Air Force Sued for Religious Intolerance

I have never thought it was appropriate to say a mass prayer in a formation or before a deployment. Sadly it seems that religion is a big part in the armed forces, but when he claims that you are promoted by who you go to church with is a little outlandish. Promotions in the Air Force are given after you accrue enough time and pass a series of tests.

Also those calling this a frivolous lawsuit.... he isn't asking for money, just a policy change which is perfectly acceptable.

I hate prayers at all ceremonies that we have in the Navy. They always assume everyone is christian.

v1ktor

Lets not confuse, the state controlling religion, and religion controlling the state. These are two very different concepts.

I would argue that every historic occurance when religion seemed to run amuck, that there was some political hand that was pulling the strings behind the scenes.

The Separation of Church and State is not in the Constitution. What the Constitution says is that the State can not make a State Religion, a religion controlled by the State, nor can they stop you from practicing your religion. There is a seperation of State and Church not Church and State. True christian principals can apply any where, ( "Love your nieghbor as your self", "Do unto others as you would have them do to you." sorry for the King James version but it gets the point across.)

The main problem with Christianity today, is there are to many people CALLING themselves christian, and not enough of them living a Christ-like life.

The two guys that said the stupid things they said to the jewish men, don't sound like they are living the christian life they claim to be living. Which makes me questoin if they are real christians.

jubal, good points. I think you hit the nail on the head.

I don't think that the people who are critical of the behavior of these cadets are Christian haters. They are lovers of freedom and lovers of autonomy.

Why are Christians so caught up in waging war against unbelievers, when supposedly according to the bible Jesus already died for everybody's sins and Satan has already been vanquished.

Jesus said that he did not come to judge the world he came to save it. He also said that his Heavenly Father did not judge any man. So all you Christians who are practicing harassment and coercion of non-believers need to pay heed to Jesus own words..."Love your enemy. Pray for those who curse you, Turn the other cheek."

You can't get both evil and good from God. God doesn't kill anyone, he is a creator. Satan is the one who is deceiving Christians into believing that they need to wage war in the name of God. Those who want to do so are no different than the Muslims who believe in the same thing.

Conniepae, great comments.

Religion is not wrong. Distorted religion (spin), just like distorted facts (spin) is wrong. We don't need to eliminate religion, we need to stop letting them distort (spin) religion. We shouldn't eliminate 'facts' because they have been spun into distorted 'facts'. We need to stop the distortion (spin) of facts and religion.

Many of us find comfort in our beliefs. I feel sadness when they distort (spin) faith. Adding religion to politics has distorted (spun) the issue of faith. Faith and politics are different. I don't want to see politicians spinning religion for political gain.

Religion is wrong, as it wants you to accept that you do not understand everything.
Its rly disturbing, that on the one hand, ppl are always like ' Look, hes german, he must be a bad nazi'(at least thats what the exchange students make me believe), but even DISCUSS it, if they have nazis in powerful positions, as discussion normally means that there are multiple PLAUSABLE sides.
Thats just wrong.

so im not religious what-so-ever and i gotta say, its a non issue for me, it makes life a little simpler, i pretty much consider religion these days as drama filled groups, for people that take religion seriously and don't make it a huge drama fiasco good for you.

gods_green_soldier, you are correct to ask, "Why are we so afraid?" I ask the same question. Why are you afraid if you don't convert everyone, it's a problem. God wrote the Bible, which guides us in our everyday life. But our ‘Constitution’ and legal system guide our Country. We as Americans all have an ‘inalienable right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness’.

Christians follow the Bible. America follows the ‘Rule of Law’. I am a Christian, but people of other faiths do not scare me. I am not afraid of others beliefs. If they break ‘our laws’ prosecute them. My faith does not lie in the hands of man, but my freedom does.

The main thing to realize is it shouldn't be about religion, and 9x out of 10 many people focus on religion instead of focusing on the main prize, which is Jesus Christ, as far as I'm concerned we lived in a world that was based upon the foundation of the knowledge that God had created the world and that intellegent design does exist, however that's not what the atheists and aclu, the media and all the other worldly organizations would have you believe. We as true christians should get up and stop laying down and acting like we don't have a say in this battle, God said If I be for you who can be against you. Why are we so afraid? Are we scared of persecution in this country like in other countries, we claim to be a 98% at least populated country, but all I see that is taking place is worldly issues, we've truly forgotten where we came from and whose we are...

Bottom line: Are there rules, which govern such actions? The 'Rule of Law' over rules public opinion. If there are laws making such actions unacceptable, then changes have to be made.

What's sad is, they needed to file a lawsuit. Many in America are Christians and follow Christian teachings, but our beliefs should not be forced on others. You lead by example! No branch of American government should force religion onto our citizens. We are free to choose our religions or lack there of. IT’S THE LAW! WE ARE FREE!

This IS the 1st Amendment.

Arrogance: purposely defying a pledge to uphold the Constitution.

Expressing an opinion IS the 1st Amendment. All are welcome (except, of course, non-believers in religion or God).

How have atheists persecuted “believers”?

Persecuting people because they don’t believe is very different than expressing an opinion.

Funny how people can’t distingue between the two when their beliefs are being criticized, NOT persecuted.

When is religion just going to get fazed out? We already know the truth!

"Unfortunately, our own colonial history also provided ample reasons for people to be afraid to vest too much power in the national government. There had been bills of attainder here; women had been convicted and sentenced to death as "witches"; Quakers, Baptists, and various Protestant sects had been persecuted from time to time. Roger Williams left Massachusetts to breathe the free air of new Rhode Island. Catholics were barred from holding office in many places. Test oaths were required in some of the colonies to bar any but "Christians" from holding office. In New England Quakers suffered death for their faith. Baptists were sent to jail in Virginia for preaching, which caused Madison, while a very young man, to deplore what he called that 'diabolical hell-conceived principle of persecution.' "
Justice Hugo Black 1960

This is the problem with this country and what's going to distract us from real problems until our fall. Yeah, we'll cry about religious intolerance on behalf of those who follow one that isn't Christianity or for the atheist.

Yet you'll turn around and be intolerant towards a Christian and see nothing wrong with it. Many of you people need to see your doing what you claim they're doing. I'm not a "high and mightily moral" atheist (i'm agnostic) but i'm not half as blind as you atheist tend to be. You're not atheist because you don't believe in God. You're atheist because you hate Christians. Much like racists hate other races. You're hate is so deeply embedded in yourselves that you can't even see it anymore.

Being a soldier myself I think the suit is just. When you swear the to the oath upon entering the Military, you do so to "Support and Defend the Constitution of The United States of America". Freedom of Religion, should be protected at all costs, and people should not impose their religion on others. Yes there are Chaplains in all units, but those who discriminate against others while wearing the uniform should be punished for not upholding their oath.

the short story : the Air Force is "above all" .

^ "They aren't suppose to be annoying or scary, are they?" ~ ipodrulz

Employing scare tactics and raising the level of fear is an important part of indoctrination: Religion 101.

I understand that christianity is about spreading the word, but I always thought it was by choice. They aren't suppose to be annoying or scary, are they?

"Arrogant superiority has ALWAYS been a part of Christianity. "

The Air Force needs to take aggressive action to put a stop to this sort of discrimination immediatly, including dismissing those responsible. This is unquestionably "conduct unbecoming of an officer"!

Heretics were hunted, tortured and burned during the Dark Ages. Christians have been doing this type of “bullying” for 1,500 years.

Arrogant superiority has ALWAYS been a part of Christianity. Just think if Scientologists were allowed to hunt, torture and kill those that they deemed heretics? Where would they end up on the religious totem pole?

Sue the shit out the bastards! People came to this country to ESCAPE religious persecution.

I just wish there were a better way to make it more egalitarian, to allow freedom of expression for the majority while still representing the rights of the minority. I think the problem here is that there is such a majority in the school that they take it for granted, I think they need better education and introduction to other cultures, after all in the air force they will enter into theatres of combat where the population holds diferent religous and cultural views than they do. I think more than anything the people in this academy should feel they are Americans and Civil Servants before anything else. They swear to uphold the constitution, and that constitution is the basis for the seperation of church and state.

claiming christianity but not following it, that goes to say that these cadets are stupid, christians do not mock and or impose bad behavior towards other people just because you are of different religion

to diode
i watched the report on tv this morning, and Weinstein said that in the air force you are promoted by who you go to church with. The average person wouldn't like it if this happen at their work place, why should it be any different for him? i think it's really hypocritical for the air force to be "fighting for what we stand for" when they're doing such things.

religious persecution of any kind is wrong, all people should have the right to practice whatever they believe in.

the purpose of having the military endorse christianity is so that when any "war" is so f-ed up that political agendas reveal their absurdity , the military can invoke some greater cause to keep soldiers brainwashed enough to allow themselves to be sent into the meat-grinder - "dulce et decorum est pro patria mori " - "secularism" is a threat to national security - having institutionalized christianity is no different from the kind of indoctrination which the nazis used in ww2 to manipulate the german armed forces .

"Grow up and get over" being persecuted for their religious beliefs (or lack thereof)? I'm tired of frivolous lawsuits as much as the next guy but what is unjust about what they (Cadets, watchdog groups and a former chaplain at the academy) are standing up for?

i don't care either way i think these people complaining are worthless and need to grow up and get over it. i'm tired of the lawsuit happy america, its pathetic

Does religion do anything but piss people off anymore??

It always has been, always will be about control via scaring people.

I think we should keep praying that one day people will be able to think for themselves, thus making religion pretty much redundant.

About time people grow up and stop putting they're lives on a book.