sweets with food stamps

In the 30s my great uncle was sued by the federal govt for selling tires at below the nationally set price. So he gave the rest of the inventory away for free and told the govt if he's giving them away there is no such thing as a selling price.

i believe it

I don't know why desperate economic times seem to bring out the extra bizarre side of govt.

I think it is because desperate times leave large cracks to crawl into for the really smart diabolical who have been waiting for just such a thing or just the crazies who need it to hide.

that feels slightly gestapo-ish .I can't quite put my finger on why.

Why would any one in their "right" mind vote down this comment?

Ya know ,I don't have the urge to dislike you .Not that I would ever quantify the whole of someone based on a post on current. I only watched 3/4 of the video so if this guy said something horrible at the end I didn't see it coming. If I got what your intent is with this video right , The idea is to educate the poor(hopefully everyone else) and they won't want to eat crap. I can deal with that logic but I still can't agree with regulating food to the poor.

Poor people can have candy and cable connected to a big screen TV. But why should WE subsidize it?

What a sadly misled mindset...you post above caloric based stamps was at least informed and thought provoking... this statement is just a typical propogandized refusal to rethink a point.

I start from the perspective that you agree that changes are needed in our culture with being progressive with social issues such as our roll as We The People in feeding and housing and providing health care to the every growing number of people that are filling willing to fill out the forms. How many of them has just given up and turned to drugs like sugar and foods high in fat? It releases hormones in your brain that makes you feel good, for a little while, but your body is starving for vitamins and minerals so it suppress another hormone that tells your brain to stop eating. So We The People are cultivating Depression and unhealthy diets and obesity and diabetes and heart disease and cancer and.....problems. ? We The People must come together and curate the demand that The Future of Our Nation depends on everyone being as strong and healthy as possible. . The seeds of social responsibility must be planted now for the next generation to flourish.

Well put, my issue here is that any form of control is over personal choices is not right. Increasing food stamps is a good idea in that worthwhile meals cost a whole lot more then the junk, conversely we can't spend our way out of the problem, the solution to this is three fold, allow those on the system the ability to buy better foods either through stamp increases or through subsidization of the good food producers, removal of those in abuse of the system from being able to qualify for ANY government funded assistance (get caught screwing the system you won't get stamps, medicaid, sect 8 or anything of that nature for a determinate amount of time), third part is education because we should know by now that TELLING people that can't have or do something doesn't work, however educating them about the truth of a topic allows them to make the right choice... Simple case study "Just Say No" had success the "War On Drugs" and prohibition did not.

Yes, it is not just the dependency problem; people learn to expect it (entitled). Many people I know who have worked around these "types" all say the same things - The EXPECT the "free" stuff. So, if we are not able to keep them on the government teat, they will probably start burning and looting and killing.

So you listen to people that tell stories about other people and you come to the conclusions that you do. Well the intelligent people here know why your posts are ridiculous.

No, I wrote about this in THREE other posts. I lived in an apartment building where about 3/4 were on the dole. Virtually all were scammers. I worked in the public sector where I saw these people, desperately trying to get their kids labels handicapped so they could avoid work and get on the dole. I worked near the "projects" and saw what they did. My cousin's husband builds fences and got state contracts at the "projects" all over the state: His property was stolen and he had to carry a gun. And on and on.

EXACTLY! Good points! Never give them something for nothing. Never.

"I am tired of this dependent on government BS"

The government makes people dependent on it.

Think about what the "General Welfare" clause REALLY means. It does not mean putting bums on the dole!

If you choose to respond, think it through first, please.

"if you become ill and loose everything you have... do not apply for SSI"

I will never go on the dole, never. The government has CONFISCATED my money for THEIR version of how I should retire, so I want some back. But the dole? Never.

We have been so poor that we ate beans and could not even afford a phone or a B&W TV. But we would never take food stamps. Never.

So the story changes. First you claim that you knew people that told you something now you claim to have witnessed it yourself. Spotting a liar 101: when the story keeps changing, it is a lie.

and what does any of what you say have to do with foodstamps.dont get me wrong there are people in need and more today than there has been for a long time all i am suggesting is nothing for free.i bust my ass working two jobs provideing for my family.
i am not anti goverment i am anti corrupt goverment and this is what we have today!!

No, it is both. You simply do not want to accept what you do not like and what does not align with your ideology and dogma.

I hear what you are saying, but should we all not be targeting the abusers of the system, and not the system that feeds children who otherwise would suffer life long effects of malnutrition?

So now you are using my comments directed at you against others? Pot and kettle... how many times do we have do this?

Typical Left-winger tactic: "We care about the children; if you do not agree with our dogma and programs, it shows you don't CARE."

Yea, right. Just set up a government bureaucracy to investigate another govt bureaucracy. All to help the children.

Yea, right.

absolutly.the question is how do we do it.

and telling poor people what they can eat will not change a corrupt government or lessen your burden

Absolutely that is the question! I yearn for the days when we could discuss our options in an informed manner without rhetoric monkeys throwing monkey wrenches into the cogs.

Identifying the abusers of the system will be an intersting challenge, but I can tell you this it isn't the caseworkers at SRS that have the capacity to figure it out.

i never said poor people shouldnt get help .i said they should do community service for the help and be drug tested i have to pee for my job why shouldnt they.also make them
go to school use the funding wisely.heres an example of how the system is screwed up.
i have a family member who collects welfare has 5 kids gets 1200.00$ a month runs his own business under the radar asked him one day why he collects welfare when he makes plenty of money.anser was why should i bust my ass .

when someone recieves food stamps every 3-6 months they have to go and submit every thing but thier urine, In the state of N.J. they have to attend remedial classes and you have to answer several questions about every aspect of your life.
There is always those who are doing the wrong thing that is not every one . I see your point but Punishing everyone or controling peoples diets is not the answer

where did i say to punish everyone .oh by making them pee.if i have to pee to have my job
and pay taxes they use then they should have to pee if thats punishment then so be it

maybe punishment was not a good word to use ,although using community service feels like a punishment .I know a lot of people who would just like the job. I am not sure how I feel about pee tests or drug tests for food stamps . I think that might play out badly for alot of those parents children .I understand that this statement will most likely be attacked six ways to sunday , but I think there is quite a few parents who would fail that test and still only use the food stamps for thier kids . No ,I don't agree with that happening .I think it is the children that would suffer and I have trouble with that

{i have a family member who collects welfare has 5 kids gets 1200.00$ a month runs his own business under the radar asked him one day why he collects welfare when he makes plenty of money.anser was why should i bust my ass .}

Interesting story. I have also seen many like that.

"although using community service feels like a punishment"

They should be FORCED to work, unless they are severely handicapped. If they refuse, they get absolutely nothing.

Did it ever occur to you that you wouldn't have to force many that most just want a job.

No, there actually have been observations and data recorded since the 1820s. When people are given money or other goodies are doled out to them, they become, in the parlance of the era, "indolent."

http://anyway.it

did it ever occur to you indolence is not the problem but a frame of mind is . Most of the people on welfare that I have spoken to do not see the government as a person .They wouldn't walk up to you and expect you to give them money for nothing . Those same people have a very loose idea of where the money comes from and believe the government would take the money from the people anyway (I believe the government would take the money and does anyway) . It is not laziness or sloth that drives the situation . It is living in the station to wich someone has become accustomed or can not get out from underneath . If some one doesn't look how will they ever see . Thats why education is the answer . Anything else is just another person in power using it . I am aware that I have used alot of generalizations in this comment .I still stand by its meaning.

lets not lose site of the fact that dictating junk food will not change how any feels about ,our country ,our government or themselves and it won't put the money back in your pocket!

Yes, it is a state of mind. Education is only part of the answer. It cannot be taught; it has to be experienced. And society should summarily CONDEMN that attitude, not excuse it. If we "understand" it, we are providing an excuse: This is a core difference between conservativism and Leftism. Conservatism puts the locus of control and the responsibility (for good or bad) mostly on the person. Leftism puts it on society. Conservatism knows people choose behaviors. Leftist thinking contends that people came to think as they do due to circumstances beyond their own control; therefore, with that conceptualization, people are not really responsible, it is society.

This is what leads the Left to want to put control for the structuring and engineering of our society in the hands of "experts" in the federal government. Leftist believe that if we can change the environment, we can change people. And it follows that the federal government's power is essential to this.

It is a basic difference in the concepts of liberty and human nature.

no offense but I don't know any body who wants to put control in the governments hands . I don't see the world split down the middle with this side and that . That would actually be easier .I see my children your children and what I want for them .Do I understand the concept of right /leftist crap. Yes .Do I consider it in an argument ,not if I don't have to .People want power ,People are greedy,People can hurt ,People can help,People can give ,and People can love. The means by wich we choose to do so varies .Thats what political group separation is. A way to gather together to get to an end result wether that be money or harmony. Because I under stand cause and effect I get having to deal with right wing /left wing ,decocrat/ republican vs. everyone else conversation. On a topic like this I am just going to call what I see as right or wrong and dictating food to the poor is wrong.

Yes, dictating food to the poor is wrong. Their not feeling shame is wrong. Most people on welfare are scammers. It is wrong to make people pay for welfare bums. It is not the money; rather, it is what it does to both the giver and the receiver. In the 1870s, there was an interesting term used when the cities started giving government welfare: "compassion fatigue." It was estimated even then that 50-70% of the people receiving public funds were cheating. As public funding increased, the public started disliking those receiving it, and charitable donations dramatically decreased. It created "intergenerational dependency," and that term came around at that time, 130 years ago.

Nothing has changed. Public (government) welfare destroys people.

as they solidify more control less government will be needed

How about getting rid of both? If there are no more handouts to these bums, then there will be no need to check anything? Get rid of the malingerers and federal bureaucrats, both.

Get rid of government programs, what a great idea. It will completely crash our economy. A high percentage of grocery stores will go out of business and many farms will go under by getting rid of food stamps. We could do away with government assisted housing and all of those landlords currently renting section 8 homes could go broke. I wonder how many doctors and health care workers we could put out on the street by doing away with Medicare and Medicaid?

So, you want to start a cycle of government dependency even with grocery stores. Farms won't go under, and they have been subsidized by government for too long, anyway.

I rent a Section 8 unit in one of my multi-family. If they stop it, that is fine with me. I will just drop the rent to the market price.

You need to think through what you write. You never say where the money to support these people - I mean those who are getting some benefits of government spending, such as grocers, landlords, farmers - originally comes from. Think about that and get back.

No, Left-wingers are the treasonous ones. The Leftists were the ones who were actually prosecuted - the ones who got caught - for working with the KGB in the 1940s and early 1950s. The ones who promoted Communist propaganda in Hollywood. Later, the New Left went to help those who wanted to destroy our country in Hanoi and Havana.

Today's Left-wingers are promoting hatred of America, and they want to undermine our Founding principles. They promote the overturning of Rule of Law and true justice with their freakin' "social justice," which destroys justice, of course. Today's Left-wingers want to centralize power in the Federal Government and rid our REPUBIC of states' rights.

Why do you think there has to be a cycle of government dependency. The conservatives always seem to think in terms of too much or none at all. We need to have government programs to help those in need. I have no problem with policing these agencies to make sure there is no abuse but we cannot just do away with them because there is abuse.

I am happy to know that you rent a house and receive money from section 8 housing, now we all know how hypocritical you are. You claim that government spending on social programs is wrong but you take the money.

I have a friend that earns over $20,000.00 a month renting homes to section 8. I guarantee he would have a problem if we did away with the program. I know doctors that earn one helluva good living taking Medicare and Medicaid. I know they would lose a ton of money if the programs went away. There are only simple answers to complex questions if you are a simple person, the rest of us try to find good answers.

not an enemy of the state love my country dont trust my goverment.and by the way i am a left leaning independent voted.for obama and take offense at being called a right winger but it does show your ignorance .guess what happens when everyone is on the dole system the country goes broke just as it is.did you know most jobs are goverment jobs
these days few are private sector .goverment jobs produce no taxes there fore there is
less tax base to pay for all the freebees get it we are broke

"The conservatives always seem to think in terms of too much or none at all."

No, Left-wingers create "crises" when there are none. Look at the environmental whackos: They are presenting a picture that if we do not act immediately, civilization as we know it will come to an end. The Left-wingers have always operated that way, of course. In reality, Conservatives are very moderate. They want the government to leave people alone and to their own devices as much as possible. Let states and communities decide: What could lead to more true diversity, and not this left-winger garbage of uniformity in the name of diversity; speech codes in the name of "tolerance?"

"I have no problem with policing these agencies"

The fox in the hen house, the fox in the hen house.

"we cannot just do away with them because there is abuse."

There will always be abuse, of course. How about turning it over to the states? No federal government involvement at all? No screaming for Supreme Court protections but let each state handle it in its own way?

"I am happy to know that you rent a house and receive money from section 8 housing, now we all know how hypocritical you are."

No hypocrisy, none at all. Not a whit, of course.

"I have a friend that earns over $20,000.00 a month renting homes to section 8. I guarantee he would have a problem if we did away with the program."

He would. I wouldn't.

"I know doctors that earn one helluva good living taking Medicare and Medicaid. I know they would lose a ton of money if the programs went away. There are only simple answers to complex questions if you are a simple person, the rest of us try to find good answers."

You are twisting and spinning. I know that we cannot suddenly take everything away. The Left-wingers have made many people dependent on the government and they have built their lives on it. And these are not the welfare bums. They are those doctors and others. They should be weaned slowly. Keep cutting back and cutting back. The Left-wingers have helped destroy a sense of responsibility, morality and have fostered government dependence.

"I rent a Section 8 unit in one of my multi-family. If they stop it, that is fine with me. I will just drop the rent to the market price." Thank you for admiting you are abusing a government system... This puts you in same catagory of people as those you complain about. How sad a self-hater. You sir also need to think through what you say before you type.

drop rent to market value bwahahahaha you are an evil little bugger.

Oh holy hell, you're really gonna bring McArthyism into this? I have yet to see any left-winger in here promoting a hatred of America, just a hatred of a corrupt system. I have seen far more right wingers screaming down with the government especially with Ron Paul all over the airwaves at the moment. There is no differntiation between "true justice" and any other justice... Justice is justice wether its socially, economically, or physically motivated. I have yet to see any left-winger say a damned thing about taking away states rights, except in the cases where states are infringing on HUMAN RIGHTS!

"Crisi" the plural for crisis. Lets take a look at all the major crisis pushers lately shall we... Oh wait they are ALL republicans other then "left-wingers" in the 99% crowd complaining of the financial crisis (very real) and the environmental crisis (also very real)... WMDs in Iraq, republicans need I say more?

Back to using ten posts to answer one again are you? "Fox in the henhouse" just like you overcharging Sect 8 on a rental property priced ABOVE fair market value.

"How about turning it over to the states?" Because the republican controled states have a strange tendancy to try and strip people of their rights thats why.

"No hypocrisy, none at all." Bald faced lie and you know it.

"You are twisting and spinning. I know that we cannot suddenly take everything away" ok lets take a look back at what you HAVE said to support Kev's statement.
1.Farms won't go under, and they have been subsidized by government for too long, anyway--your support for doing away with government subsudies to deflate food prices.
2.How about getting rid of both? AND Get rid of the malingerers and federal bureaucrats, both.-- support for doing away with government programs as well as the federal government itself, despite your claims it the left-wingers that want to overthrow and do away with the government.

And this is just from your posts on this thread... do I really need to come debunk everytime you make a comment? This is very tiring but I feel that it's my obligation to not leave your assanine posts here without sharing the truth myself incase some impressionable young person comes thru here and becomes deluded into thinking you are right.

Not abusing nothing, of course. Perfectly legal and above-board. I thought it through and knew how the Left-wingers would use it. It does not matter. If the government offers contracts, people will fulfill them. That is all. Simple.

The Left-wingers are anti-capitalist, they accuse America of imperialism, they revile our religious institutions, they mock our Constitution and call it archaic, they disparage our great Founding Fathers. Heck, they want us to be like Europeans!

Need I go on?

I am more concerned with the social devastation of Left-wingerism.

"just like you overcharging Sect 8 on a rental property priced ABOVE fair market value."

Nah. The rent was no higher than when I had working people in the place. Interesting thing happened, however; several years ago, when I went in, the place reeked of marijuana, and the woman on welfare was fat, lying on the couch, stoned out of her mind. She had a HUGE television. My manager thought I would be annoyed, but I just said, "feeling alright, eh?" and she laughed.

Anyway, a year later, I went to my other property, and she was there - Paying rent. Seems she got a job and straightened out. She was trim, the place was really clean. She stood up to greet me and carried on a normal conversation.

See what the free market does? It was really clear. She gave up the dope, too.

So conservatives want to leave people alone to make live their own lives? So why is it that they want to pass a constitutional amendment to keep Same Gender Marriage illegal? Why is it that the conservatives want to keep forcing christianity on all of us? You only want government that you do not like to stay out of our lives and use government to control personal behavior. More cognitive dissonance?

It is a reaction to the Left-winger radicals not letting states decide. The Leftists let it go up for a vote. If it does not go their selfish, narcissistic way, they respond like spoiled brats and take it to the courts and go over the heads of the people. You leave us no choice.

"Why is it that the conservatives want to keep forcing christianity on all of us?"

I am an atheist. You don't know what you are talking about.

You are not the only conservative are you? If you are an honest person, which is in serious doubt, then you know that the conservative agenda includes forcing us to listen to their religious crap. Palin, Bachman, Santorum, Gingrich, Perry and now even Romney are trying to force religious beliefs on us. Only the blind would not see this. Of course the dishonest would not admit to it.

o joy what political fun and I get to give one of my sons a history lesson now .He's been mildly folowing this . I voted you up by the way

Anti-capitalism isn't a bad thing, at least they are thinking outside the (predesigned and handed to them by our 1%) box. The religious institutions are worth reviling for the most part, let me guess you support Rev. Phelps from the Westboro Baptist Church in Topeka too huh? I have NEVER EVER ONCE IN MY LIFE seen a liberal or a "left-winger" mock our constitution nor refer to it as archaic thats just you projecting your belief on how these people act. Again I have never heard a liberal disparage our founding fathers on anything more then a factual account of their actions (mostly slavery).

The european arguement is intersting to me, Iceland is free of international banks and enjoying stability. Norway is enjoying economic and social equality, with good healthcare and fair regulations. Denmark/Amsterdam have almost no drug problems anymore, their crime rates are incredibly low, and making a killing from tourism. The Portuguese have cut their blackmarket and gang related crimes in half in just a short period of time. The Germans have an incredible work force and industrial complex that they are actually investing in through TAXATION... hmmmmm what would be so wrong about taking a few cues from across the pond?

"I am more concerned with the social devastation of Left-wingerism" more concerned then what? Looking at the truth and facts about those you slander and malign? More concerned of that then taking a good deep look into the "conservative" mindset that has caused a large number of our problems? More concerned about a supposed "devastation" that you can't prove and can only hint at through retorhic?

Yay, yet another anecdote about one individual you have encountered to stand as a proxy for thte way the whole world works. You are some how under the impression that a free market gets people working, and thats a fallacy, she went back to work because she wanted to go to work, or needed to for any number of reasons. It wasn't the sudden appearance of a "free market" that changed anything, as I can rightly assume that same market environment was there during her "fat, lazy, weed smoking" period. The "free market" is not what helped that woman make changes, she did herself or with the help of family and friends, OR OMG ready for this, she was helped by an established government program to help those with abuse problems. Your stereotypical comments reek heavily of "foodstamp queen" that never actually existed in the Reagan days

RevKen:
"Why is it that the conservatives want to keep forcing christianity on all of us?"
Mishima
"I am an atheist. You don't know what you are talking about"

Then why do you keep bringing "religous institutions" and other such things into your debates

Thank you sue, and I am sure your son will thank you in the long run as well. History is something we all need to learn. So coincidentally what are your sons oppinions so far, and at what age is he to show such interest?

He seems to have endless stories to tell. I have doubts about the veracity of any of them.

He is 17 years old , he had a very loose idea of what mcarthyism was . I explained it to him then we did some research. He is still ruled by his emotions .It's hard for him to seperate them and discuss something analytically. He thinks it is just another way for someone in charge to exert control. He thinks it's mean to take it away from kids. In his own words He thinks mishima is bitter

Not abusing anything. If the government offers to buy something, I sell it. Why not? Not dependent.

"you know that the conservative agenda includes forcing us to listen to their religious crap."

Not true. Not true at all. Heck, I'm an atheist, and the Neo-Conservatives are mostly agnostics.

Those people have principles based on a religious foundation. There is a difference. They are not judging non-Christians nor do they have the slightest intention of pushing anyone to become a Christian.

"Anti-capitalism isn't a bad thing, at least they are thinking outside the (predesigned and handed to them by our 1%) box. "

On the contrary. They are precisely WITHIN the faddish box of the times. Why do you think that Texas has to SPECIALLY require that their textbooks would introduce famous people of the free market, like Hayek and Friedman? Simply because they were not there before, but they knew about Marx. THAT was there.

{ I have NEVER EVER ONCE IN MY LIFE seen a liberal or a "left-winger" mock our constitution}

I see it on these threads and other Left-winger forums, all of the time. Also, it is implied in the "living document" idea. It means that there is no permanent truth. And that goes against the primary ideas of our Founders.

And look into your Progressive history. Start with Wilson, Croly, and Dewey. All thought that the Constitution was obselete and no longer applicable.

I do not even want to respond to the foolishness of picking out countries with populations only 1 or 2% of ours, largely homogeneous, and one of which is oil rich with plenty of money.

In addition, it is pure illogic to attempt to draw a casual relation between variables that you cherry-pick. You pick some sort of socialism out, then you cite crime statistics, as if they had some connection that you can prove. That is absurd.

No, the Left-wingers were able to establish some ideas that have led to moral chaos and degeneracy. Also to government dependency.

Two quick examples:

1. Liberation and love of self. That led to narcissism.

2.Guilt is obselete. Marcuse, man of the New Left, really promoted it and it took hold. So, someone has adultery, and it is acceptable with Left-wingerism. Heck they wanted to do away with marriage; it is just a piece of paper. People go on welfare? They should not feel any guilt, shame or be thankful. No, no, no. They are ENTITLED.

Thank you, Left-wingers!

Because Left-wingers want to destroy them, and religious institutions are a countervailing force to Left-wingerism adoration of their beloved federal government.

All true. Stop the envy.

Tell me something. Let's see how much you know:

How many people went to prison because of the charges of Joseph McCarthy?

I eagerly await your reply.

Are you on drugs? If not you might want to try them because what you just said is absolutely the most foolish thing I have ever heard.

It is a simple question. Can you answer it?

lets see I'll humor you for shits and giggles ,.I'm not sure how many people McCarthy caused to go to prison in his career as a lawyer . As a senator He gave a lincoln day speech to a womens aux. he mentioned THE list of communists working in the state dept . If memory serves most of the people that he wanted to bring underfire had either already lost thier jobs or had never worked there at all . There was fear of communism long before this guy ever came along, with Russia making the atomic bomb and china falling. He did continue to tout that there was communists in high ranking position in government and of course he thought thier sympathisers were every where .How many people went to prison directly because of his speech and mentioned list, none that I know of ..I wasn't there so I could be wrong . He did however manage to ruin several non-government workers careers with constant accusations of misconduct and communism .Several people spent short stints in jail or lost thier jobs because of the House Appropriations commitee .That was led by a former F.B.I agent .Because of his out ward position That our governmet was over wrought with communists his name became synonymous with the topic. Any thing else you would like to know I'll be more than happy to pass along any info I have.

Nobody went to jail from McCarthy's accusations and charges. Not a single person.

The Left tried to deny that there were people collaborating with the USSR, but there were. In fact, it came out much later. Look up the Venona Documents; proof has been established, and the Left is STILL denying much of it. The work of Harvey Khler is another, published by Yale University; it shows the collaboration.

The Left started another movement at the time. They could not keep supporting the USSR after Stalin's brutality and murderous regime was exposed by Khruschev himself, but they did not want to completely turn against the Communists in the USSR. So, they started what was called "anti-anti-Communism."

These freakin' Leftists claimed they were defending free speech. What they were really doing was trying to stop further investigations of communists in America by claiming that these investigations were against free speech.

Ronald Reagan saw the commies in Hollywood and he worked with the FBI. He was threatened, and the FBI armed him and gave him bodyguards to protect himself from the filthy communists and American traitors.

The threat was real, and it was not exaggerated.

I didn't say anything was exaggerated .I implied that McCarthy was paranoid and I said he personally did not send any one to jail .I don't know about when he was lawyer .I definately stand by my answer to your question.

McCarthy another paranoid right-wing-fascist, just like mishies holy-saint-reagan, seeing commie-pinko-scialists behind every tree, under every rock. Nothing new here.

Obviously in desperate need of very strong(er) anti-psychotics.