Praying in school? What happened to studying in school?

amen...

couldn't agree with you more...I believe faith makes a person well-rounded, but school is not the place to dwell on it...

amen

not to sound repetitive, but I'll add another amen to that!

Way to go Mirimy! That is absolutly right! I look up to as a role model who has their had screwed on tight! Thank you!

agreed

you are beautiful, and I agree a 100%

18 out of 24? i can tell this young lady is a glass empty type person. at least the mediocre-prussian academic curriculum that our school systems are modelled after is not 24 out of 24;and that's something to celebrate in itself. not to mention were spreading the love and acceptance of Jesus Christ to our schoolaged children and giving them the opportunity to show their loving affection for the son of God. sure, you can say millions over the past 4000 years have been tortured, fined, imprisoned, estranged, and murdered for deviating from the Christian/old testament teachings...but when this writer goes to sleep everynight, he has the peace of mind knowing that he's not going to hell.

Forallthatisholy,

The term is "Glass HALF empty" or was the mistype on purpose? You're proud that 70% of these countries have a more effective educational system? You can go to church and sunday school and whatever else on sundays and learn about God, Jesus, Allah, Buddha, Flying Spaghetti Monster or whoever, then go to school monday thru friday and learn about US/World History, Math, Science and so on and still go to sleep every night with the peace of mind knowing that you're not going to hell.

forallthatisholy, you scare me, really... you scare the shit out of me. your the kind of person that doesn't really like to think about the implications of what you say, aren't you? ok here is an idea, if you want to pray to the flying spaghetti monster or what not, do it before class, at break, or after school. It is not as though people patrol the school making sure kids are not praying... if you feel so inclined to pray no one is stopping you. that being the case what you must be asking for is a scheduled time in class for kids to be able to pray. from this i can differ that you are either too stupid or too lazy to pray without assistance. are you actually saying that religious people are too lazy to pray on their own time and only do it if people tell them it is praying time. i really don't think that this is the image of religious people you want to support.

one other thing you might want to avoid in the future, don't tell people they are gonna go to hell. it doesn't reflect on you well (there are 2 reasons for this). the first is, it makes you look like a total tool and i know you think your some kind of holy warrior in your head, but really you just sound dumb to the non-religious people. play more D&D if you need to get the holy warrior out of you. the second reason is not one of opinion. Hell, according to the heads of the catholics, protestants, Jehovah's witness', Lutherans, and even the batshit-crazy Mormons, does not exist. so when you say it, i worry, because that means i know more about your faith than you do. sure, you might say, i may only know more about your faith in one area, but this is the area of your faith that you decided to bring up. the real unfortunate part about you claiming the existence of hell is that it also builds this image of a lazy religious person. are you to lazy to read up on your own religion too? i mean, i think you are putting the chicken before the egg here. i think you should learn about your faith first, then you can worry about the praying.
here is the bottom line, you are not thinking at all about the implications of what you are saying. because what i can differ from what you are saying is that, religious people are lazy, and i know more about your religion than you, and i have never gone to any kind of church. so here is my suggestion, less praying, more studying your religion...

sad.... just sad...

my 2 favorite authors: the most prominent figure in the old testament:moses, and the predominant writer in the new testament:paul were both murderers.

to say that you know more about christianity than i do is laughable.

to call me stupid and fool is laughable too.

the afortmentioned post was completely a joke, thanks for writing me a 3rd grade story informing me of what i do and don't know when it comes to religion.

the closer we come to forced prayer in school, the closer we come to indoctrination, burning of the books, and the 4th reich. hurray!!!

Prayer hasn't been in schools for decades. This statistic unless I am misinterpreting what was said, has weekend your point because obviously something is wrong in our education system, prayer hasn't been there. Maybe its lack of is the problem.

Education is not just learning, I think it is time we stop considering it as such. It should be a holistic approach to effectively mature and advance society.

Prayer invokes a person's motivation and higher calling. It provides enthusiasm. Tell me this, when was the last time you learned anything without some form of motivation. Maybe we need children to be more motivated in schools since most children and youth don't want to be there in the first place. Doesn't it make sense that if nobody wants to be there then it's not going to be that effective?

r,sfc

I agree w/ the last post by Richardn,

prayer hasn't been a part of our society, school and family for decades ....could this be why so many juveniles are in so much trouble???

Maybe a moral compass isn't such a bad thing?

I agree. Who cares if a student of Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, Hindu, Taoist, or other religious beliefs wants to pray in school on their own time. If a student wants to pray to themselves before eating their lunch or quietly before a difficult test, all the power to them. What we NEED to really be focusing on is how terrible our education system is. You might even say its broken completely. Thank you, President Bush, for yet again using the Federal government where it doesn't belong and further damaging an essential institution of society. Arguably, the MOST essential. Schools need to be accountable to PARENTS, not the Federal government. We need to stop spending billions of dollars on illegal wars and bring that money back home. Invest in our own social institutions, increase teacher pay, and make sure our young ones are getting a thorough, healthy, and challenging education.

ur perty

i like this - very interesting!

So how are kids supposed to pray in school? If a Catholic leads the prayer, will all the evangelicals wig out? What about a Mormon?
Kids can legally pray in school, it's just illegal to make them do it. Or put them in a position were they feel pressured to do it.
Perhaps the Evangelicals that push this kind of stuff should start taking responsibility for teaching there own children values and beliefs.
I'm a high school teacher and a Catholic, and for the life of me I've never felt it was anyones responsibility but my own and my churches when it came time to teach my children about faith.
I whole heartedly agree that the primary purpose of a school is to educate, and becoming number one in the world when it comes to educating our children should be what we aspire to.
We are also a nation that values "Freedom of Religion", at least we used to be.

Short, sweet, to the point...i like it.

Oh now you've done it, entered facts into the equation. Way to go, now the christians will start talking gibberish about faith, morals, and how the public school system is the work of the devil!

You make an excellent point; our focus needs to be on reality based things not faith based. We are such a privileged society, why ruin it with religion in school?

oh look you can read a paper offscreen! amazing! focus on the issue next time. it wouldnt make any sense for me to say in the abortion viewpoint that the real issue isnt abortion, its the death penalty, well that wouldnt make much sense would it

because, for the christian right, this is a big issue... you may not think it's a big issue, but for a lot of people it is...

and another thing... sure, we're all here to study. but, for a lot of people, prayer is an EXTREMELY important part of our lives... we pray about anything and everything, anywhere we choose. i pray in school that god will protect me, give me wisdom, and guide me through my day, week, or semester. prayer is powerful. you can't take that away from us, even in school.

I agree with you wholeheartedly. this is not what we should be worried about...but SINCE we are...unless it's a religiously affiliated school---I go to a Christian school---there should never be any kind of religion brought into the classroom.

Couldn't have said it better myself!

i had to listen to this again .. computer didn't like it as it gummed up ..
but worth listening to.
Well i would venture another question .. for those that are lacking interesting things to ponder
What is the purpose of education?
and i'll take my sorry butt back to work

May George Bush bless you and keep and cause his face to shine upon you and give you peace. Amen and Amen and Shondala Hondala Fondala Rhondala

Remember, Christians, that Democrats are not Christians OR Patriots and deserve to be exiled from this country along with other non-believers like homosexuals, blacks, Mormons, Eskimos, liberals or illegal aliens unless, of course, they work for your Republican-owned restaurant, farm or business.

Juheesus expects us to tithe and in so doing, fund the death of at least one Muslim per day. Please bow your heads as we all observe moment of silence to glorify Pat Robertson's idea of helping to spread Christianity's superior loooove and WEAPONRY by assassinating Hugo Chavez.

Amen, brothers and sisters!

I'm thinking God made Muslims and stuck their little babies in countries with 200-year-old theistic societies with no hope of education so he could what? Damn them?

LMMFAO!

Maybe all the pseudo-Christians could all choose up sides and be on two huge football teams and then they could all kneel down on one knee in the end zone before the game and pray for God to let them win. Now whaddayathink God would say to that?

It's okay for students to pray in school if that's what they believe in, but it's not okay for a school to force prayer on non-believing students. I think it's a pretty easy compromise to follow. If people weren't so hellbent on furthering their "cause" and more focused on the actual betterment of society, people who disagree could actually work together towards a common goal. Compromise people.

Finally! Someone with a blunt, realistic point of view. Let's stop worrying and stressing about pointless issues in the school system and focus our time and energy on making the school a better educational environment. I couldn't agree with you more!

good way to make the point. you are 100% right... and I'm not just saying that because you are also 100% HOT

I honestly think people should just get over this issue. This country was based on religion and will (hopefully) remain on it. In this country, we celebrate God. I'm not saying I'm a strict christian, but the one thing I strongly believe in is prayer. I had the worst final of my life today, math, and I prayed for God to help me remember all of the knowledge that I had attained so i could do well. Even though that prayer is completly selfish and I should have prayed for my grandparents to be comforted because my great grandmother died today, I felt so much better and much more relaxed because of what I did in school, in public, in front of my friends. If my teacher had given me a detention (or whatever) because I did that, I would break down and cry. I don't go to church and I don't even really agree with my religion. But if anyone takes prayer, or the ability to pray, out of school I believe that America is doomed for "outer darkness" as my religion calls it. America is God's country, home of the free, and if we give him up, he will give us up. It is agreeable that we do need to focus more on our education systems because, let's face it, people aren't as bright as they used to be and the people with "great minds" are only that way because no one else cares to be. So I'm all for working on our education, but all I ask for is that we keep the prayer and God in our lives (or whoever it is that you worship) because it does make our lives easier.

idratherbealone, you're missing the point. That's fine for you to pray in school because that's what you believe in. A lot of people are not going to get over this issue because maybe prayer is not a part of they're religion or they do not have one. That does not mean they should be forced to pray. The issue arises when schools try to make it a collective thing. When individuals pray, ok fine...do your thing. When it has to be a group effort including the atheist kid...there's a problem. Schools and other people need to be respectful of other peoples beliefs and decisions to believe or not believe in something or something else...bottom line.

Lowflyingjets,

No one is telling you that you cannot pray in school. Perhaps reflecting on Matthew 6: v 5-8 will refresh your memory of what Jesus once said said about public prayer. Matthew 6:5-8 (New International Version) New International Version (NIV) Copyright © 1973, 1978, 1984 by International Bible Society Prayer 5"And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. 6But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. 7And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. 8Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him. Right now, we have a Presidential candidate who just said we need to change the Constitution to make it reflect what the Bible says. Since he is a Baptist, I wonder if he intends to find some common ground with Catholics and Mormons whose teachings differ with those of the Baptist denomination. Would you be comfortable using the Catholic Bible? Probably not. Your inflexibility in demanding publiclly-led school prayer would probably extend to the selection of some Bibles used by other Christian disciplines and I doubt seriously that you would support verses from the Catholic Bible and its full complement of books that are not present in your "Christian Bible": The differences include the books of Tobias, Judith, Baruch, Ecclesiasticus, Wisdom, First and Second Maccabees; also certain additions to Esther and Daniel. Perhaps we should re-institute dunking schools and submerge propnents of both "Bibles" until the false worshippers of whichever version was incorrect were drowned by God as he thusly "selected" the righteous for choosing their particular "correct" translation of the Bible. Maybe we ought to throw in a few Mormons, Christian Scientists, Seventh Day Adventists and a couple of those congregations in Appalachia that use rattlesnakes to "test" the faith of those in their denomination. The trouble with the incessant pushing by the radical evangelical fundamentalists (hereinafter called "Fundies") is that it is always seems to be "their way or the highway". Take a chill pill. No one is saying you can't pray as long as you don't interfere with rights of others when you do so. Prayer in schools is NOT illegal but school-sponsored and directed prayer is. You have your rights. Now let others have theirs or be ready to allow Muslim prayer rugs, Catholic Bibles and many other trappings of religious beliefs in all faiths to have their school-sponsored times too. May George Bush bless you and keep you and may he cause his face to shine upon you and give you peace. Amen and Amen and Shondala Hondala Fondala Rhondala

I never said anything about forcing people to pray. I just would appreciate it if people didn't take the allowance for us to pray out of schools and make it "illegal". I was just expressing my personal view which isn't everyone's and I'm fine with that.

i wholly agree with zombies_loves_brains and Idratherbealone. these "whatever you do, don't pray!" advocates should be more offended with the guy sitting next to 'em picking his boogers and sliming 'em under their desktops. this "because you're praying, you're forcing religion on me" self-centered sense of entitlement sickens me (as regards how far we may go to pick up any offense). it's freedom of religion people, not freedom from religion...get over the oversensitivity I say, exercise some polite respect if you'd so demand it yourselves. some alarmists on this issue remind me of that David J. Pfahler who's been so presumptuous as to cursingly put his hands on an 8-year old boy, for no more than taking his (Pfahler's own) risks on the slopes like everyone else. More people than I are also at least tempted to "physically" adjust the likes of the David J. Pfahler's and Roy Pearson's of the world who make $67 million dollar frivolous law suits out of a $10 dry cleaning bill and a pair of trousers... imho that's simply "guiding" oversensitivity beyond reason.

My, what a Christian response. You sound like George Bush spreading Christianity's superior Love through advanced weaponry! Amen? You are JUST the type Christian we need telling everyone else exactly which Bible we should be using for prayer.

I guess you would be okay with the Catholic Bible and saying prayers from the books of Tobias or Barruch, eh?

y'know I had this long diatribe here for Inofuwel (or whatever...sorry I'm too lazy to scroll up even two lines to show love) whatever...but he's really not bad and in retrospect I needn't the energy to be baited for off-issue personal attacks. I may be a sucker for a heated exchange at times I guess =D sincere apologies however to Inofuweil...everyone...

I do tend to think however that it is ianakaeen who sums it up best for most folks when he says:

"It's okay for students to pray in school if that's what they believe in, but it's not okay for a school to force prayer on non-believing students. I think it's a pretty easy compromise to follow. If people weren't so hellbent on furthering their "cause" and more focused on the actual betterment of society, people who disagree could actually work together towards a common goal. Compromise people."

that's reasonable...and representative of what most people tend to actually think I believe. quality education *is* what counts here...not common beliefs in faith. and in my own words, one simply needn't misconstrue personal prayer as lording religion...

thanks to all here for their genuine interest.

Lenin on "How to attack the west" -
"Corrupt the young, get them away from religion. Get them interested in
sex. Make them superficial, destroy their ruggedness.Get control of all
means of publicity and thereby: Get the peoples' mind off their
government by focusing their attention on athletics, sexy books and
plays, and other trivialities. Divide the people into hostile groups by
constantly harping on controversial matters of no importance. Destroy
the peoples faith in their natural leaders by holding up the latter to
ridicule, contempt and obloquy. Always preach true democracy but seize
power as fast and as ruthlessly as possible. Encourage governme