Who is Truly 100 Percent American?

They can apply. I personally am tired of illegals flaunting our laws then demanding rights. They have the right to go home. If they plan to immigrate to America it might be a good idea if they learn to speak English before they come.

hey Marilynn, you know for all the other topics we disagree on, I sure as heck AGREE with you on this one! well said.

Personally I'm tired of mega-corporations flaunting our laws and having the courts and government support them-legally and financially.
The issue of Mexicans coming across the border to pick fruit and work in other low-paid jobs is irrelevant to the lack of good jobs in this country. Those have been taken away by outsourcing. The outrageous legal dilemma we are facing stems from the fact that corporations are legal "people". The depredations of Monsanto, Halliburton, Coca Cola, Blackwater, Bechtel, Chevron, Shell, et al are what is destroying our country and OTHER COUNTRIES as well! Quit scapegoating the poor!

AthenaWolf, I'm not scapegoating the poor. A skilled tradesman should not be poor. Their jobs shouldn't be taken by illegal workers that will work for a lot less money. The Union movement built the middle class. The main reason illegals are allowed in and seldom removed is to break the labor unions. It's working the middle class is disappearing.

Marilynn, I don't think that picking fruit, cleaning houses and other manual labor can be considered being a "skilled tradesman." These are the jobs most Mexicans take here.
You are right--we need more labor unions. This could save the lifestyle of MIDDLE INCOME people (I do not support "class" systems).
The real threat to our jobs is, again, the outsourcing of well-paid work by large corporations. These corporations have no loyalty to this country or to their employees. They have defaulted on pensions, not paid taxes and used billions of $ in subsidies. Good jobs go to India, Russia, Saudi Arabia and other countries.

Our border with Mexico has been permeable for centuries. Workers come here, and American (mostly) criminals, go there. This of course includes Foster Grant, which under NAFTA was able to pollute the Rio Grande to the extent that the Mexican people who live there were giving birth, in large numbers, to babies born without brains.The chemical causing this birth defect has been traced back to this company. Several other corps. allowed by NAFTA have polluted Mexico just as badly.
Mexican workers are not breaking labor unions. It is American's own sheep-like apathy and lack of ability to organize into groups and form unions that lets big corporations run rampant.
We could learn a lot from Mexican farmers' courage in standing up to their government--in Chiapas and outside Mexico city. We would do well to be inspired by their example.

Athena, You are wrong about the jobs they are doing. In Texas they are building roads, and houses. I'm sure there are other formerly high paying jobs they are taking. I use those for an example because I have witnessed it. Whole crews with one person that speaks English. It has been going on for years. I've seen crews waiting in bus shelters for day labor jobs in California, and only Spanish speaking crews of roofers on houses in California. Those same kind of workers are planting trees in Oregon. They are hired at wages that an American worker wouldn't work for. In Oregon the boss would call immigration right before the monthly payday. Because he would just be a contractor and could be gone by the time they made it back. The better jobs are the reason that farmers are having trouble finding people to pick the fruit. I'm not saying it to pick on them. I think they wouldn't come here if the jobs weren't available. The jobs wouldn't be available if the people that hired them got a big fine when caught. Then an orderly job program for jobs at a decent wage that Americans really don't want can be started. Canada has one that works well, and when the job is over they take them home. If they want to live here permanently they should be like everyone else apply and wait their turn.

You are right Marilyn, sometimes Mexicans get jobs that Americans actually want to do.

Do you have any sense of the racism that is born of blaming Mexicans for our lack of jobs? There is no crime in speaking the Spanish language.

The truth really is that corporations are so focused on making a profit at any cost they're willing to have Chinese workers, for instance, work 15 hour days 7 days a week at low pay.
Why don't you focus on this greater injustice?
Have you personally suffered from wanting to work in construction and not been hired? Perhaps this experience, although anecdotal, has colored your ability to see the larger picture? Maybe making businesses pay for hiring undocumented workers would do something positive, I don't know. But fining business that hire illegals is not going to bring jobs back from China, or Saudi Arabia...

There's a cute video up right now on aliens. Take a look at that view.

The loss of jobs is because of NAFTA, CAFTA and the rest. Thank you GHW Bush and Bill Clinton. They gave tax credits to those exiting corporations. They didn't require and standards of them while doing business in other countries yet allowed them to remain American corporations under our protection. They use slave labor, pollute the environment and of course there are no tariffs to protect the companies that stayed here from the crap they import. They pay minimal taxes. Yes, of course I can sense racism in regard to the Mexicans. I understand why they come here we ruined their economy with "fair trade." But, young people starting out that can't find an apprentice job as a carpenter, or laborer have little sympathy for the illegals. We bought one of the first houses in this sub division and I watched the rest of the houses being build by people making eight dollars an hour that spoke Spanish because they couldn't speak English. Did it make my house cheaper? No, it made the builder richer. What we do to the Mexicans is a crime. Our companies go there and don't make an effort to help bring up their standard of living. They just exploit them, same as we do here. We even sent people down there to help steal their election for the crook we wanted to win. Before I worry about China, I'm going to worry about our neighbor. People still live in cardboard and sheet metal shacks there. Now they are hungry to boot.

what rights are they demanding that aren't human rights as well? marilyn

so, what did you imply? that because you broke one law you lose all your rights...human rights?

waitin 4 ur response :)

yeeeee

the marilyn i know is back, love ur last comment!

if I can jump in here, jade, you're point is ridiculous. you can't come into a country illegally and demand the same rights that tax-paying citizens get. nobody has said that because you broke the law you lost all of your human rights, but breaking the law doesn't entitle you to the benefits of being a citizen. maybe they should pony up and get in line like the rest of immigrants who actually are eager to do it the right way and become citizens. I'd fine all of them and deport all of them and tell them to come back the right way.

I am really making no point here, zombies,, whatever

I a m just asking a person with whom I usually share views with what she really meant, and to be more explicit so I could understand her

If you notice I am asking Marilyn which are those rights that illegal immigrants are demanding that they don't deserve. I am really making no point at all. I am abstaining of giving an opinion precisely because I am not well informed. So I asked her to clarify her commentary.

:)

Of course they deserve human rights Jade. They also deserve to be given a ride home. They also after all the years we exploited them for cheap labor deserve a hand up in their own country from us. I think our government policy is to just let them remain in poverty so we can continue to use them. Have you noticed there is no one from Canada sneaking over here to work cheap? Right because they don't need to. I'd like to see Habitat for Humanity slip over the border and get some decent housing going. I'd like to see some farm co-ops started so they could have some communal equipment to work with. I'd like to see some wells dug and community sanitary facilities built. I'd love to see our government require American companies doing business there to have to pay them our prevailing minimum wage. The absolutely need to abide by our environmental laws and stop polluting their country. That is some of the things I'd like to have happen.

Thanks for that elaboration Marilynn. I agree with you.
I think the place to start making positive change is reining in the corporations that have caused this human suffering to these two nations, and the rest of the world.

AthenaWolf, Do you think I might be a socialist at heart?

Is this guy actually driving with his child in the back of the car, taking his eyes off the road to look at a web cam, and talking instead of concentrating on the road?! You have got to be kidding me. There are laws about talking on cell phones while driving, advertisements to let that s*%! ring, and yet this guy not only is putting the rest of his community at risk, but his own child. Do your video blogs at home, and for god sakes, drive when you are driving...

I respect migrants of every type and do respect some of the arguments made by 'immigrant rights groups' but I have to agree with MM more than with anyone else on this issue. A hard stark look must be taken at the effect on America and its middle class.

Mexico makes 20billion dollars anualy on remitinces from America and growing (money shipped from mexicans working in America) and another twenty billion anualy on illeagal drug trade, including the bulk of the meth and ketamine trade which are devestating, and can cause death and permanent adiction upon the first use. The issue isn't just about day laborers or low paying jobs Americans won't do. That twenty billion dollar figure is not insignificant and it represents a human cost that is hard to measure and the figure on remitences offsets much of the storied tax revenue generated by illeagal immigrants. Its wrong to sugarcoat the issue or to villanize the undocumented immigrants either, we have to take the issue seriously and make a decision which benefits America more than Mexico which has already benefited disproportionately and illeagaly from this issue.

Shouldn?t we clarify whether we are discussing "immigration" or "illegal immigration"? Seems like I've heard both terms tossed around when perusing the opinions offered here.

No one wants to completely exclude people from coming to this country. We need to stem the tide of illegal immigration into this country. I think many people can agree with this statement. The problem is not with employers that pay very low wages to undocumented workers. The problem is that we do not enforce our own laws and police our own borders.

Only the Native Americans are truly 100% American. Everyone else is either an immigrant or descended from immigrants who stole America from its rightful owners.

We tend to blame all of our problems on a powerless minority such as undocumented immigrants. Almost 70 years ago, Hitler managed to convince half of Europe that another powerless minority was responsible for all of Germany's problems. How about putting a little compassion and humanity into our immigration policies.

I definitely agree about everything you said but have you ever been in traffic beeping your horn at a car that will not move cause the person doesn't understand the traffic signs

TRY THIS HOLLYWOOD SOLUTION-
1) “THREES COMPANY”-
No alien or child of an alien ever gets citizenship benefits. Fingerprint and Alien ID for any alien (to reduce illegal immigration incentive)
2) “HOME ALONE”-
No use of any mail or package carrier (to stop money sent home to support, import family) I have support from politicians on this and it doesn't cost anything
3) “SOUTH OF THE BORDER”-
Fingerprint and issue $1000 coupon, or whatever it takes, at the border to cash far INSIDE Mexico (enticement to REVERSE Hispanic immigration) Figure what it costs to keep one illegal alien here
4) “RISKY BUSINESS”-
Pay NAFTA to add benefits INSIDE Mexico (less need to immigrate) Build hospitals, maybe Walmart? DEEP inside Mexico.

This about ILLEGAL aliens. Legal immigration is controlled. See, "This Land is My Land." Most boundaries are controlled. See, "Oh, Canada." Even free speech is controlled, "Speak now or forever hold your peace." We are very accepting people. We just will not be raped

We can’t stop a river that’s already here but we can build a dam to control it. The river is the illegal aliens coming here for the money
1Tim 6:10 "For the (longing for) money is a root of all kinds of evil"
Gal 5:14 "For the entire law is fulfilled in one statement: You shall love your neighbor as yourself"

This is a time for self-discipline. The discipline(teaching) of others needs to be controlled and fair. We should treat illegal aliens like the neighbor's child throwing a temper tantrum on our lawn. Ignore him and he will go away. If he behaves, he can visit. If he behaves, give him food. If he behaves, tell him he's welcome to come back again.

Matt 7:6 "Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces."

Rooter: Have you considered scheduling an appointment with a mental health professional?

We are assuming that illegal immigration damages our economy, etc., but does it really? If so, by how much and where? I think that immigration has been used to create a phony political issue that lets bigots think they're patriots. It's also fashionable in many quarters to hate homosexuals, non believers, women who have abortions, scientists whose research questions religion, and the dark skinned people next door. Let's stop embracing ignorance and start embracing tolerance.

Response to misanthrope:
Speaking of ignorance sir, you might want to research the topic a little more yourself. Illegal immigration is damaging not only our economy, but its damaging our security, and quality of life. Illegal immigration does lower wages, and the Bureau of Labor statistics agrees. 8 million jobs have fallen below, minimum wage. The government loses over 150 billion dollars per year to illegal immigrants. Also, the Drug cartels are making quit a revenue from smuggling. They charge from 2 to 60 thousand per head. Our crime rates, are telling us that the last thing we need, is richer criminals. The fact of the matter is, illegal immigration is harmful. This isn't about tolerance, this is about protecting America, as well as the illegals.

As a conservative, i found your comment a little disturbing. I do not hate, non believers (Because I'm one myself), women who get abortions, scientists who go against the norm, people of different skin color then me, and i support gay marriage. Your view of conservatism is ignorant, and stupid. You have obviously never researched the subject of immigration, because if you did, you would know where the damages are, and how much damage has been done. You accuse people who support regulated immigration of bigotry. Take a look at your won views, you'll find them quit bigoted yourself.

BDR

Response to Donlking:
"""No one wants to completely exclude people from coming to this country. We need to stem the tide of illegal immigration into this country. I think many people can agree with this statement."""""

I can't speak for anyone els, but i know I agree.

Response to cecile_turtle:
"""Shouldn?t we clarify whether we are discussing "immigration" or "illegal immigration"? Seems like I've heard both terms tossed around when perusing the opinions offered here."""

THANK YOU, this was a MUCH need clarification. People are generalizing, and its starting to annoy me.

_BDR_, I find that talk of "illegal immigration" by any non-Native American is somewhat indecent, at best.

Response to Vierotchka:
Justifying a wrong with a wrong doesn't work, and thats exactly what your doing. You are implying that, this land is the Native Americans. Its funny, using your poor logic, i could say the settlers had the right to take the land from the Native Americans. Experts believe that the Native Americans, actuality migrated from Europe, along the northern ice-cap in little boats, and guess what? THEY STOLE THE LAND FROM THE LITTLE BIRDIES AND DEER :''( (Take a few min. to cry if you wish) It was their land, and the Native American stole it! Not only that, but they killed the birdies, and all of the birdies friends too, like Mr. Mammoth and Mr. Caber Toothed Tiger! It's not the native American's land, its the little birdies and deer land! So, if the native Americans put the little birdies in danger and steal their land, then the settlers get to put the Native Americans in danger and steal it from them. That is exactly, what you are implying, is it not? (We stole the land from native Americans, so the illegal immigrants can put our lives and country at risk and steal it from us). I hope by now, you see the fallacy in your own argument.

BTW: I'm not hear to be nice, and sugar coat facts, I'm here to voice my opinion on subjects that better America. Illegals are putting America in danger and I'm not gonna let them do that just because settlers discovered America 300 years ago. Lets stop tap dancing around reality, and realize that we live in the year 2008, not 1776. Not only is enforcing immigration safer for American residents, but its safer for the illegals them selfs. Drug cartels are smuggling them in this country, DRUG CARTELS! Do i need to say anymore.

But hey, i guess you have a point about the whole, i have no right to talk about immigration, considering this isn't my land thing, CALLING OUT TO ALL BIRDIES AND DEER, what do you think we should do about immigration? After all it's your land! (I say that whole paragraph with the up most sarcasm)

PEACE BDR

BDR: The people who are really hurting this country and lowering wages are those who exploit undocumented immigrants. Of course, they're against reasonable, realistic immigration policies, because treating undocumented immigrants humanely would take away their slave labor force. In the American Southwest, we have lots of immigrants. The undocumented ones are easy to spot, because they look malnourished and are desperately trying to find work. And yes, the world can be a cruel, bloody place. Our species, however, has the power to change things for the better. What the hell is wrong with exercising compassion even if we think the other guy doesn't deserve it?

I am a third generation American on my mother's side and a fifth generation American on my father's side. All of my grandparents became 100% Americans when they immigrated here, you butt-face, because they went through the process at the time. That's the way immigrants settled America. They did not sneak in or set apart a section of the country for themselves. Nor did they make any demands on the America they wanted to be a part of.

They assimilated into America and helped build up America. When my grandfather moved here from Norway, he changed his name from Jonsen to Johnson because it looked more American. But he still got the paper from Norway every day.

And he never spoke with an accent. He always said there was only one American English and everyone here could learn it if they wanted to. That's more a 100% American than 99% of people that are born here.

You insult your grandparents when you compare them to today's illegal immigrants. Even the stow-aways from our grandparents era tried harder to assimilate and contribute something to society.

Today too many immigrants live together on one property, leaving not enough property tax to pay for their upkeep. The little they pay in income taxes pays for state and federal programs, not for everyday things the county pays for.

Today's immigrants need to be helped much the same way our grandparents were helped. By setting them up, if they need it, and then cutting them loose. If they get in trouble, we need to deal with it like we always have. If they get a reputation, they'll have earned it rightfully. As it is now they have:

RESPECTATION:
(EXPECTATION OF RESPECT UNEARNED)

They look to those whose work they took,
And say, "Don't give me such a look.
If you were me, I do expect,
You'd want a measure of respect.

Well, that's not something you can deal.
Respect's not something you can steal.
Respect is something you must earn.
Now, that's a lesson you must learn.

rooter: It's so great to correspond with an intellectual giant instead of some ill informed but highly opinionated purveyor of pop culture wisdom.

Response to misanthrope:
"The low wages are to blame on the businesses," I agree with that. But were not talking just wages, were talking jobs! Jobs are being taken, by illegal workers. The jobless rate of citizens is rising, and its partially because of jobs not being available! 7 million citizens are jobless right now! The last thing we need is illegal workers, taking jobs, that America actually needs!

You have to ask yourself, do you feel comfortable with undocumented, unchecked people going in and out of are country? In other words, the Government has not a clue whose here! Do you feel comfortable with that? There could be a terrorist in are country right now, and the government doesn't have a damn clue! How is the government supposed to enforce laws, if they cant find illegal immigrant criminals? It's not like they can look up their address on the computer! THEY DON"T EXIST! Illegal immigrant warrants are rising, and laws aren't being enforced. In some high crime areas, such as Los Angelous, 90% of all warrants are for an illegal immigrant. I'm willing to bet every penny in my wallet, that if the government had these criminals documented they could be caught, and justice would be served!

Directly addressing your argument, "the world is in our hands, and we have the power to change it" (paraphrased). Inviting undocumented workers isn't going to change the world at all. All its doing is taking poverty form one country and bringing it over here. the solution to poverty is not, "if your poor, come on over to America!". That is not the solution! The solution is keeping people where they are, and improving their land! Letting people come over doesn't fix poverty at all, it just fuels it.

This is not an issue that you can just addres with just logic based on morality. Research the facts, and form an opinion that makes the world better for all now,and more importantly, makes it better for the FUTURE. Future is one of those concepts liberals can't seem to understand.

PEACE, BDR

Of course we need realistic and compassionate immigration laws, but being undocumented does not make a person a terrorist, and it makes them a criminal only by a technicality. Have you ever broken a law and gotten by with it? If so, you're technically a criminal. The typical undocumented immigrant from Latin America will work for wages and under conditions that most of us will not tolerate. From its reasons to its effects, the exploitation of helpless individuals is an offence to all of humanity. We need to find and eliminate the causes, not just blame an ethnic group.

As for the really dangerous people, they will find a way to sneak in no matter what.

BDR - you should listen again to the speaker, whose last statement is that we should create laws and procedures that work and that allow people who want to come into this country. The current procedures do not work well. Policing the borders and trying to clamp down on illegal immigration is impossible without changes to the current laws and procedures for legal immigration, because people will find a way into this country if they can not feed their family in their country. It's as simple as that.
Peace