Clean coal is just another myth
- added May 30, 2008
- 21 responses
-

-
-
-
- jayruth27
- added this
-
-
- related topics
-
- Earth and Science (12546)
- Tech (7330)
- Environment (5591)
- Science (4170)
- Technology (3326)
- Energy (731)
- Green Energy (99)
- Coal (99)
- Environmental (98)
So I don't know about you, but I've been noticing the increase in ads promoting clean coal technologies and got curious about it. Well, I'm not convinced that clean coal is any part of our solution, or even really viable.
"The premise of Carbon Capture and Storage (CCS) is that carbon dioxide emissions from coal-fired power plants can be captured before it enters the atmosphere and then stored underground in geological formations. The coal industry has been promoting the idea of “clean coal” through the usage of CCS technology as a solution for global warming despite the fact that its efficacy has yet to be proven on a large scale and even best-case scenarios don’t have CCS being in place for at least a couple decades.
Greenpeace’s new report systematically debunks all of the coal industry’s claims about CCS, demonstrating that we have no time to waste on this dubious technology if we are to avert the most drastic effects of global warming.
The report exposes CCS technology’s woeful inadequacy on numerous points.
The release of this report is especially timely, as the U.S. Congress will soon debate global warming legislation that could increase give-a-ways to the coal industry and waste taxpayer dollars on this unproven and potentially dangerous technology. It is vitally important that we do not let ourselves be duped by this global warming distraction: Every dollar spent on CCS technology is a dollar not available for clean and proven technologies such as wind and solar.
Top 5 Reasons Carbon Captureand Storage is a Myth
http://www.coal-is-dirty.com/carbon-capture-and-storage...
#1: CCS cannot deliver in time to avoid dangerous climate change
The earliest possibility for deployment of CCS on a large commercial scale is not expected before 2030. The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) does not expect CCS to be commercially viable until at least 2050. Nor does Oil-giant Shell who "doesn't foresee CCS being in widespread use until 2050."
#2: CCS wastes energy
The technology uses between 10 and 40% of the energy produced by a power station. Wide scale adoption of CCS is expected to erase the efficiency gains of the last 50 years and increase energy consumption by one-third.
#3: CCS is expensive
CCS could lead to the doubling of plant costs, and an electricity price increase of 21-91%. The US Department of Energy (DOE) recently pulled out of the only "clean coal" pilot project with CCS technology in the US due to massive budget increases from initial estimate of $800 million to $1.8 billion.
#4: "Capture Ready" coal plants are pure greenwash
CCS is being used as an excuse by power companies and utilities to push ahead with plans to build new coal-fired power plants, branding them as "capture ready." Promises to retrofit are unlikely to be kept. Retrofits are very expensive and can carry such high efficiency losses that the plants become uneconomical.
#5: Storing CO2 underground can have unintended consequences\
The world has no experience in the long-term storage of anything, let alone CO2. A 2006 United State Geological Survey (USGS) field experiment showed there is every chance that carbon dioxide will behave in ways that are totally unexpected.
The researchers were surprised when the buried CO2 dissolved large amounts of the surrounding minerals responsible for keeping it contained.
For an in-depth look at Carbon Capture and Sequestration (CCS), check out "False Hope: Why Carbon capture and storage won't save the climate," recently released by Greenpeace International http://www.greenpeace.org/usa/press-center/reports4/fal...
"The premise of Carbon Capture and Storage (CCS) is that carbon dioxide emissions from coal-fired power plants can be captured before it enters the atmosphere and then stored underground in geological formations. The coal industry has been promoting the idea of “clean coal” through the usage of CCS technology as a solution for global warming despite the fact that its efficacy has yet to be proven on a large scale and even best-case scenarios don’t have CCS being in place for at least a couple decades.
Greenpeace’s new report systematically debunks all of the coal industry’s claims about CCS, demonstrating that we have no time to waste on this dubious technology if we are to avert the most drastic effects of global warming.
The report exposes CCS technology’s woeful inadequacy on numerous points.
The release of this report is especially timely, as the U.S. Congress will soon debate global warming legislation that could increase give-a-ways to the coal industry and waste taxpayer dollars on this unproven and potentially dangerous technology. It is vitally important that we do not let ourselves be duped by this global warming distraction: Every dollar spent on CCS technology is a dollar not available for clean and proven technologies such as wind and solar.
Top 5 Reasons Carbon Captureand Storage is a Myth
http://www.coal-is-dirty.com/carbon-capture-and-storage...
#1: CCS cannot deliver in time to avoid dangerous climate change
The earliest possibility for deployment of CCS on a large commercial scale is not expected before 2030. The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) does not expect CCS to be commercially viable until at least 2050. Nor does Oil-giant Shell who "doesn't foresee CCS being in widespread use until 2050."
#2: CCS wastes energy
The technology uses between 10 and 40% of the energy produced by a power station. Wide scale adoption of CCS is expected to erase the efficiency gains of the last 50 years and increase energy consumption by one-third.
#3: CCS is expensive
CCS could lead to the doubling of plant costs, and an electricity price increase of 21-91%. The US Department of Energy (DOE) recently pulled out of the only "clean coal" pilot project with CCS technology in the US due to massive budget increases from initial estimate of $800 million to $1.8 billion.
#4: "Capture Ready" coal plants are pure greenwash
CCS is being used as an excuse by power companies and utilities to push ahead with plans to build new coal-fired power plants, branding them as "capture ready." Promises to retrofit are unlikely to be kept. Retrofits are very expensive and can carry such high efficiency losses that the plants become uneconomical.
#5: Storing CO2 underground can have unintended consequences\
The world has no experience in the long-term storage of anything, let alone CO2. A 2006 United State Geological Survey (USGS) field experiment showed there is every chance that carbon dioxide will behave in ways that are totally unexpected.
The researchers were surprised when the buried CO2 dissolved large amounts of the surrounding minerals responsible for keeping it contained.
For an in-depth look at Carbon Capture and Sequestration (CCS), check out "False Hope: Why Carbon capture and storage won't save the climate," recently released by Greenpeace International http://www.greenpeace.org/usa/press-center/reports4/fal...
-
Clean coal is nothing more than a marketing campaign. There is nothing clean about coal. Its like they are trying to use the jedi mind trick and all of a sudden we are supposed to think that burning coal isn't bad for human health or the environment.
-
Of course it's a marketing campaign. How can hundreds of tons of dust be clean? It gets into the atmosphere and eventually into our lungs. Would you breathe in a fist-full of baby powder even if it was sanitary?
-
What was the BS reason we couldn't tap into our nation's oil reserves again? I forgot. Oil shortage my ass!
-
-
-
-
- Enjoy_Cannabis
- 4 months ago
-
-
Yup, greenwashed crap, 100%. Clean coal my butt, what about extracting it from the earth, huh? You know, at this point, go on and pump more oil, go on and burn coal, but internalize the costs, stop covering up how expensive it really is. Pay for the product, cradle to grave, then see how efficient fossil fuels are.
-
It's a scam to continue business as usual.... So why aren't the presidential candidates telling the truth about that to the people?
-
-
-
-
- JanforGore
- 4 months ago
-
-
if you believe in clean coal, you probably believe in santa clause.
they should call it what it is. cleaner than dirty coal-
-
-
-
- johnmcstupid
- 4 months ago
-
-
Several of the presidential debate where sponsored by clean coal.
I wonder if anyone has thought of pumping our sewage back into our water system and calling it clean sewage. We could save lots of money by not treating our water but pay lots of water treatment CEOs lots of money for doing nothing. -
Yeah, one time I tried to clean a piece of coal, and it just didn't work. My hands got all black and dirty, and eventually the coal just disappeared! What a joke!
-
-
-
-
- 75thDeadMan
- 4 months ago
-
-
Something I learned in one of my classes this year: the coal scrubbers, federally mandated devices that catch particulates in the emissions, simply solidify the pollution into a sludge which is, often times, dumped into local rivers.
-
In the US the power plants get a credit from the government for using what's called clean coal. They basically spray the dirty coal with something and call it clean.
-
-
-
-
- nuttyguy20
- 4 months ago
-
-
Saying "clean coal" is like saying "peaceful war". The two have nothing possible in common with each other. It's a lie.
You all should check these out too:
http://current.com/items/88987486_video_discovery_chann...
http://www.oilandwaterproject.org/Oil_+_Water_-_The_Mov... -
-
This documentary has been available with Comcast On Demand for a while, but not anymore unfortunately. It's extremely enlightening, and has plenty of first hand footage of mining in West Virginia.
-
-
-
-
- St_Alia_10191
- 4 months ago
-
-
Joys of oxymoron. Just like "Smart Bush" there is just no such thing, or its a complete lie.
-
I'd like to know why we don't see a story about this on ABC, NBC, CBS or Fox. Drop 'em a line and ask 'em.
-
William McDonough has said it before, I'm paraphrasing, but "less bad, is still bad."
-
I am as much of an anti-corporation guy as everyone else seems to be, but I recently wrote a research paper on a new green fuels technology involving coal and it should be something to consider... here's why.
The process that I researched is called Fisher-Tropsch synthesis. Basically, you take coal, just about any coal, and then you send it through a combustion system to obtain H2 + CO, or syngas. The actual Fischer-Tropsch synthesis is where the H2 and CO are fired and selectively combined together to produce hydrocarbons chains such as diesel or regular gasoline (this does produce CO2 and would have to be captured!). But in order to do this, the feed syngas must be super clean, so it's a requirement to remove as much of the harmful chemicals as possible to increase the hydrocarbon yield. The problems then becomes what to do with the excess gases- for example, any sulfur can be sold for profit.
What's great about this process is the fact that it produces really clean fuels, diesels (which are the easiest to manufacture) with high cetane values (similar to octane values) that reduce the consumer-side pollutions and increase efficiency. In essence, you put most of the work on the manufacturing end to decrease harmful emissions [insert government regulations here]. This of course, is probably more effective than coming up with newer catalytic converter-type technology. Furthermore, new compression ignition engines (most cars use spark ignition) can further increase the fuel economy of diesel.
The really surprising thing is that syngas used in the production of the diesel can also be produced from plants, and uses all of the plant (more syngas) unlike the use of ethanol. In fact, there may even be a possibility to convert our initial coal fired Fischer-Tropsch plants over to fully biomass operated plants. There have already been studies for mixing coal and biomass syngas where emissions are minimized and profits are maximized.
All that I'm asking is that we be a little open-minded about this, and examine which types of technologies are being pushed for before congress (there are indeed some really nasty alternatives to Fisher-Tropsch). After all, the United States has the largest supply of coal in the world according to the Internation Energy Agency. If we can use this coal we should, it could hopefully decrease our dependence on foreign oil until we can find a viable alternative to these fossil fuels.
P.S. I would check your sources on the commercial viability: gas prices have gone up dramatically since the research that I've read is based on. If my information is correct, the economy of this technology is probably nearing twice commercially viable. $50/barrel was the final count for viability with development a couple of years ago. -
defintly an oxymoron, its like saying cold lava....
-
-
-
-
- jakes_green
- 4 months ago
-
-
Just another example of Fascist rule createing propoganda to expand control and profits. Not to mention over 1 million acres of the Appalachian Mtns. have already been destroyed by mountaintop removal. Or that not one of the congressmen in the coalfield districts is cosponsering the clean water protection act. The mainstream "corporate" media is owned by the same people who are attempting a fascist corporate takeover of the U.S. Why do you think these people fear science and education so much.
-
-
-
-
- victimofcoal
- 4 months ago
-
Login/Registration is required to add a response.
