Wow. What a nice contribution to the conversation.

That was a bigoted statement.

"That was a bigoted statement"

Seems to me it was more an observation. One could suggest that it was an admission of the obvious.

If the City or County cuts funding for the police then due to a reduced police force we will have to defend ourselves against the same armed thugs that the police are armed against. If we don't need AR 15's then they don't need them, ammo or repair parts.

Two things. 1. The police in the UK don't use guns and they don't seem to have a problem 'defending the public' there. 2. You live in this weird NRA netherworld that thinks the ONLY way to protect yourself is with LETHAL protection.... You can use non-lethal protection and trust me it WILL take down an attacker just as effectively as a gun. Bear mace someone or beanbag shotgun someone and watch how fast they drop to the ground screaming.

This State only allows a small amount of pepper spray, the problem in the US is that the police job is not to protect you like the UK is. They only are required to protect the people that they arrest and a while back they added domestic violence to their job. If you call the police they are NOT required to come so you have to handle things yourself. When the drug dealers have SKS's and AR15's and 30 round Magazines then you also need them. That's why the police have AR's. I've traveled to other Countries and we live in different worlds, I've been to England, Scotland, Spain, Israel and other places. I remember a time when you could leave your door unlocked, things have changed, here a lady said you could go to the store and when you get home your AC unit would be gone. I have two dogs many guns, an alarm system and am installing camera's. There are people about 1 1/2 miles from me that are arrested every year or so for stealing and never go to jail, one has four cases waiting for trail, he is stealing while he's waiting for trail. They need to correct the legal system, another kid I know is 22 years old he had three grand Larsonies and they turned him loose. I caught a guy stealing across the road I have a Business on that side of the road, the police did nothing the next day the same guy was cooking meth, the police did nothing, he was cooking it at a cops house, a bank forecloser got rid of them, the cops did nothing. The only thing I can do is get what guns I think that I need to protect my girlfriend and I, I have a 200 yard shooting range for me to practice on this property.

We AGREE again P!
Supply the eagerly consuming Public, self defense equipment which the police force can't easily overpower, and we have a chance to save the Republic with it's Constitution.

I would like to see you tough guys go at it with the cops or the Government---but we all know the "we'll take arms to protect the second amendment" is just RIGHT-WINGER'S WET DREAMS.

Yo, yo,,,,jack,,,,,my man.....,,,,,,,,........92 LA riots,,,,,cops scared to death......,,,,,,,,.......,,,,,city burned.....,,,,,,......firemen scared to death.....,,,,,......,,,,,....,,,,,,

waco, fibies, atf,,,,, scared that gun toten sympathizers would show up behind them,,,,,,fear is real.

9/11 folks let dolts with box cutters fly them into buildings,,,,,,,,those same dolts today would have those box cutter taken away from them and they would be disemboweled with said box cutters......

folks can get testy..........

Fear is real---let's no be crippled by it. I sit next to women ( for all I know) clocked in Burqas on NYC subways ever since 9/11and never break a sweat. Get a gun loon in the same situation and watch the bullets fly.

You don't stand in line (like the British did) and shoot at each other, there are plenty of people better trained than the police and with more accurate weapons. I don't own or will I ever own an AR15 in ..223 caliber, It isn't accurate enough or have the range that I would demand in a gun, now in .308 I have seen some very accurate AR's.

May you take great comfort in your view. This very progressive liberal, however, while neither owning a gun or being a hunter, would acquire weapons and learn how to use them if I believed it imminently necessary to protect my country, it's constitution and our representative democracy, even from a corrupt and rogue government, if and when necessary.

I guess taking back our freedom is a concept that you don't recognize.

The entire tax code was different. Many more deductions. If you want those levels then adopt all the code not just part of it.

I think most will agree that Republicans of yore did try to work bipartisan when it came to fiscal issues but their social platform was immoral:

After World War II, under Eisenhower the US had low taxes, balanced budgets, and responsible public spending---he also opposed rolling back the New Deal, supporting Roosevelt's libeal social programs as both needed and effective. Of course he also broke away from conservative spending and got the ball rolling on buying on credit.

I think most of the success of the fifties stemmed from new ways of doing things and sensible programs such as the GI Bill, the boom in the auto, technology and housing industries.

In other words people lucked out that W Bush was not president back then because surely he would have FRAKKED things good.

Awww! you want attention---NO!

Perhaps so, but there can be no mistaking the growth of income disparity from that era. No matter how you want to slice it, every day that has passed since the end of the 60s the working man has gotten less of a share of the wealth generated in this country, and fewer and fewer people are holding a greater share of the collective wealth of the nation. All well and fine if you're among the 20% who are thriving (forget all the 1% bullshit), but its a trend that is both unsustainable and one that will lead to the end of the Republic.

"The Republicans of today bear no resemblance to Republicans of that era... but then again neither do Democrats. ..."point taken.

Going back in time is a horrible idea in the context that the trends (I use this as an all encompassing term) that led to growth back then cannot be recreated nor are relevant today. What we should do is take what WILL work and apply it today, this should transcend political ideology. It's a illness that has take root and threatens the global economy everyone needs to work together to turn things around.

As for how this affects the topic at hand all I can say is that, the old gun paradigm has collapse no matter what people spew, the 2nd amendment has become corrupt ( by partisan interpretation) and it's a hindrance to the national well being.

There is great wisdom in placing safety mechanisms to the amendment process. An amendment can be repealed to reflect changing times. When The 18th amendment (prohibiting alcohol) was cancelled by the 21st Amendment, people rejoiced at the marvel of the democratic process. Why is it that for the 2nd it's considered treason ( 40% is still a minority) to contemplate ( we should at least have a civil discussion about it but as you can see a lot of people drum their chests in FALSE bravado claiming they'll kill over such a proposal---then they wonder why I'm such an ass refusing to take them seriously) a national debate that leads to change.

Generally the wealthy own the business and the working person is an employee (big generalization but it will work for this). Are you suggesting that the welder should make the same as the CEO/owner. How about the carpenter? Ditto the mail room person? How are you going to rectify this alleged disparity with the tax code, taxing one person and giving it to his employee? Does the deckhand make the same as the captain or the owner of the boat? Someone has to work for someone else. The employee is paid per the marketplace or work agreement. How come the union laborer does not make as much as the union president? What is your remedy?

No one's buying it Jack, spew your Obamaganda to someone who'll listen.

Don't you have target practice or something sparky?

Who's pissing in who's face? Obama isn't taking anyone's guns. Those who have already bought their assault penis, I mean weapons, get to keep them.

Spoken like true commie propagandist.

Check that froth around your mouth, comrade.

Get a clue. When you're a state that ban guns that have more than 7 bullets in them you obviously don't give a shit about the 2nd Amendment.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/15/us/new-york-gun-bill

You have an obsession with penises. You should probably see someone about that.

You're right. I think I like penis more than you like guns, and I'm fine with that.

"Obama isn't taking anyone's guns. "

Because he can't not because he would not sign a bill to do that or he doesn't want to do it. He can still use the bully pulpit of the presidency and his infamous executive orders to make life as difficult as possible for the non criminal gun owners.
You don't put a rattlesnake on the living room floor and say it's ok because he hasn't bitten anyone yet.

"You have an obsession with penises. "

Where do you get this stuff. Stop lying. There is nothing about a penis in his post. Perhaps you have penis envy but you certainly seem to be preoccupied with the male sexual organ.

The clue I've gotten from your own mouth is that you are a danger to society. Aside from that, I'm done with you.

Today NY would throw out the 2nd Amendment if they could.

Today Obama is willing to take your guns if he could find a way. Until recently he was not in support of a gun band, he has changed his position on guns.

Correct.

"Where do you get this stuff. Stop lying. There is nothing about a penis in his post. Perhaps you have penis envy but you certainly seem to be preoccupied with the male sexual organ."

My apologies to Scrapner on this one everybody. This post should have gone to Swisher.

Forgive me if I don't believe that you know what's in the mind of our president. And I'm the one with the penis obsession, not Scrapner. I believe that anyone who gets riled up about having his ASSAUT WEAPONS restricted, has serious penis envy issues. You need them for what, exactly? Target practice?

"Tell these commie states to go to hell"

HA! Too rich, people actually say this sort of shit, too much.

People not only say it, but are ready to go to war for freedom. You commies may think you'll just write some new laws on paper, and that's that, but you have no clue as to the hornets nest you're poking.

Oh, Oh somebody is ready to "REMOVE" people who just want to keep other people safe. I'm investing in Kevlar. Pew, pew, pew!

You might consider level 3 trauma plates, cause when the bullets start flying, kevlar ain't gonna hack it.

You're sooooo MACHO!

And you're a communist. Sooooo

Nah man! I'm just your run of the mill Lib doing all that I can---BTW we're taking way all your guns away----and your Charlton Heston, John Wayne Posters too.

Liberal = communist.

Prove it.

No it doesn't. Neither does socialism=communism. Both are just juvenile talking points parroted by people with little understanding of what they actually are.

In other words rather than act like mature individuals you advocate murder---let me tell you patriot defender of the constitution, anarchy only leads to chaos.

"anarchy leads to chaos"

And disarming citizens leads to tyrannical rule.

"Prove it."

Res ipsa loquitur.

Could not have said it better. So tired of hearing this stupid argument because they have nothing valid to support their position.

There you go again, and again, and again with that really dumb argument about disarming. Spin, spin, spin. Aren't you dizzy yet?

You are correct, and the plates aren't total protection.

http://www.badrepublicans.com/republican-fascist.html

"Liberal = communist."

No it doesn't. Although, Republicanism = Fascism. Both are just insane political stances parroted by people with little understanding of who they actually follow.

'Are Republicans Fascists?'

"Republicans ARE fascists. They deny it and they'll even call liberals fascists (they love attempting to redefine words that describe them in an unflattering way)."
www.badrepublicans.com/republican-fascist.html

good place to start

fear of loosing will
cause a demand for unwanted product

Wonder who those "other" gun manufacturers are that are not joining in this stupid boycott. See my comment above.

"RIGHTS BEING ATTACKED" true ever since Bush and nobody gave a f*ck---but innocent children are dying and everyone wants to protect ONLY the rights a fringe minority to play with guns.

VILLAINS ALL! Gun owners, gun aficionados and all who support them.

There has been
1862 Gun deaths in the U S
since Newtown December,14,20012

If it wasn't for guns you would now be under British rule, probably a serf.

Currently at least 40% of Americans enjoy their right to "play with guns". No matter how you want to look at it, you've got to admit it hardly constitutes a "fringe minority"

Its only an illusion that we are not still ruled by the same Old World aristocrats and that we are not serfs. Well, I guess there have been some New World industrialists added to the ruling classes, but face it dude.... unless you're one of the ruling class you are just another peon.

Not so I would be somewhere in Europe, that is if I ignore history like you just did.

When most are acting like irresponsible maniacs I call them a fringe minority. When the less maniacal, the ones often referred to as responsible gun owners, chose to side with the frothing at the mouth Ted Nugent types they lost all credibility and should be lumped together with the rest.

I get what you're saying tho'.

A tragedy. Gun violence grows geometrically it seems.

I agree

Its unfortunate that the cacophony that comes from the extremists drowns out the voices of the rational. Its not really fair though to imply that the 'less maniacal' are actually siding with nut job Ted simply because they are on the opposite side of the issue of gun control.

Excellent observation, Keyser. And disarming America is on the checklist for world domination. They can't rule us because we outnumber them, and we shoot back.

Then you can take your socialist ideas to Europe where they belong.

There's another lie. Enactment of the 2nd Amendment had NOTHING to do wiith fear of British rule. It was to satisfy the Southern plantation owners' fear of being unable to protect themselves in the event the slaves decided to rally against them, and they (the slaves) certainly would have had good reason to, and certainly would have been successful because of their numbers. 100's of slaves against a handful of oppressors - I'd call that a fair fight. So in order to get Virginia to ratify the Bill of Rights, it demanded the clause guaranteeing a well-armed militia whose sole purpose was to keep the slaves in line. Stop bullshitting!

I don't know where that 40% figure came from. I would suspect that a lot more believe in the right to own guns. Not all people who believe in the right to own guns actually own them themselves, but still support the 2nd Amendment. Just because they may object to owning them themselves for fear of accidental shootings, they would not deny others the right to keep them. So all this trumped-up fear factor that the NRA is spewing to its less intelligent comrades is really just a ploy to get everyone to run out and buy more guns, bigger guns, bigger clips and on an on. Obviously there are enough looney toons out there who buy into the crap. How easy it is to separate a fool from his/her money. Just scare the shit out of them with a pack of lies. Poetic, isn't it?

Hey Jack, are you sure you mean geometrically and not "exponentially?" Just asking.

And yet, despite the plethora of armed citizens they do rule over us. I fear Rousseau was correct when he said "Liberty may be gained, but can never be recovered", the kind of spirit to stand up to oppression is nothing but an illusion, America will collapse under the weight of complacency and ignorance long before anyone stands up to fight.

I used the figure of 40% as its a reasonably conservative estimate based on recent surveys done by Gallup. http://www.gallup.com/poll/150353/self-reported-gun-ownership-highest-1993.aspx

While I agree that much of the paranoia surrounding this debate is foolish, I also consider the notion that gun controls are going to solve anything equally ludicrous. And as for separating the fool from their money, take a look at the experience up north. After spending billions of dollars on a gun registry program, the Canadians have scrapped the program because it turned out that law enforcement were not even bothering to consult the registry when responding to calls. And if it cost billions to administrate for Canada, can you imagine how much would be squandered in America to run such a useless program?

To me, by their silence and inaction, they have become part of the problem. They, as responsible, gun owners should have seen the writing on the wall and spoken against the insane assault weapons build-up. But it's always easier to let the foam at the mouth lunatics do the dirty work.

This is what happened with the so called responsible gun owners they let their rabid dogs do the dirty work and now that the heat is on they want to distance themselves from them saying, "hey I just want reasonable guns for rotation and recreation" and to protect my 2nd amendment rights.

I say f*ck them, f*ck them all to hell! they stood mute as the guns got out of hand and the bodies of the innocent piled-up. Now it's our turn ( people against guns by your estimation a majority of 60%) to push for a Ratification of the 2nd Amendment.

Even if the message itself is a lie?

Absolutely correct!

Agreed!

See my comment above. The NYPD has a stockpile of confiscated weapons, as do many police departments. Why pay for them when they can get them for free? You're absolutely right that they would not have a hard time purchasing weapons. They could even get very well made weapons from German manufacturers if they needed to, but I don't see that they even need to.

I agree two thumbs up
thanks for speaking up

Only an idiot would think freedom loving Americans are gonna just bow down to a tyrannical government and give in to their communist agenda.