Alaska is approaching its 40th year since the secessionist movement started.

Read. Turn off the TV.

"Father Knows Best", it's their "golden age" they dream of it, back to "simpler times" everything black&white (in more ways then 1), everyone "knew their place"... Rich 1%er w.a.s.p heaven on earth!

I work with a Texan. According to him you're info
is outdated. The signitures now measure 100,000, are reasonably expected
o reach 250,000 before long now that Texans know of it. He also mentioned
that eventualy once it does, that Republic will split into 5 States of Texas.
6 if Big Oil Oklahoma joins their Confederation. One of the C.S.A.'s reasons
for seceeding from the Union was that they opposed a Corporate central Bank.
Texans have no love for the Federal Reserve either. Their current Governor
said as much this year. I voted in Texas as their citizen. I'm on their side.

The Left-wingers are duped by their televisions and accept whatever comes across their screens.

The Texas Nationalist movement started SEVENTEEN years ago! These LIBERALS think it started just now, in response to Lord on High, their Savior's, re-election, prompted by racial hatred. It is incredible how brainwashed they are, trained to accept the dogma of the Left.

Yes, I see IT is back. Yeehaw.

And he makes a beeline for a back thread where one of his little minions was stirring up drama on his behalf yesterday.

His foul little sock friends won't be far behind...

This really gets tiring.

I would apologize for my part in the drama, but I find it cathartic to call bullshit on the troll for some sick reason.

Oh, no, that's fine ... just weird he makes a beeline for this specific thread after what happened yesterday.

No problem, VS.

I have a simple question to you: Why not post about ideas and concepts, and not about other posters and gossip?

Not any boss. Just asking a question. It would be nice if posters did not write and gossip about other posters but articulated concepts, ideas and principles to which they ascribe. Do you agree or not? Do you think that we should talk about other posters or about concepts?

I'd like to talk to you about your pal, CB.

Charming company you keep there, doctor. Simply charming.

Other than that, I have nothing to talk to you about.

As I asked, is it better in a place such as this, to post gossip about people, or to post concepts, ideas, principles and discuss those? Which do you think is preferrable?

So, you refuse to answer the question about whether it is preferrable to write about concepts or about other posters. Your refusal to respond is here on this public thread.

I'm discussing concepts on another thread about Ron Paul..

... I'm just not giving you the attention you seek, doctor. Sorry.

We've been kicking concepts around for a long time now. Haven't you noticed? (Or do you choose to not pay attention to what we have been saying?)

75 comments in 7 straight nonstop hours of posting this morning, beginning at 4 a.m.

That's one comment every 5 1/2 minutes for seven straight hours.

Yup ... that's a healthy person! That's living the high life.

Good to see ya back, Mish. I didn't mean to start gossip about ya, my bad.

Not valid. Sorry.

Please let me see, thank you.

How about introducing some concept? I prefer not to talk about other posters, and you will rarely see me do it. In fact, among all of those posts that you counted, I doubt that you will find a single one about another poster.

You weren't "gossipping." And you bring facts, ideas and concepts into the thread. You challenge others to think. Keep trying.

I understand why you took a break. These left wingers just will not listen to facts. It's like banging your head against a brick wall. But I like to think that my views just might make one person question the powers that be; my time is not wasted.
Here's to exercising our first amendment, I say live free or find me dead laying in a pile of brass. Thanx Mishima.

I sincerely hope you can get some people to think. But that is the problem with the Left. Most people, Left and Conservative and undecided (moderate) are not interested in thinking. I do not state that even as a criticism but a fact, mostly because they are not so interested.

The problem is that Left-wingerism SOUNDS nice. They present it as "sharing," "fairness," and making those who have "too much money" give up "just a little."

If a person does not want to delve into the ramifications and the truths behind what all those cliches MEAN, they are easy to accept.

In contrast, Conservatism and adhering to our Constitution and Founding principles takes mental effort.

What I find most annoying with Leftists is when they state FEELINGS and cliches as FACTS, then make pronouncements. Then, they refuse to analyze their vapid assertions, but only revert to name-calling, deflection and deceit.

For example, they wrote pronouncements about Alaska that were manifestly WRONG. I presented the data that was incontrovertible, and NOT A SINGLE LEFT-WINGER would respond to it! And they continue to spread the LIES, DECEIT AND PERFIDY.

Yep, I hear ya. I believe in alot of socialist ideas you would not like. But besides that fact, there is truth. If the truth offends, then believe in lies, I don't care. This is the internet, not real life.

Not to leave you hangin, here are a couple of my socialist ideas and reasons I think they would work.

1. Nationalize oil. I think this would work because it would bring down the cost of groceries.

2. Nationalized healthcare. This is too important to be based on a capitalist system.

3. Public transportation. This is the year 2012. People need a solid means of transport.

Please, tell me I'm a socialist. I know this world can offer better than what is available.

"What I find most annoying with Leftists"

Oh please.....if you were even a little bit annoyed with what you call Leftists, you wouldn't continue to show up on this site.....especially after the large helping of crow this election handed you, but I think you are actually so insecure about yourself and your so called facts, that you come here to spew hot air, hoping to make yourself feel both relevant and needed.....but what do I know?

Why do left-wingers make the puerile attempts at pseudo-psychological attacks? Do they actually think that the recipient takes them seriously, or even believes that the Leftists have some kind of psychological insights?

"Nationalize oil. I think this would work because it would bring down the cost of groceries."

Horrendous idea. Look at Mexico and Venezuela. Mexico did not even clean up the Gulf. In addition, the government would be more expensive. It is a fallacy to actually believe that the government can keep prices down or even control them. Sure, it can MAKE things to be sold at X amount, but the costs will then rise in ways that are not readily detected.

"Nationalized healthcare. This is too important to be based on a capitalist system."

No, you need to look at what really happens in a relatively free market, and the one in America is tied into price controls, over-regulation, etc. Check out the international clinics which are almost completely dependent on the free market. Their quality and prices are among the best in the world. I lived under nationalized healthcare in Europe and went to the black market. Japan was rated #1 in the world for healthcare, and it is a lie.

"Public transportation. This is the year 2012. People need a solid means of transport."

No. Take Amtrack. It is a farce, a waste, a sham. A small portion of the people use it, and it has been taking a loss for decades, and the taxpayers have been burdened by it, people who do not use it. Besides, we are such a huge country, it cannot be compared - as Leftist idiots do - to Europe and the like.

What "black market" are you talking about?

I can't think of one single European country where you are not entitled to choose private medical care if you so wish (and can afford). Same goes for alternative / complementary medicines that may not necessarily be recognised by mainstream doctors/health services.

The only potential for any kind of "black market" that I can think of is perhaps where legal restrictions apply to abortion (Ireland), to abortion time limits (vary from country to country), or to age limits for IVF treatment.

Otherwise, I'm stumped as to the meaning of your statement.

I agree with your views on nationalisation, with the sole proviso that I would prefer to see a heavier government hand in promoting renewable energy (rather than shoring up the fossil fuel industry)..

I found a local friend who said that a doctor would come to our house for cash. It was expensive but worth it. The alternative was taking my child, with a fever, to sit in an office for hours and hours. I once was very sick and had to wait for four hours. Did not want to put my child through that socialized medicine.

I despise socialized medicine. It is a horror, a nightmare. Not only because of the inferior medical care but the government controlling more of our lives, our health and the economy. I hope ObummerCare gets thrown into the sewer where it belongs.

In America, we need less government.

There is nothing illegal in paying privately, even with cash, for medical care.

The only illegality in that situation would be (just as with any other professional or tradesman or freelancer) if the recipient failed to declare the income for tax purposes.

Nor is there any reason to "sit in an office for hours and hours", even with the most basic of healthcare insurance. I'm not sure what country you were in, but this does not chime at all with my experience in ANY European country (and I have lived and worked in several).

Waiting times can and do vary. But that is mainly because emergencies are bumped straight to the front of the queue.

ADDS: Not all doctors make house calls. Many do. Depends not only on the country, but also on location and individual practice. Perhaps you were just unlucky in that respect.

It's all here on this site, concepts galore. What's the matter, too busy earning your pay to bother reading what is right in front of you?

ADDS: I'm also stumped as to why such a purely factual statement, with no personal attack and not even a strong viewpoint, has so quickly been downvoted. I'd really love to hear the other side of the argument instead of just noting that somebody "disliked" it. If you are reading this, dear downvoter: what exactly did you dislike or disagree with in this statement? Are you in favour of, or against, universal healthcare? Do you believe it delivers an inadequate service (and if so, why)? Or do believe the facts I stated were incorrect (if so, which?)

I paid cash. The friend told me that I would have to pay cash. There was an unspoken rule about this. For example, someone came to my place to fix the heater or something. He gave an estimate. Then, I said - all in one sentence - that I would like to pay cash and do not need any receipt. That meant that I knew he could avoid paying the 50% tax. The price dropped about 20% or more with cash.

The medical care is good in Europe. I have heard many horror stories, however, about the waits. I met a Brit in America who would have lost the use of his arm because of the delays, and he was fortunate enough to have a brother in the government who basically changed his residence and shuffled papers so he could have treatment. If he did not have this, he would have lost the use of his arm.

Japan has been rated as #1 in the world for medical care, and I know this system extremely well - from city to countryside, from hospital to private care, from simple treatment to major surgery. I can say without hesitation or reservation - It is INFERIOR to the treatment in the United States.

I do understand the reason that it got rated #1: It is because of the TOTAL of the variables, and treatment is only one factor. It includes proximity of services for people, how many people can afford it, variations in quality, cost, and on and on. But for treatment per se, America outperforms Japan by far, and I mean by far.

So, looking at just treatment, I cannot consider those international ratings. Worthless.

Please present one. MolliBlum seems pretty much a Liberal, and she presents concepts and discusses them in a rational and adult manner. But you Left-wingers vote her down because she does not support every single thing that Leftists advocate, or she asks for reason itself.

That is very revealing.

I hope you do not think it was I who has downvoted you. I have a couple of times, but not now.

I am dead against universal healthcare. If Europeans want it, that is fine. But not for America. Different culture, different history, different way of thinking about the role of government. It is destructive in America, and I am totally against any form, even this insurance crapola that Obama is forcing on the American people against their will.

Yes, it is true that medical services can be unevenly distributed and that sometimes there is a kind of “postcode lottery” even within one region or city, which unfortunately means that some areas have better provisions than others.

However, I don’t think it’s possible to make sweeping claims regarding quality of care for any one country. Breakthroughs and innovations in every medical field (heart surgery, facial transplants, cancer treatments, new drugs, bionic liumbs, etc.) vary in time and place. No one country has a monopoly on any of these.

What you call "socialized medicine" is not necessarily inferior. Within my own close family and circle of friends, I have seen both the very best (even by the highest international standards) and, yes, admittedly, the most abjectly substandard. But that was not the fault of “socialized medicine”. That was the fault of medical error – something that can happen anywhere. Doctors are human beings, too.

No, I didn’t think it was you. Had I expressed a viewpoint you disagreed with strongly, of course, you may well have had every reason to do so. But as I was merely asking you for more information, I found that highly unlikely. More probable that I was downvoted for failing to respond to you with an insult, accusation of trolling or some mocking image.

I am referring to overall. In Japan, rated #1 in the world, I can say that America is far superior in the quality of care. There are probably exceptions. But when one's own body is at stake, politics no longer matter. That is when the rubber hits the road. I needed spinal surgery, and it is available in Japan. Knowing the system here, I flew all the way to America to have it done. And it costs me A LOT more.

This is not just my "biased" opinion. People who know the DIFFERENCE will make this kind of choice. The problem is that people who do not know the other think that their own system is best. A person with whom I work is married to a Brit. Her parents visited them in the US, and her father had some sudden problem. It was heart, I believe. Before, he generally insulted American health care, undoubtedly from what he had read. Well, after getting the treatment, his attitude changed. He actually now flies to America for treatments! I can go on and on with these stories.

I am sure that European treatment is very good, excellent in most cases. It is the American LEFT-WINGERS who constantly disparage our medical care. These LEFTISTS are the ones with whom I have contentions. They demean and insult our care, just like every other thing that they can about America as part of their ideology, parroting the media as directed, spouting the cliches without understanding or experiencing anything.

So it would be better if millions of our fellow citizens go without medical care just so you don't have to wait as long in the doctor's office, is that it? (What a selfish SOB.)

Well, the socialization of virtually anything changes important parameters: Motivation, incentives and desire to innovate. The international clinics are almost pure FREE MARKET at work, and they deliver - by any standards - possibly the best medical care in the world outside of the world-renowned clinics like Johns Hopkins, the Mayo, etc.

And for a fraction (usually 1/5) of US prices.

We will have the level of government that we need, (which will have to be more).

Yes, if you do not attack everything I write, be prepared to be "down-voted." Being popular is very important for the LIBERALS on these threads.

So, you avoid paying taxes, is that it? (No surprise here, typical scamming Republican.)

What is it with you and revelations? You don't even have to scratch the surface to find out what I think. It is all right out there for everyone to see. And reason is a subjective thing, (which is a capability that you lack).

There are two sides to this.

While private/corporate investment may drive innovation in areas of interest to that particular corporation, non profit-driven, government-funded medical research can also yield rich fruits with less glamorous, potentially “unprofitable” or longer-term projects, in nevertheless equally important areas.

Your argument that a government-funded medical body stifles “motivation, incentives and desire to innovate” simply does not hold true. Just a few examples of government-funded medical research that spring to mind for the UK alone (other countries undoubtedly provide equally impressive examples) include:

DNA structure / MRI scans / monoclonal antibodies / beta-blockers / bionic limbs…

No, it is best if millions are responsible. It is best if the freakin' federal government cuts back on the red tape and regulations. It is best if Obummer does not go against the Constitution and make people pay for something that they may not want.

I know you want more government. You would like it to manage every aspect of our lives. Left-wingers want the security and guarantees it promises.

Who avoids taxes? Please substantiate why you commit slander on this thread.

Perhaps I should re-word my statement: The free market will encourage MORE development, innovations, and so on. It CAN occur in government projects, but not as much or as efficiently or as well as the private market overall. Sometimes, government is needed because the private sector simply cannot get the funds or scope that government can. The military is an excellent example.

Do you know that the Koch brothers donated $100 MILLION to cancer research?

LOL!

One of my concerns regarding corporate-funded medical research is that, while it undoubtedly drives innovation in many instances, it is ultimately aimed primarily at financial profit.

Some of the downsides to this may include neglect of areas deemed unprofitable, or an unseemly rush to get drugs or treatments onto the market without adequate long-term studies.

One of the most notorious examples of the latter was the approval and distribution of Thalidomide in the late 50s / early 60s as a treatment for morning sickness, resulting in birth defects affecting thousands of children. More recent examples include vaccine strains that have proven dangerous – such as GSK’s Urabe-strain MMR vaccine, withdrawn in many western countries, yet still marketed in third world countries, in spite of the known dangers.

I cannot remember the names of the drugs, but there have been many instances of drugs that Americans had to get overseas - that were working well in Europe and Canada - because of the absurd regulations. It can be a matter of choice, and the freakin' government takes that out of the hands of the people in many cases. Any treatment has risks, and by over-regulating, the government reduces the choices.

The FDA went nuts with that thalidomide tragedy. It increased it "standards" in response. However, there were costs to that. It started in 1962, and by 1979, the number of new drugs entering the market fell in HALF. In addition, it took much longer for any drug to enter the market and the cost multiplied manifold. In fact, the cost was estimated to be A HUNDREDFOLD and 4 times as long to enter the market.

This is the reason that companies no longer want to develop drugs for the rare diseases.

In other words, in America, BECAUSE OF LEFT-WINGER GOVERNMENT INSANITY, drugs for rare diseases are not developed because OF LEFT-WINGERS' STIFLING OF THE FREE MARKET. It is not because of evil men trying to get more profits per se; it is because OF THE LEFT-WINGER REGULATIONS STRANGLING OUR PRODUCTIVITY AND INCENTIVES.

I think that the CURRENT staff have rightfully wanted to discourage petty bickering. Therefore, I believe, they are deleting posts that contribute to this. This is the reason that I cannot answer in full to the attacks by a specific poster who has been sending me personal emails. This will probably get deleted; that poster also is notorious for flagging posts.

Fair enough.
But if Current staff wish to discourage petty bickering, then either both comments are abusive, or neither is. Allowing one accusatory comment to stand, while deleting another that questions it, is not exactly a consistent approach.

I do not flag people and write letters to the Current staff, and I do not think you do either.

But some people do.

No time for such nonsense. Hence a simple repost.

Hm. The person evading taxes here is the recipient of payment. Enabling such evasion by paying cash without demanding a receipt may be sailing a bit close to the wind, but is not in itself illegal.

Sorry, we need more regulations, not less. The financiers have proven time and time again they cannot be trusted.

I don't care about the minutiae of your boring life. I just feel we all have a right, (that's correct, a right, an entitlement), to health care. I feel the same way about getting a decent job with benefits, (which isn't on any politician's agenda). And there is nothing wrong with security and guarantees. I don't need to know I have a one-in-a-million chance of being a millionaire. I would rather have a secure old age. And, I would rather not have to be at the mercy of people like you.

You mean your handlers.

So maybe you are planning to boycot healthcare and just die?

"Who avoids taxes? Please substantiate why you commit slander on this thread." (The rightist's complaint from above.)
My comment, also from above: "So, you avoid paying taxes, is that it? (No surprise here, typical scamming Republican.)"
The rightist's quote proving my point:
"I paid cash. The friend told me that I would have to pay cash. There was an unspoken rule about this. For example, someone came to my place to fix the heater or something. He gave an estimate. Then, I said - all in one sentence - that I would like to pay cash and do not need any receipt. That meant that I knew he could avoid paying the 50% tax. The price dropped about 20% or more with cash."
Your words not mine. (Can't you even remember what you say?) You colluded with your repairman to gyp the government out of taxes, you cheater you. I find that highly unpatriotic, (but it's just like a rightist to avoid their civic duty). Where's the slander? You should show more responsibility and you should obey the law.
So on the one-hand we have the rightist here going on about how the Tea Party cleans up after itself, (compared to the big bad OWS protesters who "dirtied" the park), and then we get a crash course from the rightest in how to cheat the government. What a GD hypocrite.

Cool.

your mouth to any-and-all-god(s)-ears!

My understanding is that the numbers show clearly that before current era of "corporate-funded-medical-research" when it was the Universities for instance, separate from corporate involvement there was a lot more innovation, more truly new drugs (not endlessly slightly-tweaked current drugs) being developed. That what the "corporatization" did was stymy the communication, the openness necessary of real science (due to the confidentiality bindings, all the precious secrecy for patent-monies holy-sake).

..there is no meaning that's why you're stumped, it's pure Faux Noise, right-wing talking-points and nothing else. Pure propaganda trolling and nothing else.

Well and truly said!

Well said! Agree 100%!

Nice graphic my friend.

:) TY!

Baloney, anyone with any sense should know that if they are not getting a receipt, and if the tax is not clearly delineated, they are avoiding taxes. (The "payer" is saving that money right off the bat, what is the mystery?) This is a huge problem in the United States. Millions of people, (many who are not here legally themselves,and millions more who are), do this every day.
I am sure that the workers who were there to fix our famous rightist's house were off-the books too. This scamming of government goes a long way to underfunding and crashing our social programs, (like Medicare, Social Security, unemployment compensation, disability, state and local taxes, etc.) And, of course, the off-the-books workers are forced to rely on the beneficence of our local health care institutions and welfare agencies if they should find themselves injured on the job.
Do you still think this is a harmless transaction? Our famous rightist troll is probably happy about cheating the government, (because he hates the fact that he has to pay them anything at all).

This is PROOF that you go by how the television directs you.

Let's take a look at one place with which I am familiar with the independence movement: Alaska. The knee-jerk reaction of Left-wingers is that Alaska takes in more in federal monies that it gives out in taxes, so it would lose.

I sincerely hope you do not write that in response, because it would be an uninformed statement, a talking point that is only said by those who are glued to the TV and let it think for them.

The other point is quite obvious: The Left-wingers think that this is something new because the TV is telling them that. The Alaska independence movement started in 1973. The Vermont movement was later, in 2003, and in reaction to the 9-11 attacks.

Turn off your television.

"The Alaska independence movement started in 1973. The Vermont movement was later, in 2003, and in reaction to the 9-11 attacks."

... and fringe groups of people who have wanted to secede from the union before decades before Obama won his second term somehow proves that those people are NOT backwater idiots?

"Let's take a look at one place with which I am familiar with the independence movement: Alaska. The knee-jerk reaction of Left-wingers is that Alaska takes in more in federal monies that it gives out in taxes, so it would lose."

Okay. You're familiar with Alaska then. So put your money where your mouth is and show us the math on this. How much does Alaska receive from the Federal government vs. how much they pay in Federal taxes? Don't worry, we're not actually waiting on a response to that question. You've shown that you don't put up OR shut up often enough that we don't really expect anything from you than a bunch of bitching with nothing real to back it up.

If the originator of the question, Puma, asks, I will provide the data. Or to almost anyone else, Left-winger or Conservative.

I choose not to provide it to you because you will just start word games and go off on meaningless tangents.

What can I say, when you want to dance I follow your lead. Word games from me have spouted from you playing word games where you yourself have twisted what other people have written.

By the way, I am still of the opinion that you are incapable of reading what people actually write and instead substitute what their words say with what you think they mean in your wee little head despite the fact that most of the stuff you respond to in this way is written clearly and has nothing to do with your responses.

I choose not to provide the data to you. This is the same as with the virus. I did not present that information and I will not present it. After I DO present it to Puma or anyone else, I will not discuss it with you, simply because you have already closed your mind, and I refuse to play puerile games.

You distorted what I wrote.

"You distorted what I wrote."

Okay, shoot. How did I distort what you wrote?