Are Groups on Current no longer important?

Ah,,,,,thanks man ! ( just read this,....8 days later ! - apparently. )

Sort of sad when you have to make that sort of comparison at all.

i admire the fact that you haven't given up on this place over the years, kudos

yepper. +^d

Still here?

+^d

Another suggestion:
How about a 5 post max to each newsgroup per day?
You could still post hundreds (you know who you are).....
;~}

I agree about that.

It would help A LOT to quit thinking in terms of "newsgroups" and more in terms of "groups" . ( My 2 bits )

Otherwise - anyone who actually has the MOTIVATION should add any and all content as best they can !
For me , it takes all HELL of a long time to manufacture a really good art post. If all one does is cut and paste a single link, well, no big deal really,..........and sharing is GOOD !

There IS a lot of "death to plutocracy/capitalism stuff, in multiple incarnations,....ALL THE TIME, ubiquitously,.....for my personal taste.
Still - - - - " G U I L L O T I N E " !

Agreed.

Yes it is I'm still not sure why they have it. I guess it's to make us not feel so bad about not getting swag any more. I guess it was cutting into the profits to much

The "badges" don't even function ( point derivative wise ), they have never bothered or managed to fix the glitches.

I don't mind-em,....but I have a high tolerance for frivolous fun.

I liked the recommendy button WAY better ... at least you KNEW who was recommending the comment .

Badges ARE cheaper than schwag .... ah , the good old days ....

Yes and so nice to see you. :)

I'd be more into the badges if I could save them up for a toaster or something.

Not bad. I have not seen you in a while. Hope you are well. You are one of those missed voices. :)

there ya go spouting the truth. they don't like that ya know.

Thank you bailey, nice to here from you.

nice to be heard Have a great day.

Agreed. Great post!
V: for Voices of every political bent, to out lies and to fairly, democratically (small d) share their reasons for leaning toward the party they favor and away from the one they do not, and toward the current issues that are worth the time of exposing.

Sir, that was most excellently formulated and expressed. Bravo.

I would sooooooo repost that as a feature in its own right if I actually thought it would last a second.

Sharp. Occasionally a fellow with the tag of Saladin will pen micro-essays I admire as much.

Thats a " +^d "

Thank you, I may re-post, I'm really sick of the believers though. Which is why I'm not here much anymore. Take care.

Thanks.

What it all comes down to, V is just another round of mental masturbation on your part, preaching to the intellectual low lifes you feel animous toward because they don't buy into every iota of YOUR group think which you claim to despise. That is the great flaw of your sense of purist idealism. You feel above the fray and your vast intellect unimpeachable. Nobody is that perfect. What sets your edicts and proclamations apart from that of Olbermann's? You see things in very black and white terms but frequently avoid the gray when it doesn't fit into your neat view of the world according to V. Everyone would sell a little bit of their soul in order to survive which many of us do, some people even on eBay. Some people can claim not to "sell out to the man" but has someone doing the day job thing to provide the needed health insurance for their family, some of which have the luxury of doing "non-traditional" work. The Current community has become a joke not because of Olbermann or even Al Gore but because of the Napoleonic staff who are on their own little ego trips and establish their reason for being by bullying faceless names on a blog site. There is no leadership micro-managing their cluelessness. Cut to the short story and spare us another lecture about how you've figured out the whole story about the plutocrats. We've heard the story before and in this context it's like bringing up Shakespeare to do a dissertation on South Park. It's just to stroke your ego in front of an audience and nothing more.

My question to you is, why are you here?
I'm not talking about any difference of opinion we may have on a given subject, primarily because intelligent counterpoint is necessary! This should not be a forum with only one mindset allowed and it isn't.

The reason I ask, why are you here, is because you denigrate the whole business model, it is a business and needs to pay its overhead, while you to use it as a pulpit to spout your rhetoric.

Did you notice nobody involved took down your lengthy post? On other similar News and Information sites, your post wouldn't have seen the light of day. I don't want to use an example such as the Huffington Post , oops!

Seriously though, this station/forum has taken huge strides to become a respected source for progressive commentary; by bringing in The Young Turks and Keith Olbermann.

Both of these entities bring with them a background of integrity and are willing to sign on with Current because its business model will enable them to expand their exposure.

"so if you're anyone, and I do mean anyone left or right, who is correctly pointing out the lies, deceit and hypocrisy of the 1%, you better damn well make sure, that your income doesn't put you IN that 1%, 5% or even 10% income bracket, or you are the very thing you so enthusiastically criticize, ergo, you are a hypocrite."

To this I say bullshit and I say it with meaning. There are many who are in the 1% who stand behind and help the movement simply because they believe in our country. Occupy is not a club, restricted by being one of the 99%. What happens when we're successful, are you going to kick the founders out because they don't belong to the 25%?

My question, again, is why you are here? You cut down the new attempts to make this site more exposed and relevant. You cut down Al Gore, even though he has never tried to hide his economic position, just because he's a 1%er. What about David Crosby and Graham Nash? What about Michael Moore, Jackson Brown and any other 1%er who wants to change the income disparity of this country.

Al Gore may be in line to make mucho dinero off of Current and I wish him well, because the more successful Current is, the greater the influence and audience.

Scooter,

Let's start from the beginning; this is the second time you have made derogatory statements of my post since an incident occurred with a mutual acquaintance. I remember having what I thought was a pleasant conversation with you on the phone, and you chose to divulge parts of that conversation to that mutual acquaintance, I am not upset with you for that, but what upsets me is the way you decided to do it, you never said, hey I would like to share this with this person, is that okay? You just went ahead and did it, then, immediately after getting a very upset response from that mutual acquaintance in a PM, you decided to go into attack mode, and this is the second time, after a long time, that you have attacked me, again, it is inappropriate, I am surprised, as well as disappointed, before saying anything else, I will defend my position.

“What it all comes down to, V is just another round of mental masturbation on your part, preaching to the intellectual low lifes you feel animous toward because they don't buy into every iota of YOUR group think which you claim to despise."

*I do not feel "animous” towards anyone, it is you saying that, not my actions.

"That is the great flaw of your sense of purist idealism."

*I do not identify with “purist idealism" as you claim, if anything, I feel it is idealism which is responsible for this country being in the hell in a handbasket that it is both economically and socially, if anything, my position is the antithesis of idealism, and it is the failure of those unfortunate workers in this situation that I have experienced first-hand, which gives testament to the difference wanting to "believe" in something-regardless of the track record and available data available- and as something actually is.

Not long ago, I was an unpaid council representative of a fairly small town, as has been the case repeated all over America, the corporation approached the local citizens and council with the desire to build a manufacturing plant, making all good promises to appease the local population, they would respect the environment, respect the workers, and basically play by the rules, in exchange they got huge tax shelters, and other "incentives" to bring the plant to the town, after four years, and breaking every promise they had made, they simply shut down the plant and left, leaving the community holding the bag, the ugly eyesore of the empty plant, and the pollution that it had generated.

I voted against the proposal, but because of the call of jobs jobs jobs, the vote went the other way and the deal was approved, I knew that it was a bad deal, but there was nothing I could do. Where the people who approved this deal bad people? No, they were good people who wanted to BELIVE what they were told by the company, they wanted to BELIVE the company was being honest, that their environment would not be screwed they were being idealistic, I was being a realist-based on analysis of the company's track record-end result, they lost, the company won, but for you to say that I function in a “sense of purist idealism” is patently and demonstratably wrong.

Cont-

“You feel above the fray and your vast intellect unimpeachable. Nobody is that perfect.”

*Again, you were saying things about me that I've never said about myself, I never said I had a “vast intellect” as you say I believe I do, nor do I feel I am “unimpeachable”, you are saying that, you are not talking to WM here, I am not narcissistic, if I have any knowledge of all, it comes from others far far greater in knowledge than myself. What I do believe in, is science, logic and reason, which I feel is about the best that any person can hope to possess.

“What sets your edicts and proclamations apart from that of Olbermann's?”

*There are many things, but I'll just mention two, first of all, I am not known throughout the world as a charismatic, well spoken and intelligent spokesmen for the (supposed) interest of the working class, hell, I'm not known at all, but that does not mean that what I am saying is not true. Secondly, I am not a media personality that makes millions if not multimillions of dollars putting forth observations about the inequities of a system which through the common worker overboard at least 30 years ago, yet at the same time, displaces those very same workers with their egregious salary, if you read my original statement-this is something that Keith does all the time so I will do it here-I pointed out that it's a matter of resource allocation, and that anyone, left, right or middle inevitably harms others when they "earn" tremendously large sums of money disproportionate to their needs, or service.

“You see things in very black and white terms but frequently avoid the gray when it doesn't fit into your neat view of the world according to V.”

*Yes that is true, I see existence in very black and white terms, because that's what it is, that means that what we are communicating with right now is black and white, ones and zeros, binary, it is not what I say it is, it simply is, and that is provable. Even much of that which seems subjective on the surface-like say our personal preference in a given flavor of ice cream-comes down to our genes, but ultimately, it comes down to how those genes came together when we were conceived, and again, that comes down to numbers, to some this may sound cold or harsh, but if you've noticed, this is the position of nature itself.

Nature is quite indifferent whether an organism lives or dies, depending on the sickness, nature can provide you with remedies to help you get well, conversely, it also offers poisons that can kill you outright, ultimately, it is a matter of an individual's constitution, intelligence and yes luck, that determines whether or not a given individual will survive in this world, this is the "natural" world were talking about here, not the modern one, which has enabled the artificial survival of billions of people, in the "natural" world, a rattlesnake bite for instance would most likely kill you, now thanks to science- assuming you're close enough to a city - anti-venom can be administered, and you have a much higher probability of surviving, once again-numbers/probability-it depends on how much venom you received, how long it took you to get to a hospital, or to receive aid, very black and white indeed, either you get the antivenom and get it in time, or your ass dies, not the world according to V but existence as it actually is.

“Everyone would sell a little bit of their soul in order to survive which many of us do, some people even on eBay.”

*Okay.

“Some people can claim not to "sell out to the man" but has someone doing the day job thing to provide the needed health insurance for their family, some of which have the luxury of doing "non-traditional" work.”

*Okay, yes some of us are blessed with individual situations which put us in better survival positions than others.

“The Current community has become a joke not because of Olbermann or even Al Gore but because of the Napoleonic staffs who are on their own little ego trips and establish their reason for being by bullying faceless names on a blog site.”

*I am in general agreement with you here concerning the staff, but I have a little bit of disagreement concerning the operation, ultimately, Al Gore owns the business, site and show, his word and orders are paramount, he is the captain of the ship, so I do not let him off the hook that easily, for those " Napoleonic staffs” you mentioned, something could be done.

“There is no leadership micro-managing their cluelessness.”

*Absolutely correct.

“Cut to the short story and spare us another lecture about how you've figured out the whole story about the plutocrats.”

*I. did not say I did, nor did I mean to infer that, I simply reiterated that this is how a plutocracy works, because apparently, the available evidence strongly seems to suggest, that the majority of Americans are not aware that they live in a plutocracy and actually believe they live in a democracy, and such misconceptions, ultimately hurt you I and all of us, and that is something that I feel that is important for folks to know.

“We've heard the story before and in this context it's like bringing up Shakespeare to do a dissertation on South Park.”

*Whether intended or not, I get what you're saying and it's very funny. I love South Park.

“It's just to stroke your ego in front of an audience and nothing more.”

*This is blatantly false, again I am not WM and require ego enhancement methodologies, I feel you are saying this in anger, as you should know I'm not the type of person.

In conclusion, I just wanted to reiterate since the beginning of this post, that this is the kind of division, which keeps us divided. I am agnostic, as you are, I am socially progressive, again as you are, and the fact that this is taking place is both detrimental and ridiculous. If I did not care, I would not have taken the considerable time to compose this post, as we got along fine before, and I would like to have that relationship again.

You have a good mind, and on apology would not make you a lesser man, but a much bigger one. I await your response.

Good question, I'll be right back.

I will have to get back to you maybe tomorrow, until then.

"Let's start from the beginning; this is the second time you have made derogatory statements of my post since an incident occurred with a mutual acquaintance"

I'm so glad you brought this up, V. Because it was the very moment that I lost all respect for you for the way you exposed what a petty, vain and jealous individual you are, not very attractive characteristics and ones I thought deserved no respect in return. It was you who went on an unsolicted tirade about said mutual acquaintance (one who I respect very highly) in a PM to me. What was this mutual acquaintance's biggest crime? Not agreeing with your petty, jealous stance on Keith Olbermann who you admit in your original post is on your shit list because of how much he makes. You lost all respect for our mutual acquaintance because she just couldn't see things your way and thus had to be deposed from your circle of "comrades". That and because she wouldn't get on the phone with you because she had her own inklings about your personality flaws. She proved correct. It was OK for you to trash our mutual acquaintance quite unsolicitedly to me but I needed permission from you to reveal your irrational attacks upon her character? Sounds a bit convoluted to me. That is the danger of the net, once words are out in the public domain, their repercussions are forever to be dealt with for good or bad. You can compose as many justifications to your pompous attitudes and callous discarding of prior "comrades" as you want, V. It doesn't change the fact that you have an irrational acid test you use to judge a person's worthiness to be a part of your very select group who are not subjected to your judgmental slings and arrows. And that is where you employ Orwell's concept of group think in your own existence. You've shown yourself to be someone who lambasts people who don't follow your very narrow view of the world, but those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw as many rocks as you do.

Thanks for that. I merely expressed a question as to why the groups we start and have here have lost their priority because I think it affects participation and the diversity of the site. If you voluntarily don't come here for whatever reason, that's your busniness and your decision. But of course, some never miss a chance to take a whack at Al Gore because he dares to make some money from his endeavors as if that is only taboo for him and no one else.

Bottomline (and this is not just to you CruzanKenny): I liked the old format with groups included better. I don't like having to tag every post I make with Community in order for it to be seen and acknowledged. I'm bored with seeing the same posters on the frontpage based on that because they post fifty posts a day there to try to push everyone else off. I want more balance here instead of just politics 24/7. I actually was then hoping the site with the feedback of those of us who do care about it and enjoy being here could maybe make some changes here to balance it out for those of us who come here frequently. And to end this, I think Al Gore and Joel Hyatt on the whole did a pretty damn good thing by giving us this site which is why I don't want to lose it (and isn't it funny how the usual screeds against him and his making money off Current never extend to Joel Hyatt or anyone else making money.)

I will say this however: to the staff member who pushed this back or blocked it from Community view, you should at least have the guts to come here and tell me why.

Thanks.

Bravo! Voted up!

That is the root of it - - -( i think )

[ I voted against the proposal, but because of the call of jobs jobs jobs, the vote went the other way and the deal was approved, I knew that it was a bad deal, but there was nothing I could do. Where the people who approved this deal bad people? No, they were good people who wanted to BELIVE ]

- another sooth well spoke !

I wholeheartedly agree, if it wasn't for remanns messaging me to come and help in the fight, I wouldn't have known it was taking place.
The question I have, is to whom do we direct our questions/problems/solutions.
I know during one post, when anonymous threatened to publish names and faces of those in the Mexican cartels; there were a bunch of posters spouting off, just letting off steam at the cartels.
I truly felt there was not enough protection for people spouting threats, nor enough caution. After all, how hard is it to track an ISP and how much does it really cost to take your message anywhere in the western hemisphere. I'm talking the Cartel's message! Having first hand knowledge of the result of a cartel member feeling disrespected; I felt a responsibility to let Current know just what risks their posters were taking.
KB723 was enormously helpful, and probably saved some lives.
Duzins, is apparently on the staff, who decides what is a threat and what isn't, so I wish to ask you, the posters and lurkers, what they make of this statement:

"And for any blogger or journalist that hides behind a keyboard and acts like a coward by writing names of Mexican gang members, well if you get caught, of course something is going to happen to you."

Duzins decided this did not constitute a threat. I respectfully disagree!
I've witnessed, all to often, the extreme importance these cartels place on respect and losing face.
So with the help of KB723, I was able to penetrate the outer skin of those who moderate and control these posts.
I recently posted a Blog so inspiring It has changed countless lives, http://www.danoah.com/2011/11/im-christian-unless-youre-gay.html. It received nothing, not even a single hit, while it had 6,600 comments on its first post. What did it receive here? 0

scooter,

That you are referring to me as a "petty, vain and jealous individual" speaks volumes of how upset you and any parties concerned are, however, I feel I have been very misconstrued. You seem to forget, that at no time, of my conversation of the third-party concerned, did I ever denigrate them as a "person" as a matter of fact, I remember saying how much respect I had for you and the other person concerned, I just took serious intellectual issue with the heroism (KO) and or nationalism, as a matter of fact, I have stated both publicly and in a PM, that I have great respect for you and the other parties concerned.

Regardless, the only thing that I can say, because of a apparently very misconstrued intention on my part, is that I am sincerely sorry if I have offended you or anyone else concerned with my attempts to bolster critical analysis, I am truly sorry, and I generally feel that you, or any parties concerned, are good, Intelligent, and well intentioned individuals, again, my sincerest apologies.

Apology accepted, V. Time to move on.

- sigh -

I pine. +^d

There are a lot of things missing that made this a great site.

RSS feed,........hmmmmm......

Nah. I have to be here to post my own twisted interest to "bOObies" and SF&F and Comics" and suchlike . . .

-but I may have to try it just the same,.....kewl . . .

I tried to get people to ban togeather when they first did away with the groups. But I was told to grow up. I am now telling those that want the site to change to GROW UP!

Ok! Thats one way to look at it.

Well I was part of that as well and I never told you to grow up. I understand you are upset but I would appreciate you not taking it out on me. In essence you are saying because I posted this now I need to grow up. I'm beginning to regret posting this.

Your are correct Jan I did look to see what was said in the post and you were one of the ones that didn't talk down to me. I apoligize for that last comment.Oh and never regret posting something that lights a fire under the masses. For me to come back and start posting even if I'm just ranting and blowing off steam is a good thing. An again Jan sorry to cause you grief

You did a reasonable, and timely, c u r r e n t thing. Put post regrets in the past. +^d

Aww did they do something to upset you? Aww what a shame.

You having a bad day, Brother?

- not being able to message ALL your connections IS a pain in the ass,.....I had forgotten about that little thorn-in-paw.

p.s. - glad your resources were here to share ! appreciated.

I do miss Zoro. ( Well,....that may have to do somewhat with the company he always brought with him )

I don't think there IS an "official" way to REALLY field suggestions - and "collective bargaining" is actively discouraged.

"Community feedback" is something of a Limbo option to explore,.....but folks can give it a shot.

But the structural mechanics of accessing "Groups" should be rethought by c u r r e n t if the actual INTENT is to facilitate them as opposed to simply serve as "lures" to retain those relative few who still try to maintain them.

( mulling over possible alternative layouts even now . . . .)

How about this - just put a tab on the top of the page that says "GROUPS" between "SCHEDULE" and "COMMUNITY" - a "one step" LINK,....just for a starter.

As a sub-LINK,....add an index/ list of EVERY single group at c u r r e n t that includes its number of posts and members,...preferable on a looooooooooong single page.

I just went to feedback and noticed you had put up a similar suggestion a year ago and it was implemented.
Perhaps you new suggestion will be implemented, too. If you submit it.

I will have to check that out ! Its news to me !

This morning I was using my iPad, I went to feedback, and the menu looked very different. I can't even find what I had this morning.....(twilight zone music here)

weirdness indeed !

I fully agree - but c u r r e n t is NOT a political action committee,.....it IS a forum for exchange of ideas, art, creativity, new science, history - - -culture.

( It can somewhat DOUBLE as a soap box,....but it is not PRIMARILY a soap box. At least, it wasn't,....and that is certainly MY hope. )

When I discovered this site, it appeared to be a political site, but discussions of culture etc in today's society are another way of sticking our heads in the sand. As intelligent members of the society, we have an obligation to discuss the issues that will affect our quality of life, our freedoms and our ability to discuss culture, etc. We must change society so that all have the opportunity to discuss culture and arts, rather than work 14 hours a day to survive. I can't in good conscience discuss Van Gogh or the beauties of nature when all residents of our country don't have access to adequate housing, food, water or education. When all of us have the free time to enter these discussions, I will stop my calls for political activism.

I don't believe anyone here is asking YOU to modify your personal behavior or belief system in any way - I certainly have no motive to do so - its simply that your crusades may not interest ME - all the time -as much as they personally interest YOU - all the time - .

In other words this is a shared forum with diverse goals and interests,....follow your bliss as best you may.

I am seeking to protect your ability to follow your bliss, remain oblivious and know that others are looking out for your interests and free speech rights. Follow your bliss and achieve happiness, I know I won't have any until all in our country have the same leisure time to discuss arts and culture, etc.

heh heh heh heh - [ Most of the posts now can be answered by: "Yea, that sucks" or Yea, he/she sucks". ]

I soooooooooooooooo agree . It has sort of a "pep rally" vibe to it,......with just a pinch of "brown shirt politics" thrown in for spice.

p.s. Still,.....I do like to "yell" G U I L L O T I N E ! ( so I can relate to some extent )

I belive I said this would happen when they made the last bunch of changes. But did any one listen??? Helll NO! People said I was being petty and that nothing had really changed. SO What has happen to change the minds of the NAY sayers??

now, now,.....lets not be mean !

Like Buckaroo Banzai says .. "Don't be mean.."

I agree , a lot of idiot stories about celebrities and fear mongering all of a sudden . I do not like it . I am posting stories , but i cannot get them to enough active connections to get on the front page anymore ....