Snow study shows California faces historic drought
source: http://www.reuters.com/article/environmentNews/idUSTRE50S7NK20090129
-
-
- JanforGore
- added this
What do you think is the answer?
-
-
Bren589
-
water restiant plants
- 3 years ago
-
Bren589
-
-
csmonut
-
I don't know if there is an answer. I guess people will just have to start eating their lawns for nourishment.
- 3 years ago
-
csmonut
-
-
JanforGore
-
So true. Nor can we continue to look to people we place on pedestals and make saviors to bail us out either. There have been far too many years wasted with people disassociating themselves from their part in seeking accountability and in distracting themselves with frivolous BS to the point of the destruction of all that is truly important for our survival.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
mik661
-
The last two hundred years has seen the industrial revolution and incredible population growth. It also has been one of the wettest 200 years in recorded history. Now that rainfall and climate is transitioning to more historic levels we have found ourselves to be in a completely unsustainable situation. War, famine and massive population die off are very likely our future. We cant keep depending on technology to bail us out.
- 3 years ago
-
mik661
-
-
seanalyn
-
Growing up in the Central Valley I remember some pretty bad droughts which caused horrible dust storms. Once when I was young, I remember riding home like mad on my bike as a wave of dust roared behind me...not fun :/
- 3 years ago
-
seanalyn
-
-
Dmitri_Molotov
-
Well shit...
- 3 years ago
-
Dmitri_Molotov
-
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation
-
More over use of natural supplies - book excerpt
The mighty Colorado once running swiftly from the Rocky Mountains now rarely arrives at the Gulf of California. No longer could those in Utah, Arizona, Nevada, or California count on its lifeblood. The Yellow River in China, home to over 1.3 billion of the world’s population, since before recorded time regularly rose in the mighty Himalayan glaciers travelling 4,000 kilometers for its annual meeting with the Yellow Sea. Since 1985 the river often never arrives. The Yangtze River rises in the mountains of Qinghai Province on the Tibetan plateau and flows 6,300 kilometers to the East China Sea, opening at Shanghai. The Yangtze river basin accounts for 40 percent of China’s freshwater resources, more than 70 percent of the country’s rice production, 50 percent of its grain production, more than 70 percent of fishery production, and 40 percent of China’s GDP (source: Claudia Delpero, communications manager with the World Wildlife Fund’s European Policy office). The Yangtze, Mekong, Ganges, Brahmaputra, and Indus are the life blood for many more billions of people.
www.strategicbookpublishing.com/ZEROGreenhouseEmissions.html
- 3 years ago
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation
-
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation
-
And more
The canary had indeed started to die of thirst over only the last half-century as competition had resulted in a tripling of demand for water. The drilling of millions of wells for irrigation to supplement nature’s supplies brought another manmade economic driver, for food exports, for growing GDP. The agricultural revolution had preceded its industrial counterpart, but was now competing for its share of the emptying cup. Falling water tables in China are affecting harvests of grain (China is the world’s largest grain producer), while competing internally with its developing industrial hubs its agriculture is loosing out. In 2001 a groundwater survey of the water table under the North China Plain that produces over 50 percent of the country’s wheat and over 30 percent of its corn was falling faster than earlier reports had shown. The water table was dropping nearly 3 meters annually and in some towns in the province falling twice as fast. Yields and production volumes were continuing to fall where irrigation was needed, including rice harvests falling from the 1997 production of 140 million tonnes to 127 million tonnes in 2005. Its growing urban populations as well as its industrial development had been competing for water and was now in conflict, going in opposite direction with no signs of a slow down.
Similarly in India, the southern state of Tamil Nadu, fast becoming an aspirer to industrial development and home to more than 62 million people, faced drying wells with 95 percent of those in the farming community suffering. The International Water Management Institute suggested that “When the balloon bursts, untold anarchy will be the lot of rural India.” Would this be their water domino?
In neighboring Pakistan, whose population grows by 3 million per year, water tables are falling, with similar problems to that faced by India. And the water balloon wasn’t any stronger in the developed countries’ agricultural bread basket.
Australia was gripped by droughts and crumbling agricultural infrastructure. The Murray Darling river system was in crisis, so much so that irrigation for agriculture would not be allocated in 2007. With the drought in Queensland so severe, and with water restrictions for its citizens, the government reduced supplies to coal-fired power stations. - 3 years ago
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation
-
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation
-
Another excerpt from the book.
When will “Peak Water” hit, or has it already peaked while going mostly unnoticed?
Fossil water reserves built up in ancient underground aquifers will run dry, we are being told. In fifteen of some of the world’s most populous nations, it is already underway. In the United States the vast Ogallala aquifer was being overexploited. Under the North China Plain and in Saudi Arabia, unsustainable depletion was well underway. Overpumping of aquifers was happening in Iran, Israel and Jordan, India and Pakistan, Mexico, Morocco and Spain, Tunisia and Syria, in the Yemen and South Korea.
When would the water refugees start to migrate? When would the citizens of the cities’ toilets and showers run dry? Which water domino would fall first? Was this lifeblood supply of water to be stopped for agriculture and irrigation, allowing it to wilt and die? Would our tap be turned off for the industrial model we had built our economic lives around? Would we feed ourselves or the machines of industry?Bob Williamson
- 3 years ago
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation
-
-
txpacotaco
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation:
I grew up in the Panhandle of Texas, and the Ogallala was the source of the drinking water for our town (Canyon), and for the well and irrigation on my grandparent's farm. It was the sweetest water I've ever tasted - I could drink gallons of it. By the time I was a teenager, the well on the farm had run dry, and the town had to start using Amarillo's water supply. It tastes and smells like a chemical. I hate the see the Ogallala itself run dry, but I believe there are already efforts going on in this state to conserve it.
- 3 years ago
-
txpacotaco
-
-
JanforGore
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation:
Well, not if T.Boone Pickens has any say in it. He's been buying water rights up in Texas using imminent domain in order to run a pipeline through the Ogalalla acquifer to pipe it down to Corpus Christi to boittle it. And I suspect to use it for his natural gas plan. Always will be someone taking advantage of the situation to make a dollar, but the people are fighting it and I say good for them.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
txpacotaco
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation:
Good point. I didn't realize he had access to the acquifer, but I heard about him buying up water rights going back years and years. The feeling was that he would wait for droughts and sell the water to the highest bidder. Not a family favorite, is Mr. Pickens.
- 3 years ago
-
txpacotaco
-
-
txpacotaco
-
I wish I knew the answer. The problems are tied so firmly to the economic well-being of the residents of these areas that some of my ideas -- like creating building codes that require greywater irrigation and water cisterns, living roofs and native-only plant species with plenty of permeable area surrounding buildings -- might be too much money for cities in these circumstances to tolerate. Other ideas that cross my mind -- like tearing down deserted, foreclosed housing and replacing it with permeable native landscaping, along with regulations that restrict rebuilding on such sites -- would certainly hurt the economy. But they are feasible ideas, and if implemented at the smallest-possible community level might begin to make some positive change.
One thing I am intuitively opposed to, though I don't know the scientific impact of it, is rerouting water from any natural feature to feed a geographically dispersed population. I know, I know... but for our having done that for hundreds of years we wouldn't have modern agriculture, and I probably wouldn't live where I do... but if wishes were horses...
Or it could starting raining. A lot. That would at least give us a little more time.
- 3 years ago
-
txpacotaco
-
-
JanforGore
-
txpacotaco:
Well I tend to agree with you on being against such water diversions. The Aral Sea always comes to mind. As SeaJade mentioend above, tree planting is something we must do on a huge scale in this country to provide carbon sinks and to also bring water into areas that need it. And planting trees can be relatively inexpensive yet have multiple benefits for the land, the atmosphere, and the entire environment. But then with wildfires also more prolific in California, it is like a viscious cycle.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
JanforGore
-
And in the midst of this historic drought, Nestle still had a plan to pump 200 million gallons a year from two springs in McCloud, California, bottle it in plastic and sell it. Thankfully the California attorney general is cracking down on this blatant effort to take advantage of the situation.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
seanalyn
-
JanforGore:
Mmmm I love me the taste of some fresh spring water especially when its been marinating in cheap plastic on a grocery shelf for months.
The best tasting water Ive ever had was up in Kings Canyon where there was a spring that came right out of the grown with mountain spring water. It was so fresh and so amazing...Ive never tasted anything like it. Sad to think that that spring may not be flowing :(
- 3 years ago
-
seanalyn
-
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation
-
Facts from my book on water used in energy generation.
The Electric Power Research Institute (EPRI) in the United States reports that coal-fired plants use approximately 3,400 liters of cooling water per megawatt hour
Nuclear reactors’ need a water cooling supply of 3,776 liters of freshwater per megawatt hour.
natural gas–powered plants supply any relief, when they too need 2,730 liters per megawatt
hourAnd by the way everyone. To smelt just 1 tonne of aluminum consumes 1,716 toones of water!!!!!!!!!! Every single can (15 grams) has consumed ---just to smelt it ---25 3/4 litres of drinking water. Industry in the US and here subsidises this unsustainable water use by Industry.
Lots more in the book Guys.
We must stop the $700 billion paid out in subsidies annually!!!BAN THE CAN too whlie we are at it!!!!
- 3 years ago
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation
-
-
dcuisinot
-
Hey guys,
I know many of you feel strongly about this issue, which can lead to some heated discussions. Disagreement and debates are great, but let's please keep it focused on the topic and not the people discussing it. If you see a comment that you feel is a violation of community standards, please flag it rather than responding in kind.
Feel free to contact me if you have any questions!
Danielle
Online Community Team - 3 years ago
-
dcuisinot
-
-
JanforGore
-
100 Ways To Conserve Water
Every little bit helps when you are in a drought.
This is also why solar energy is the way to go. It uses no water in its production of energy. Unless of course you use concentrated solar energy instead of photovoltaic, but compared to nuclear and coal it is no where close to the volumes of water wasted for those sources.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
JanforGore
-
Considering the future of this area, any new homes and buildings under construction should definitely have rainwater catchement systems as part of the plans.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation
-
When I was in the US (Georgia & Florida) I was surprised that there was no rain water harvesting going on. Nobody seemed at all concerned as to the amount of water they were using. Here in Australia I live off the main water pipeline route. That means we have no water supplied as they do in the City and suburbs.
So when we built our home 30 years ago we had to put in tanks to capture and harvest the rain. It's the only supply we have. We haven't had one drop of water supplied to us from the main water lines in 30 years. We live in one of the driest places on the planet. We are self sufficient for water. We grow all our own vegetables - have over 1 acre of lush gardens and have 6 people living in the house. We have water storage of 50,000 gallons. Not a drop of rain that falls on the roof is lost.
We globally need to start thinking seriously about rain harvesting. Climate change will bring extreame weather variability - we won't know when and if the rains will come. We need to be ready to collect it when Mother Nature is good enough to supply it.
Get some tanks in everyone. There is always a sustainable alternative when you have no other choice.
Bob Williamson
- 3 years ago
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation
-
-
JanforGore
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation:
And that is the awakening many in this country need. Awareness of how much we use and waste in that use. You only truly begin to appreciate it when you don't have it.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
txpacotaco
-
GreenhouseNeutralFoundation:
I love that you've created a sustainable life and have stuck with it for 30 years. Truly inspiring.
Not sure if anybody's already mentioned it here, but in some places in the US, rainwater harvesting is actually illegal (Denver, Colorado, for instance). Pretty weird, eh? Guess it's all part of the growing pains our country is going through right now.
- 3 years ago
-
txpacotaco
-
-
SeaJade
-
Many many years ago, a group of people decided to build homes on a very fertile area of the state which they call Orange County. So they subdivided the land for houses, sold them, and moved the farms to the desert where they had to import top soil, water, and use chemical fertilizers, many of the farms morphed into large corporate agri/farms for the most part. Then, the descendants of "the group of people" decided to build golf courses in the middle of the desert too (not against golf mind you, its good to see people outside) which, in desert environments, require a lot of imported water and chemical fertilizers.
With that said, there are some great people holding the base in California for organic farming and sustainable living - supplying fantastic fresh food, sustainably grown (including minimum use of water), and local. We experience both sides of the coin here.
I was walking in Venice, Ca. the other day and came across a typical venice bungalow whose front yard is a demonstration of creating not only an edible landscape, but also optimum water conservation. I looked the company up on the web and they offer a fantastic service as well as teach urbanites how to convert their ground or balcony space into organic edible gardens and landscapes (something positive and useful) instead of green lawns consuming large amounts of water. They also have an organic seed exchange for locals (re: monsanto antidote)
www.heartbeetgardening.comJulia Russell opens her Eco-home in Los Feliz two Sundays a month. She can show you how to save a lot of water.
http://www.ecohome.org/pages/index.html"Eco-Home™ is an on-going living research center that demonstrates ecological living in an urban environment. The Eco-Home™is a restored and retrofitted California style bungalow, circa 1911 that shows us how simple but wise property improvements can make your home warm, friendly yet environmentally sound and healthy. This historic home incorporates solar hot water heating, photovoltaic panels, ultra low flow water systems and other energy and water conservation measures. This "pioneering" home has hosted over 15,000 guests since opening it's doors to the public in 1988."
Many of us, would if we could but don't quite have enough dosh at this timing, convert our water systems so we could re-use our used water for gardening (grey water), create catchment systems for rain water, and replant trees to help with our water flows as well. How useful would that cash flow given to Wall Street, Bankers and the industrial military complex to convert the masses into a sustainable living complex.
Tree people in Los Angeles do a great job of urban forestation and water conservation (Andy Lipkis is one of my heroes). as well as teaching and community outreach.
http://www.treepeople.org/Geoff Lawton, master teacher of permaculture demonstrates how to grow food in a desert environment.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sohI6vnWZmkAnd, the way we build our buildings will make a huge difference to how we use our resources.
For example, this competition from a few years ago, called Building A Sustainable World: Architects, designers, city planners, engineers respond to the call of creating off-grid communities and addressing climate change.
http://riba-usa.org/Competitions/index.htmThere are some great architects and designers who understand how to build with wisdom and can reverse the negative impact on our environment by the way they build.
I am a gardener and love the winter in Southern California because of the rain, and yes, it is getting dryer. We have our ups and downs or cycles, but so far, we are very short on rainfall this season, hoping for some more soon.
- 3 years ago
-
SeaJade
-
-
JanforGore
-
Farmers in California Feeling Effects of Drought
From the article:
Farmers served by the Rancho California Water District will pay more for water. It's just a question of when.
A program that allowed farmers to get cheaper water in exchange for agreeing to cutbacks in supplies in drier times could be phased out by 2013. That means farmers used to getting discounted water for crops will pay the same as the district's household and industrial customers.
That, combined with higher fuel and fertilizer costs and cheaper foreign goods, is the last thing local farmers need, said Ben Drake, a district board member who runs a farm management company.
"I may not be able to farm in the next eight to 10 years," said Drake, who has been in the Temecula Valley since the 1970s.
"None of my clients are spending any extra money on anything."
For years, many Rancho Water farmers received discounted water through the Metropolitan Water District's Interim Agricultural Water Program. Metropolitan wholesales water to Rancho, and its program gave farmers a lower rate in exchange for being first on the chopping block for supply cuts.
The program relies on surplus water; right now, there is none and Metropolitan doesn't expect to have a surplus in the next few years, said Rancho spokeswoman Meggan Reed.
About 1,700 customers take part in the program. About 48 percent of the water sold by Rancho Water goes to agriculture.
With a long-term drought and a court decision cutting supplies from the Sacramento River Delta, Metropolitan, which supplies 70 percent of the Rancho district's water, announced last year a 30 percent cut in water supplied to program participants.
Rancho Water had little choice but to pass along the cuts to farmers. To take the sting out of the cutbacks, district staff worked with farmers to find more ways to conserve water. Now, with the program gone by 2013, the district is giving farmers a chance to opt out now and pay the same rate as regular customers.
Program participants pay 65 cents per hundred cubic feet or 88 cents per hundred cubic feet, depending on where they are. With the program's demise, those customers would pay either 72 cents per hundred cubic feet or $1.88 per hundred cubic feet.
Those who opt out -- the deadline is Jan. 1 to opt out for next year -- will not be subject to the 30 percent cutback, although they face much higher charges if they exceed their water allowance.
Gene Bianchi, of De Luz, said he's not sure whether he'll opt out of the program.
Bianchi has about 1,100 avocado trees on his 12-acre parcel. He says he is spending about $11,000 to $12,000 annually on water.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
JanforGore
-
Background on Climate Change and Sierra Water
Climate Change is impacting the Sierra now and future impacts could be catastrophic. The Sierra Nevada supplies 65% of California’s developed water, as well as almost all the water to Northwestern Nevada. California and Northwestern Nevada have organized a vast water delivery system for agriculture and urban residents that is highly dependent on the Sierra and particularly on the Sierra snow pack. There are two major water delivery systems in California —the Central Valley Project and the State Water Project. Thirteen Sierra watersheds supply the Central Valley Water Project, while the State Water Project is highly dependent on the Sierra's Feather and Kern River watersheds. In addition, many local water projects supply other parts of the California, such as the Tuolumne River supplying San Francisco, the Truckee River supplying Reno and the Mokelumne River supplying the East Bay.
Climate change will significantly change the way California and Nevada's water supply systems are operated because the largest reservoirs of water in both states are the Sierra snow pack, which feeds all of the watersheds mentioned above.
Leading scientists agree that a rise in temperature will occur even under the best emission reduction scenarios. This warmer temperature will result in a 36% reduction of Sierra snow in fifty years and nearly half of its current amount by 2090. Looked at another way, the State of California predicts that there will be a 1500-foot rise in the snow level over the next 90 years.
Snow stores water over the winter and then melts and flows down from April through July to refill storage reservoirs. There is further evidence that the raising of the snow level will increase the incidence of “rain on snow” events at critical mid-elevation Sierra forests, increasing the peak flows and flooding associated with storms in the winter when we have no excess storage capacity. Furthermore, the increase in winter peak flows combined with the compounding effects of the planned clear-cutting in the region will make it difficult to gauge the timing of water releases from reservoirs.
Climate Change Impacts are Already Seen
The fact is these climate change impacts are already underway. Over the past 100 years, there has been a 25% reduction in runoff from April – July in the Central Sierra-Sacramento Region and a 10% reduction in runoff in the Southern Sierra.
For more information, read our report Troubled Waters of the Sierra: California and Nevada’s Threatened Water Supply
How we Adapt to Climate Change Can Protect or Further Destroy the Sierra
A quick reaction by some members of the public when they hear this news is to call for more dams to create surface storage reservoirs. Dams come at a high price — both economically and environmentally. Dams block fish passage, reduce water flow increasing water temperatures below the dam which impact fish reproduction and survival, and dramatically alter the natural ecosystem of the river and riparian communities. Ninety percent of the original salmon in the Sierra are gone because of a curtain of Sierra dams.
In fact, Sierra watersheds have already been significantly impaired and polluted over the last century and a half from a range of human activities. In 1996, the Sierra Nevada Ecosystem Project identified that the river, lake and stream systems of the Sierra are the most impaired habitats of the range. One-hundred fifty years of dams and diversions, mining, grazing, roads, pipelines, timber harvesting, and recreational activities among other human activities have damaged our Sierra waterways. The Sierra cannot afford solutions to climate change which further damage our natural resources.
-There are also some good links at this site on conservation and other projects.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
aswift1
-
JanforGore:
I have been to that exact spot before and climbed on those boulders. I was about ten years old then, and it was late spring... and there was still about double that amount of snow on the ground. That's just sad.
- 3 years ago
-
aswift1
-
-
ras_menelik
-
I just got back from Tenn./Mississippi area they've had non stop rain since thanks giving (that's what helped TVA create our latest Superfund site)
the seasons are shifting
winter is in spring
summer in the falland yet fossil addicts still want more proof !!!
- 3 years ago
-
ras_menelik
-
-
alicynx
-
Its amazing how economic hardships and dustbowls go hand in hand...
- 3 years ago
-
alicynx
-
-
simplecj
-
I have lived in Southern Utah for about 7 years now and we've seen many years with only half normal snowpack. With rapidly growing communities (well it was growing fast) and a dwindling water supply the state is now considering a multi billion dollar pipeline project to pipe water over from Lake Powell, which is already under huge strain from the drought reaching nearly 90 ft below the high mark.
Personally I think the answer is to slow developement and work on some innovative water conservation policies, like paying people to re-landscape homes with native plants and little to no real grass. It doesn't look pretty, but it does save alot of water and looks nice enough. They also need to get contractors to adopt water conservation landscaping when developing new lots.
As it is right now, if we don't hit about a decade of wet weather, we will be sucking the bottom of our aquifers dry possibly by 2016. That's a pretty bleak forcast, and with little alternatives and water "wars" going on I don't know how soon a remedy will be agreed on.
Las Vegas recently got the rights to a large aquifer north of Vegas and west from where I live, a few valleys over. There are people who say that this already dry land will completely dry up, possibly killing off any and all plant life that has managed to survive on the small amount of moisture available now. If the plants all die out, we will see "dust bowl" conditions with vast amounts of topsoil being stripped from the land and carried east. Most likely if this happens it will leave in it's place a large desert complete with sand dunes... oh and that aquifer they're tapping, considering the size and thirst of Vegas, they'll be lucky to make it last 15 years... then what?
FYI: I've attended several presentations by the water masters of this end of the state as well as opponents to the pipeline project. They came to my university as part of our engineering seminar class. Very interesting, yet very depressing. It makes me want to move somewhere greener before they start hitting us with outrageous water taxes and restrictions. Oregon and/or Washington is looking pretty nice right about now....
- 3 years ago
-
simplecj
-
-
aswift1
-
simplecj:
It can be very pretty if you want it to be...
- 3 years ago
-
aswift1
-
-
JanforGore
-
simplecj:
Thanks for this great answer. You give a very good picture of what is now happening in this area of the country. It is truly sad how so many living in this country don't even know what is going on regarding our rivers and water resources. I think your ideas are good ones and again, it has to start with us. I suspect there are going to be some really hard decisions ahead regarding water conservation in this area.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
alicynx
-
simplecj:
No! Oregon is a horrible place, full of trolls, high cost of living, and people who'll hate you!!! You never, ever wanna move there!!!
(I have to do my part as an Oregonian to make it look awful to the outside world, otherwise EVERYone will wanna move here! ^_^) - 3 years ago
-
alicynx
-
-
JanforGore
-
simplecj:
I love Oregon too and would move there if i could.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
simplecj
-
simplecj:
I understand the resistance to more people moving into your wonderful state. Of course only half or less of your state is actually nice and green, the east half is pretty dry, much like Utah. I love the coast, I love being able to grow "stuff" without much efforts. Also, I see Oregon and Washington as very progressive in their view towards cannabis, another bonus for me. ;)
BTW... "stuff" means anything really, garden vegetables, trees, grass... I love green landscaping with cool plants. Do you have any idea how hard it is just to keep a lawn and some flowers from drying out on a hot Utah summer??
- 3 years ago
-
simplecj
-
-
csmonut
-
simplecj:
I work in Las Vegas, NV. Southern Nevada Water Authority is building a billion dollar + pipeline to north-eastern Nevada to supply Las Vegas and its casinos.
They are in fact going to steal the water from the ranchers and farmers that supply food.
SNWA is stealing (my term for it) the precious water source that keeps those valleys, people, wildlife and vegetation sustained.
Just goes to show, money wins.
And Harry Reid supports this And the two new coal fired power plants slated for Southern Nevada.
And I understand Utah is pissed because they're downwind of these things. - 3 years ago
-
csmonut
-
-
simplecj
-
simplecj:
I know... Mesquite is currently in a water war as well. Places located in desolate dessert areas need to work really hard at conserving water or cap their development based on projected water supplies. Vegas has gotten way too large considering it's location.
- 3 years ago
-
simplecj
-
-
JanforGore
-
I agree, and also planting crops that are less water intensive. It is better than simply deserting your land.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
aswift1
-
This month's Sunset Magazine has a cool article about tearing out your lawn and landscaping with low-water plants. I think it is a great idea, plus it is cost effective and ends up looking nicer than a big patch of grass... People also need to be required to water their lawns at night so the water does not evaporate right off the blades of grass as the sun beats down... It's not smart.
Also observe the rule: If it's yellow, let it mellow. If it's brown, flush it down!
- 3 years ago
-
aswift1
-
-
csmonut
-
aswift1:
In southern Nevada, peopel get paid to remove lawns and plant cactus.
HOAs have no say in that matter. - 3 years ago
-
csmonut
-
-
GraveLehr
-
Climate Change?
Oh, you mean that natural thing that's due to the Sun.
There is only one logical course of action... Kill the Sun, save the planet.
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
JanforGore
-
GraveLehr:
No , it's kill the flatearth rhetoric, save the planet.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
GraveLehr
-
GraveLehr:
And explain to me what happens when/if your wrong?
I'd hate for the Greenies to ruin the planet with preemptive action before they understand what's happening.
In the 70's when they thought the Earth was cooling, that crowd dusted Soot over a few Ice Shelf's to melt it quicker and heat the Earth. I think we know how well that turned out.
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
onechance
-
GraveLehr:
GraveLehr:
Seriously?
You know that the "green movement" is about living cleaner, healtheir, more sustainable lifestyles right?Do you think it's about soemthing else?
If so, where do you get your information? Fox?Come on. Seriously.
- 3 years ago
-
onechance
-
-
aswift1
-
GraveLehr:
Relax, guys- you can't enlighten a mind that refuses to open...
- 3 years ago
-
aswift1
-
-
GraveLehr
-
GraveLehr:
This is why kids shouldn't be allowed on the Internet.
"OH MY GOD HE'S CHALLENGING MY IDEALS! HE MUST BE A BIG BAD CONSERVATIVE"
Simple research will show you anything you want to know.
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
GraveLehr
-
GraveLehr:
Thank you for proving my point Onechance.
I don't agree with you, I'd rather take a purely scientific stance and wait for more evidence.
Yet taking the logical stance is evidently frowned upon.
Poor kid, you'll grow up one day.
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
lookatmypix
-
GraveLehr:
Gravelehr this is in your profile:" I'm just a regular guy. Who just happens to know more about everything than you"
This explains the arrogance and shows how much narrow minded you are.
Do you really think going green is a trend?
Do you realize how much destruction we are bringing in this world, how much nature is disappearing before our eyes? - 3 years ago
-
lookatmypix
-
-
aswift1
-
GraveLehr:
Clearly he does not know. Or care. Let it go... You can't tell people like him anything, they already know everything, remember?
- 3 years ago
-
aswift1
-
-
GraveLehr
-
GraveLehr:
Oh do go on.
You must be confused, I'm talking about "Goreinites"
It should of been readily apparent from my posts, but you know how kids are these days. Refusing to read between the lines.
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
JanforGore
-
GraveLehr:
The evidence is here. If you don't have a closed mind you will read it. And this thread isn't for continuing the same old arguing regarding climate change. If you have nothing of substance to state about the reality of the water crisis in California why are you in here?
You claim you are "waiting" for more evidence in your "scientific stance" and yet didn't hesitate in spewing the debunked "sunspot theory" in lieu of totally ignoring the scientific evidence to the contrary. No wonder others will think you less than genuine in your words. And since Fox is the main pusher of that nonsense it isn't any wonder people will think that is your source. The drought in California and in much of this world is VERY REAL however, and one main component of it is climate change. Simple research will show you anything you want to know.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
GraveLehr
-
GraveLehr:
Aswift, how wrong you are. I do care.
I happen to head up the restoration of a park in my town. I however do not believe in Man-Made Climate Change.
Which should be readily apparent from my posts.
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
GraveLehr
-
GraveLehr:
JanforGore... If it's so debunked then you should easily be able to show it.
Yet considering it's still a valid theory.
:)
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
JanforGore
-
GraveLehr:
i didn't use the words MAN MADE in my post. I simply stated climate change. Now why don't you stop trying to hijack this thread.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
JanforGore
-
GraveLehr:
Start another thread on it and I'll do so. Keep going on about it in here and get reported for being off topic. Your choice.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
GraveLehr
-
GraveLehr:
JanforGore.. Report me then. The record shows that I was responding to personal attacks.
Is this the standard rhetoric here? "They don't believe what I believe, KILL IT WITH FIRE!"
Censorship, how... Republican of you.
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
JanforGore
-
GraveLehr:
Sigh, it is obvious you are here to cause disention. Your posts suggest you are just a bit put out that Al Gore won't debate your sorry position on this publicly, so you wanted to get a rise out of the 'Gore supporter.' How Republican of you. Moving on.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
lookatmypix
-
GraveLehr:
Gravelehr your communication skills are very poor, your theory has yet to be communicated, you are clearly here only to insult people and provoking arguments that only make us lose focus on the real issue. Your arrogance and immaturity is shameful.
- 3 years ago
-
lookatmypix
-
-
GraveLehr
-
GraveLehr:
Excuse me?
There's a Gore Supporter in here?
Funny, it appears you're here to cause dissension. I was perfectly content with posting and moving on with my life.. Yet you just keep having to respond.
Evidently, it's all about attacking the guy with a difference of opinion.
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
GraveLehr
-
GraveLehr:
LookatmyPix.
I'm rather confused, how am I making you lose sight of the issue? You can easily overlook my posts. I'm not posting anything offensive, nor am I insulting anybody.
So far I've been called: "Douchebag, Closed-Minded, Arrogant, Idiot, Asshole, Troll"
I hardly see where I'm the one being offensive.
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
krush_productions
-
-
GraveLehr:
Here Grave, I found a bunch of buddies for you who feel the same way about humans involvement concerning climate change.
follow the link
- 3 years ago
-
krush_productions
-
-
lookatmypix
-
GraveLehr:
Your arrogance is the attempt you make to offend somebody's point of view.
Your words "This is why kids shouldn't be allowed on the Internet."
"Poor kid, you'll grow up one day"
You did not need to insult just because we are "greenies" and differ from your opinion.
Does this open your eyes a bit?
I will also end my communication with you as it is not getting us a step closer to a debate about California facing historic drought. - 3 years ago
-
lookatmypix
-
-
GraveLehr
-
GraveLehr:
Lookatmypix. You're just pissed off that you can't provide evidence to show that this drought is due to Mankind.
Please refrain from speaking until you can provide proof.
- 3 years ago
-
GraveLehr
-
-
JanforGore
-
Is it morally possible at this point for people on the whole to see the true urgency of this water crisis on a worldwide basis? Or are we too set in our ways on the whole to want to change? I tend to believe only a true catastrophe will change people, and not even then. Look at Hurricane Katrina. I would hope to be proven wrong, but as I read these articles showing how much worse this is all getting as people move into this area to build golf courses in the desert, I truly begin to wonder if humans simply have the capacity anymore to connect the dots.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
-
-
onechance
-
Everyone should be required to use their sink water for their toilet and do everything as naturally as possible. No more waste, recycle, etc.
- 3 years ago
-
onechance
-
-
steevdanger
-
onechance:
coming from the bay area, i am witness to this drought, and it looks grim. reservoirs are incredibly low, due to a very dry winter, strange extremes in temperature, and mass waste of water. why does everyone need a lawn?
- 3 years ago
-
steevdanger
-
-
JanforGore
-
-
California Drought.
- 3 years ago
-
JanforGore
