Director Tom McCarthy on "Win Win"

After writing and directing The Station Agent and The Visitor, actor Tom McCarthy is three-for-three with Win Win. The story isn't easily encapsulated, but weaves carefully-crafted characters through a family drama that involves high-school wrestling, rest homes, and rehab. Mike, a small-town lawyer (played by Paul Giamatti), is desperate to raise money to support his family, so he's signed on as legal guardian for Leo, an aging client with dementia. Then Leo's grandson Kyle (played by newcomer Alex Shaffer) comes to live with his grandfather. Things seem to be going well, until Kyle's mother (Melanie Lynskey) arrives, fresh from drug rehab and determined to cash in on Leo's estate. McCarthy explains how the story came to be, and his little victories along the way.

Q: Why is it called Win Win? It's a sports movie, but that's not really a sports term...

A: When we were talking about, it was all win-win. Get Leo, put him in the home, get the cash, it's a win-win. Get the kid, win the wrestling meets, it's a win-win.  And it has something to do with why we're in this current situation as a country, in that we were sold that bill of goods: win, win, win. Low rates, no rates, no nothing! Get, get, get! And who wouldn't want that, if you went to the bank to get a mortgage, and they didn't expect you to pay? I think that's something we've seen a lot. And now we're being more cautious in those situations.

Q: Were you thinking about making this more of a wrestling movie at first?

A: Early on, we thought it would be a super broad sports comedy. The surface is the conventional world, and the challenge was how to do it so it was funny, and live, and engaging, so you want to spend time with these characters. There's a bunch of obstacles in Mike's life, including Leo and Kyle. Leo is in the early stages of dementia, and needs someone to take care of him and his estate, so Mike ends up taking on Leo as his guardian. I wasn't thinking of this as an assembled family, or trying to recreate one. It's more about the connections you make in life. In my ways, it's the inverse of my other films.

Q: This is Alex Shaffer's first film -- why go with an unknown who had never acted before?

A: I decided early on that I wanted to use a wrestler, as opposed to having an actor learn to play a wrestler. That's how it started. I can't stand to see an actor play a sport when he's not proficient in that sport. I was a wrestler, and so was my co-writer, so we thought a lot about the actual wrestling, and the moves. And I hired a stunt coordinator -- his brother was my wrestling coach in high school -- so we mapped it all out. But Alex brought his own thing to it, he interpreted it his own way, which was great but sometimes hard to capture, because he moves around a lot, with a lot of bouncing backwards. It was hard to keep him in frame!

Q: Where did the slap come from, when Paul slaps the kids before they start?

A: From my wrestling coach! Because he slapped us. We still haven't figured out why. But no, we didn't ask him to, the way Kyle asks Mike. The idea here was to get the blood pumping.

Q: Did you want him to look like Eminem, or was that his own style?

A: He showed up like that. I noticed a lot of the young men on his team had dyed their hair blonde, in solidarity, the night before the match. I thought, "Perfect." There's something about that look that doesn't say jock to me. His whole demeanor is more of a surf/skate/punk kid, so it worked. You don't expect what's coming.

Q: How did you cast the moms -- good mom, bad mom?

A: I sort of wrote the role of Jackie with Amy in mind. She struck me as being sharp, and warm, and caring. She's got a wide range, but she can conceal it in a selfless way, as an actress. She's that perfect Everyperson in a scene who can give you what you need. Melanie Lynskey, there was a lot of development for her part. I had someone else in mind who wasn't available. And then my agent started sending me material, and I saw her in The Informant! -- and then I realized I had seen her in a lot of things, but she's always changing. What a life she brought to this role. It's not who you expect to walk in.

Q: Amy's character is a Jon Bon Jovi fan -- how did you get the music?

A: We had no money for music, and all these wealthy rock stars won't even come to the phone if you have no money. But he was great. He said, "Cool, name your price." And I said it, and he said, "OK." And then I said, "Can I make it lower, actually?" [Laughs] I felt there needed to be something anthemic in that part of the movie, and then my music supervisor found "Have A Nice Day," which just explodes coming out of the locker room. It just worked out nicely that way.

Q: Actors who are also directors sometimes make cameos in their films. Are you somewhere hidden in this?

A: I do make a cameo in this. You might have missed me. I'm in the background, in the locker room. But I don't like to take on larger roles when I'm writing and directing. The idea of stepping in front of the camera in that situation doesn't appeal to me. And my involvement as an actor doesn't help get the movie made! [Laughs]