No Health Care? Tough. This is America. Die.
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- JonRaymond
- added this
Here's a rundown of the right's genius response to heath care reform based on interviews at this recent health care town hall in Alhambra CA.
1. Solution for the 48 million uninsured: Life is tough. Get over it. Die.
2. Solution for those uninsured who end up walking into hospitals: Well there should be some kind of program for them (duh - like government socialized health care?).
3. Major concern: the health care reform is not about health care (What's it about then? Toilet paper?).
4. Yup. Major problem with socialism: Toilet paper (Wasn't that a 60s U.S. propaganda spin?)
So if we keep the current system and 48 million people remain uninsured, who picks up the bill when they walk into the hospital? The government..
So, it is then the government's prerogative to insure these people ahead of time in order to save money on their hospital bills, is it not? It is also only fair that everyone else has the same option to choose that government insurance as well.
Scenes in this clip will be used in an upcoming documentary film, "Got Healthcare?" http://outinthestreetfilms.com.
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- News, Current Tonight, News and Politics, VC2 Top Contenders US, 22 more
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- tags:
- Economy, Health Care, Insurance, Health Insurance, 9 more
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billyatwork
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I BELIEVE THAT ALL AMERICANS SHOULD BE COVERED BY HEALTH CARE,EMPLOYED OR UNEMPLOYED. ITS HUMAN RIGHT, TO PROTECT EACH OTHER. IF WE DONT WHO WILL. YOU CAN TAKE FROM MY EARNING TO SAVE A LIFE.
FREE HEATH CARE FOR EVERYONE!
ENOUGH WITH THE SELFISHNESS. WE ARE IN THE AGE OF CANCERS AND HIV/AIDS,THESE PEOPLE ARE NOT GETTING TREATED PROPERLY CAUSING DEATHS.
- 5 months ago
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billyatwork
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Luan
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This is not socialism at all. It's offering variety to people for health insurance with reasonable budget. I came from Taiwan, which offers Taiwanese national health care. Over there, if you want to have that service, you just pay certain amount every month (I would say it's really affordable to everyone.) If you have major or more fatal diseases needs better service, you could choose a better hospital and paying a bit extra more for advanced treatment. I think it runs well and serve people really well in Taiwan. Hope to see this could happen one day in America. God bless America :)
- 6 months ago
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Luan
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Tikbalang
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There will never be a single payer healthcare system in America. Americans do not trust their government even though they freely elected their government. They would rather trust an insurance company than their freely elected government. It is okay for an insurance company to delay or deny their claim. It is okay for an insurance company to cause their bankruptcy or death from delayed or denied claims. But if a government run healthcare system funded by tax dollars gives away a free band aid to someone who didn't pay taxes that is far worse. Americans will never have a single payer healthcare system like most of the modern free world already has because Americans are stupid. They think that a single payer system means that the government is going to take over the healthcare system. They think their freely elected government is far too stupid to run something as big and as important as healthcare. Americans are happy with the way insurance companies already run healthcare by denying coverage to anyone who is already sick, by collecting massive premiums and then bankrupting people with copays or killing them by refusing to pay for treatment. Americans love this system because it is not socialism, it is a free competitive marketplace. Why are we even talking about changing healthcare when everything is already perfect?
- 6 months ago
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Tikbalang
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JonRaymond
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Tikbalang:
You are assuming Americans control their government. What ever gave you that idea?
- 6 months ago
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JonRaymond
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resolute
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Tikbalang:
When you put it that way Americans are surely gullible.
- 6 months ago
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resolute
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galwayman
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I agree with you mariahbarnum it is worth it to save 3 out of 5 lives and there is not enough focus on prevention because that would effect the profits the drug companies and AMA members currently enjoy! genectics is so important as well! socialized medicine would include these factors due to the profit factor being removed from the equasion!
- 6 months ago
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galwayman
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mariahbarnum
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Honestly, I think that socialized health care should be offered. At least a cheap option with good coverage for those that can't afford it. If the rich assholes want to buy their own insurance, they can go for it.
Also, I think that along with socialized health care, the government should put money into teaching Americans about PREVENTION. Teaching people healthier eating habits, tracking down what diseases run in families, and telling them what diseases they could be at risk for and ways that they may be able to prevent it would run the cost of health care down a lot. The countries that put a lot of emphasis on disease prevention are typically the ones with healthier citizens. Its just a good idea.
And yes, I know that there will be people who will just say "Oh, I'm at risk for a heart attack? Well whatever, its too late now, I'm 49 and there's nothing I can do to help it now. I'll just go home and eat four cheeseburgers and gulp down a 44oz of soda." But what about the people that actually DO take that advice and information to heart? Isn't it worth it if we can save even 3 out of 5 lives? I think so.
- 6 months ago
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mariahbarnum
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galwayman
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mikejohns15,
You are so right brother.capitalism and socialism can,and must work together for the betterment of society.I hope those who read your post understand that! have been a socialist since the 60's and currently work as an organizer in Public Housing. am starting a housing group and am submitting a short film in a couple of weeks.I hope you don't mind if I add you as a connection? power to the people! - 6 months ago
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galwayman
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mikejohns15
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galwayman:
I just recently got interested in the Socialist Party, and have been looking into it greatly. And ,as a history nerd, I have great interest in politics through the ages, especially in the 20th century. I even read the Communist Manifesto to better understand Communism. And I'll ad you as a connection, too!
- 6 months ago
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mikejohns15
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mikejohns15
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Well, what I love is that everyone is calling this a Socialist Bill, when in reality, they have no idea what Socialism is. Instead, they replace it with COMMUNISM, which is NOT THE SAME THING. Communism means no capitalism, in a nutshell, and that the workers will come to inherit the Earth. Socialism is based on the creation of a WELFARE STATE, where the PROUD citizens of a nation HELP EACH OTHER by paying taxes for universal, public things. And how they mixed Nazism into that is beyond me. The Nazis were "afraid" of Socialism, competitors with it, not part of it. Get your facts straight, people.
- 6 months ago
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mikejohns15
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galwayman
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mikejohns15:
Mikejohns,
got your message.was 16 when I started in the anti-war movement in 1968.would like to take futher about the questions you asked.email me at lavin.stephen@yahoo.com!
Galwayman - 6 months ago
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galwayman
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drewsuf721
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mikejohns15:
The 'Nazi party' is just a shortening of the actual title Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei, nationalism and socialism. That is why the Germans nowadays are so against nationalism, or what we would call patriotism.
They are still very much a socialistic culture, but I don't say that negatively. Their healthcare system is much better for the people than what we have in the US.
- 5 months ago
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drewsuf721
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carmalite
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That witch thinks the poor should not be able to go the same hospitals as her. She probably has hoofs and a tail she is hiding. What a hateful ugly greedy witch.
- 6 months ago
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carmalite
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galwayman
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I should have added that while we do have medicaid and medicare those on either or both are treated differently from those who can afford the high cost of private insurance.this is to me so wrong! every American requiring health care must be treated equally.congress has the best health plan,as does the federal government in general,every American citizen should have that same health coverage.that however is just a start.next we must bring price and cost controls into play pursuant to the drug companies and the pratice of medicine.the important thing to remember is that the drug companies and the AMA will never agree to do so unless they are forced to.For instance the cost of drugs in canada is 50% less then in the USA! That is also true in the EU! Its time to move forward to creating a just health care system for every citizen! A focus on preventive Medicine is also needed as educating people is an important key in lowering costs as well! any health care bill that passes without the public option included is not a just bill! 77% of our citizens have demanded it! We must remind those in DC that they work for us and the people have spoken and that option is a key part of a fair and just health care bill,while at the same time providing the same level of Health Care to every American!
- 6 months ago
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galwayman
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galwayman
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Look its simple this country needs a health care system where every citizen is treated equally without income asessments. We must have cost and price controls on health care providers and the drug companies,and while I agree that the government created the mess health care is in here,something must be done! the AMA and the drug companies will never do anything to solve the problem volentarily! Thats a given! So mike how would you fix the problem?
- 6 months ago
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galwayman
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vladbox
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Dont worry, right wingers WILL die of their own cancerous lifestyle, embedded in their ignorance and stuck in their overweight bodies!
- 6 months ago
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vladbox
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shanklinmike
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People, people, the government already basically runs the healthcare industry now through an array of regulations and they have done so for decades! The current system is actually more fascist than anything else. Giving this fascist system more power will not make it better, it will only create more price distortions, give more power to the bureaucrats who are already in bed with the insurance companies, and it will not be fair in creating competition up against efficient insurance carriers. This is a protectionist bill for the politicians, nothing more. The quality of healthcare will continue to decrease and the cost will continue to skyrocket. Government cannot magically cut costs, but they sure can distort the price signal mechanism that is vital towards lowering costs and bringing about a system that is based on more competition. If someone tells you the government is not in healthcare today, they are lying to you. Everything you see around you is a failure of previous central planning from government bureaucrats. The politicians cannot fix the mess they created.
- 6 months ago
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shanklinmike
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MilchMann
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shanklinmike:
"On what planet do you spend most of your time?" -Barney Frank
- 6 months ago
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MilchMann
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JonRaymond
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shanklinmike:
If this were true why would the health care insurance industry and their Republican benefactors be so opposed to reform? They would welcome it.
- 6 months ago
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JonRaymond
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remanns
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These "ClifssNotes Culture Repuglicant Scholars" should read more and yell less. GAH!
- 6 months ago
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remanns
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logicpocket
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This is pathetic. Read the napkins. http://tr.im/wPNF
- 6 months ago
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logicpocket
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quanta
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health care is a individual responsibility, we have forgotten the primal blueprint, our bodies know what to do ,what to be , We produce within ourselves a far better source of drug for every need that arises , than any pharmacuetical company ever could . healing is natural to us , there is no extreme situation that warrent someone esle to tell you how to care for your body on a lifetime basis, fallow your instincts, watch what you eat, and ya if you need a new heart or your lungs are shot remember the turn over of new cells per day your body produces . keep yourself open to alternatives. manage your own health care system,keep your money.
- 6 months ago
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quanta
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artemis6
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quanta:
In ancient china healers were only paid if you remained healthy . I wish it were true , what you say . It has been my personal experience , that doesn't work so well after you have been in a side collision .
- 6 months ago
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artemis6
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abehammy
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that blonde chick who claims that our current healthcare system "is number 1 in the world" is really starting to piss me off.
- 6 months ago
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abehammy
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CarlosIsDown
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1:09 = Sarah Palin lookalike.
- 6 months ago
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CarlosIsDown
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hollyMiamiFla
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Question geek, why are you stereotyping and passing judgement on people you don't even know? I am sick of all the excuses. This isn't about someone's lifestyle, it's about humanity.
Many hospitals are struggling to keep their doors open and insurance premiums and other related expenses are astronomically high. Hence, we are already paying for those that aren't insured with the way things are! How do you think people without insurance get care now? I assure you that the majority cannot pay the ridiculously expensive medical bills after the fact. And quite honestly, I am sick of getting certain aspects of heath care denied or having the one medication that I take denied by my insurance company that I pay handsomely for. I am a registered nurse and I have been watching this problem grow like a fungus for 20 years. We are the land of the free and the land of opportunity, yet with all the wealth and technology and so-called "best health care in the world", we still have people without direct access to health care, without the burden of paying out of pocket. Please. Don't pass judgement until you have walked a mile in the shoes of those you call unworthy. - 6 months ago
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hollyMiamiFla
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QuestionGeek
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What I don't like is all these people that want health care but can't afford it, yet they want to eat at McDonald's everyday, chomp on candy bars, eat ice cream, smoke cigarettes, drink alcohol, and not exercise, etc. They don't want to take care of themselves.....
- 6 months ago
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QuestionGeek
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lifestudentno83
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QuestionGeek:
Nice job generalizing everyone into a nice group.
Perhaps we should just make it so people who eat candy bars, smoke cigarettes, eat McDonald's, drink alcohol, eat ice cream, and not exercise shouldn't get health care EVER.
Then everyone who doesn't do all that can still pay out the ass for it.
You're as bad as that woman who said that we should "Make poor people go to separate hospitals because they need some 'other' situation". How about you move somewhere everyone doesn't get health care and leave the rest of us REAL Americans alone.
- 6 months ago
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lifestudentno83
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QuestionGeek
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QuestionGeek:
Who is generalizing? I mentioned just ONE of the problems when it comes to our health care or sickness care, as I like to call it. This IS the FATTEST nation on the planet (USA). I am well aware that there are many other factors involved. For those of you offended at my earlier statement, perhaps you don't believe diddly squat in preventive medicine? I wasn't trying to generalize at all.
The main problem is that corporate American is tired of Americans living so long because we're putting a strain on the system. Also, the uninsured get free care. That care is paid for by raising tax dollars and premiums of those who do have health care. Ohhhh, but no we can't have single payer health care, because that equals socialized medicine. Many in America have been indoctrinated to believe that single payer health care is bad? Bad how? If socialized medicine is bad, then why do we have Medicare? Hello? Why do we have socialized postal service, socialized firefighting service, social security pensions, socialized law enforcement, etc, etc.
The people in this video would do better volunteering or getting involved in real politics, calling their senators and congressmen, instead of ranting on "street corners".
- 6 months ago
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QuestionGeek
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JonRaymond
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QuestionGeek:
This is a good point. People need to stay healthy. This is also something Obama talks about with wellness programs. Although these programs will ultimately save the government health care costs, they cannot be counted in when tabulating the cost of reform.
- 6 months ago
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JonRaymond
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hollyMiamiFla
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This is to whoever the chick is with the designer sunglasses and white tank top at the beginning of the piece, YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOURSELF! You are one of the most selfish people I have every lisentened to. I would be embarrassed stand with you. This is issue is about human life and equality. It's about compassion and understanding. Anyone who doesn't see that we need a system that cares for everyone or at least gives everyone access to health care is selfish and despicable. Paying for any aspect of health care out of pocket would bankrupt most if not everyone. SELFISHNESS=BAD KARMA
- 6 months ago
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hollyMiamiFla
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kennymotown
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Back then JohnA, hospitals were non profit.
- 6 months ago
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kennymotown
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JohnA
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kennymotown:
It was a joke.
- 6 months ago
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JohnA
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JohnA
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Did John Wayne have health care? Did Gary Cooper have health care? Did Randolph Scott have health care? I rest my case.
- 6 months ago
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JohnA
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kennymotown
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JohnA:
OK John I get it, I think.
- 6 months ago
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kennymotown
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lifestudentno83
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JohnA:
You don't want health care? Don't pay for it.
Don't tell me not to pitch in so everyone can have some coverage because you're a greedy penny pincher.
You don't like it? Move to Canada.
OH WAIT... THEY HAVE SOCIALIZED MEDICINE THERE!!!
Africa probably doesn't have socialized medicine there.
Go get you a plane ticket, and tell me how the medical plans work out there... - 6 months ago
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lifestudentno83
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artemis6
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First , That woman was pretty , perhaps she doesn't think she should need to use her brain or that anyone else matters . I am glad not to have her karma ... Second , I wish these clips could be played in every household in america for the next 6 months 10 times a day , because that is what it is gonna take to get through to these self centered bigots . I wish I had the money to do it , just to see all the HMOs cry like the whiners they are . Let's stop toying around with the public option . The HMOs have proven they will not play fair at all , and will destroy it anyway . Death management is too dangerous to keep around . Single payer all the way !
- 6 months ago
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artemis6
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galwayman
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every american should have the same access to health care that congress has1 That rich bitch "I don't think they should go to the same hospitals that I do" hey bitch take your 400 dollar sunglasses and shove them where the sun don't shine baby! I really hate these rich right wing scumbags they are the real problem in this country and they don't pay their fare share of taxes anyway!
- 6 months ago
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galwayman
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Mymicz1 [removed]
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Support Kucinich, congressional healthcare for everyone if they want it! Congress is not more equal than you!
- 6 months ago
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Mymicz1 [removed]
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drewsuf721
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I have questions for both sides of the aisle:
for someone against reform: Why would you like to allow insurance companies, with over 60% of revenue devoted to administrative costs, to control your medical future? Looking at the trends, health care costs will rise continually if we choose to do nothing.
for someone supporting reform: Why is every person entitled to medical care, disregarding their personal choices, simply for being an American? How much would you allow taxes to rise to pay for the extra coverage of 45 million people in Medicare, (many healthy young adults). Would you support a bill that requires everyone to buy health insurance?
In my opinion, I think we can do much better than what we have now. Obviously there has been a lot of misinformation about 'death panels' and 'socialism', scare tactics. But I also believe fiscal conservatives have some merit in their argument, how can we control deficit spending? What would this do to incentives, i.e. averting diabetes and lung cancer? I think it is disingenuous when someone says a public option wouldn't be bailed out by government, it would. I know the insurance companies are fraught with cronyism, but how can they honestly compete with government pockets? The balance would be extremely difficult and I don't believe it would be carried out honestly.
It is sad when I completely disagree with both sides at the rallies.
A what if to add: Mr. Burd's approach... give your employees a health care check, let them choose what they buy or if they buy. It's an incentive to get a job and not milk the system, but you still have choice and it makes the insurance companies act competitively (forcing cuts in administrative costs).
My thoughts on all this could go on for pages...
- 6 months ago
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drewsuf721
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JonRaymond
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drewsuf721:
(Fast forward this video to the halfway point to get past the niceties) The proposed health care reform will not increase the deficit it will decrease it. He states that current reforms will already decrease the deficit over ten years by $2 trillion. Obama says he will not sign a bill that does not reduce the deficit and does not reduce health care costs to average Americans (see the second video above http://current.com/items/90548479_obamas-health-care-plan-explained.htm).
However, people making over $250,000 will have a tax increase (to 28%) to support one third of the cost of public health care. The other two thirds of public health care cost will come from reorganizing the current system to make it more efficient. All of this from Obama who states the following (midway through this video);
$17 billion per year is taken OUT of Medicare to subsidize insurance companies (a.k.a. Medicare Advantage, run by insurance companies already making a big profit without any competitive budding). Reform would save us this $17 billion.
(at 56 minutes into this video) Obama explains how health care reform will be paid for. He says (as a aside) that for the cost of the last 5 or 6 years in Iraq we could have paid for health care reform. Furthermore, reform will reallocate money currently spent by the government to subsidize the current health care system as in the example above.
They will also reform what insurance companies are doing by limiting the percentage of profits either through competition or direct legislative caps (I think).
We will also benefit from wellness programs to keep people healthier, though that can't be counted.
All of these things are being debated in Congress.
By the way (and this is from me) we spend $775,000 per year per troop on Afghanistan in a war of questionable value to anyone.
(ref http://current.com/items/90656777_taliban-now-winning.htm) The Obama administration is in the midst of an Afghan buildup that will push U.S. troop levels here to a record 68,000 by year end. There are roughly an additional 30,000 troops from North Atlantic Treaty Organization countries and other allies.
$775,000 x 68,000 (new troops just sent there) = $527,000,000,000 (over half a trillion per year). If you're so worried about cost, why aren't you complaining about this? War destroys and kills. it builds nothing. It takes lives, not save them. It is useless.
- 6 months ago
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JonRaymond
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drewsuf721
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drewsuf721:
I think bringing war into this topic is unhelpful. Obviously the war is costing our country a lot of money, I would like to see the pointless wars end, yes. That is another topic. With that being said, "could have paid for" from the cost of war is different than "will be paid for".
So the answer to paying for 45 million more patients under a new version of Medicare is reallocation? How many people believe this? I cannot. You say taxes will go up for the richest, but what will that do to our venture capital and the American spirit of determination and hard work? I may not strive for success when I have comfort in poverty.
Now I'm not saying the poor do not deserve care and well being, they do, but I know we must look at all angles of cost and incentive if we are reforming a major pillar of our culture. We could go too far or not far enough.
IMHO, both sides have been purchased by lobbyists and no longer work for their constituents. To overlook the vested interests is to overlook the whole discussion. Cut off the influence of money for decision makers and maybe we'll have believable outcomes in the future.
- 5 months ago
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drewsuf721
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Ryland
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Unfortunately, This is the mentality of the American society now. If it isn't going to benefit them, Why do it?
And where the people get there news from is very important.
Most of the people that are against health care reform, watch fox news exclusively.Personally, I think the best way to get every side of the story, is not only listen to a lot of different sources, But also talk to people. Like family doctors, Ask them, What do they think?
People say that our economy is unsustainable, And our health care is unsustainable, Personally, I think its our society that is unsustainable, What happened to the days when people helped the neighbor and friends, and didn't want money for it? What happened to the days that people actually cared about other people, rather then just them selves.
These people that are against health care reform, are the same people that tell homeless people to get a job. Not realizing that if your homeless, its quite hard to get a job since you don't even have a place to get a shower in the morning. And until these people have been in the shoes of people that a homeless, or in this case, without health insurance, I don't think they'll ever understand.
- 6 months ago
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Ryland
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kivol
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Ryland:
Just to back you up. Thanks
- 6 months ago
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kivol
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mariahbarnum
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Ryland:
Its also pretty hard for a homeless person to find a job when they don't even have an address to put on the application. Or a car to drive to get that application.
- 6 months ago
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mariahbarnum
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neonbunny
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Wow that woman was the definition of a self-centered turbo bitch... maybe some megalomania in there too?
- 6 months ago
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neonbunny
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jay_ct
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Certain industries should not be for profit.
The Health Insurance and Drug companies should top the list.
Health insurance companies actually have a greater profit margin than Casinos.
- 6 months ago
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jay_ct
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samthesixth
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The right wing didn't always have them. In the 60s many on the left had them and openly carried in public.
- 6 months ago
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samthesixth
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Stever_B
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@Found_Avenue: I couldn't have said it better....
My God, how I hate the right wing. Sometimes it's a shame that they have all the guns.
- 6 months ago
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Stever_B
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MilchMann
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Stever_B:
They don't ;D
- 6 months ago
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MilchMann
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Found_Avenue
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Stever_B:
Thanks!
And actually, don't know if this will cheer you up, but...
I have close friends who are absolutely the farthest thing from Right Wing, and they are avid gun owners.(not for hunting - for protection and collecting)
- 6 months ago
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Found_Avenue
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Found_Avenue
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I think the 2nd woman on the video (you know, the one with the four-hundred-dollar-sunglasses) REALLY says it all:
"I don't think that THOSE PEOPLE should be allowed to go to the same hospitals I do..."
And then when asked about whether or not we should have a government run program for those poor, non-privileged, non-insured dregs of society called the "middle class," she says "I hope not..."
Well, you elitist bitch... thank you using all your energy to try to prevent non-wealthy people in this country from having any healthcare at all. Thank you for hoping that every woman who is not as financially fortunate as you has zero access to mammograms and pre-natal care... Thank you for hoping that non-rich americans don't have the opportunity to detect cancer in time to keep them alive... thank you for hoping that our kids die because we have nowhere to bring them for vaccinations...
I love it when rich cunts say "Life is tough, deal with it..."
- 6 months ago
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Found_Avenue
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jayrye
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Found_Avenue:
She is a perfect example of how we're all slaves. Now we're just judged by our checking accounts rather than our skin color.
- 6 months ago
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jayrye
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samthesixth
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There is no bill yet! There are several competing versions. There is no such thing as the "Obama Health Care Bill." Everyone is arguing the "what ifs."
- 6 months ago
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samthesixth
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snackynak
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US has number 1 healthcare in the world? When did this happen?
1 France
2 Italy
3 San Marino
4 Andorra
5 Malta
6 Singapore
7 Spain
8 Oman
9 Austria
10 Japan
11 Norway
12 Portugal
13 Monaco
14 Greece
15 Iceland
16 Luxembourg
17 Netherlands
18 United Kingdom
19 Ireland
20 Switzerland
21 Belgium
22 Colombia
23 Sweden
24 Cyprus
25 Germany
26 Saudi Arabia
27 United Arab Emirates
28 Israel
29 Morocco
30 Canada
31 Finland
32 Australia
33 Chile
34 Denmark
35 Dominica
36 Costa Rica
37 United States of America
38 Slovenia - 6 months ago
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snackynak
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Mymicz1 [removed]
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snackynak:
Many of these countries have socialized healthcare:)
Socialized healthcare does not make one a socialist.
Granted, you need to be prepared to pay bribes though like everyone in Israel. Or die like people in Canada while you wait. - 6 months ago
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Mymicz1 [removed]
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kennymotown
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snackynak:
Somewhere between Rush Lintball's ass cheeks the truth was lost.
- 6 months ago
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kennymotown
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booksellergirl
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snackynak:
This list should be its own post. Everyone should see where the US stands in terms of health care.
- 6 months ago
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booksellergirl
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carmalite
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snackynak:
Our wonderful HMO loving president Nixon started the parasitic HMO for profit system.
We used to have not for profit hospitals and insurance companies. And insurance was affordable.
- 6 months ago
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carmalite
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JonRaymond
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Woman gets railed for having Obama-Hitler picture
- 6 months ago
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JonRaymond
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lifestudentno83
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Republicans are at the head of this misinformation movement. It's shameful how self-centered, selfish, and misguided they can be.
- 6 months ago
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lifestudentno83
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asherp
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"People aren't dying, they're getting cared for"
Oh MAN, that guy pissed me off.
NO, THEY ARE NOT!!! 27,000 people are dying EVERY YEAR because of EXACTLY this.
- 6 months ago
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asherp
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occhipij
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Wow genius, did you figure this out on your own. Life IS tough, and NEVER fair.
If you can't get health insurance through your job, get a NEW job. Go out, apply for grants, get TAP, and other federal grants...get retrained. Can't figure out what you want to do, or dislike your new field/job - TOUGH. Millions of Americans hate their jobs...what makes you so special?There are tons of people who are self sufficient, who have immigrated here legally, without a penny in their pockets, and could barely speak English...and with hard work, and determination...they did it, they made something of themselves. What's your excuse?
- 6 months ago
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occhipij
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JonRaymond
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occhipij:
Explain to me why health care must be related to your job.
- 6 months ago
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JonRaymond
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occhipij
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occhipij:
because we work jobs to make money, make a life for ourselves, and support our families. Some jobs are not as profitable as others, we know this...someone at burger king won't make as much/have the same benefits as an aerospace engineer (and rightfully so).
The health care industry is a business. Doctors work to MAKE MONEY. Many insurance companies are publicly traded and have to make money for their shareholders, by law. If you have money, you can pay them, for health care services. One way or another, health care is a fee-based service. If you can't pay the fee outright or through insurance, you shouldn't get the service.
So, I work a job to make money, and be allotted certain benefits. We go to school, we learn, we pay our dues...and hopefully, with enough skill, and hard work we can claim what is ours. Once again, we work for many reasons...we work to pay for things, to put food on the table...for *insurance*. Those who can't get insurance, can be retrained to find better jobs, in more prosperous industries.
No matter what any politician says...I know that this money to pay for health care will come out of the pockets of the middle class. I ask you...why should I pay for health insurance for others. These people are not my responsibility. In fact, I probably wont receive a dime of medicare, or social security, but I still have to pay into them for some bizarre reason.
- 6 months ago
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occhipij
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lifestudentno83
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occhipij:
Health care isn't a privilege.
It's a right.EVERYONE is entitled to a clean bill of health, not just those who can pay for it. When you start deciding who gets treatment and who doesn't, then you start denying people's rights.
People with serious illnesses get dropped from their insurance companies because the insurance agents get bonuses for it. Do you think that's fair, that they should just because "the HEALTH CARE INDUSTRY IS A BUSINESS"? Since when is it okay for people's health and well-being to be something to turn a profit on?
I pray you don't find out that the hard way... You'll beg for a universal health care system then.
- 6 months ago
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lifestudentno83
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JonRaymond
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occhipij:
So the police and firefighters are paid for their jobs too. Should we only have their services available to people who have jobs?
How about highways. If you don't have a job then you can't use highways. Same logic. Stupidity.
- 6 months ago
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JonRaymond
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Found_Avenue
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occhipij:
So what about the millions of hardworking Americans who work full-time at an office (not Burger King), and then work overtime, and never miss a day of work, but they happen to be employed somewhere that doesn't offer a health care plan? In your opinion, are they all just poor, broke, losers that literally DON'T DESERVE health coverage? What about independent contractors who work their asses off day in and day out, and make a good living for their family that way? Just because they don't have a "boss," that means they don't deserve health care? Let me know when you finally acknowledge that half the REAL jobs in this country don't provide health care.
And if you try to use that "hey - just go out and get a new job!" argument today... right now... in this economy... Well then you're so out of touch that it's not even worth discussing... go have fun in Maui somewhere, and leave the rest of us here to deal with this very real, very american struggle.
And as for the whole "this is going to come out of the pockets of the middle class" argument... who do think is paying for the non-emergency-related Emergency Room visits that uninsured Americans are forced to make every day? Or, should those poor uninsured dregs just stay home and die instead?
- 6 months ago
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Found_Avenue
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occhipij
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occhipij:
I don't believe anyone is *Entitled* to health care...there are very few things that people are truly "entitled* to, in this life.
yes, the few people that do go to emergency rooms may come out of middle-class taxpayers pockets...but imagine 40 million extra of these all happening in a short period of time. It can come out of your pocket, not mine.
Not everyone can afford health care. Life is difficult, and certainly not fair. Since when was life fair? Is it supposed to be? Tell that to the refugees in Africa who don't even know what ELECTRICITY is. Then come and bitch to me about not having health insurance.
However, the power is in the individuals hands (this IS America). The economy is tough, but finding a job is not "impossible".
Some close to me don't have health insurance, and its no coincidence that they have gone back to school, for more education in hopes of finding a better job.
- 6 months ago
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occhipij
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MilchMann
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occhipij:
How do you equate life being fare to people not having electricity? Millions of people a year take off from work... and go to the woods to live without electricity because it is liberating (or is that word faux pas as well).
Correct me if I am wrong, but you are one of the people that are big on the Jeffersonian line of thought about states rights...correct? Have you read John Locke... one of the most influential philosophers of the founding fathers... including Thomas Jefferson. One of locke's main ideas was social contract's... "the idea that you give up some rights in order to gain the positive things that the state has to offer, like protection" ... like protection from being monetarily raped by insurance companies for absolutely no coverage. WAKE UP!!!!!!
- 6 months ago
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MilchMann
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lifestudentno83
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occhipij:
Every time you pay taxes, you ARE paying for someone who goes to the emergency room and defaults on the payment. The public plan is trying to reduce that cost by letting everyone pay a small portion.
How about you do some RESEARCH instead of believing whatever spew comes out of Fixed Noise's airwaves?
- 6 months ago
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lifestudentno83
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mariahbarnum
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occhipij:
Also, I would like to add in that while some people have high-paying jobs at big corporations with health insurance, and someone else might be working full time every day at Burger King, that doesn't necessarily mean that the person that works at the big corporation is working harder than the person working at Burger King. Its a different TYPE of work. Let's face it, almost every job that you can get in this country, full-time, part-time, or whatever, is stressful and tough in SOME way. Just because your idea of hard work doesn't include slaving over a deep fryer all day to put french fries in your bloated stomach, doesn't mean it isn't tiring for the person that does it. Also, it IS pretty hard to find a job these days, especially a job that is high-paying and gives benefits. You can find plenty of jobs like Burger King, but the people that currently hold positions in the high-paying, benefit-offering jobs are NOT leaving those positions any time soon. And since the economy is so horrible right now, a lot of larger corporations do not see the need to hire new employees and give them benefits as well. You are so ignorant to what is actually going on in America it disgusts me.
- 6 months ago
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mariahbarnum
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hawk5000
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Some one needs to slap that lady that thinks she deserves her own gold plated hospital. What a bitter ugly woman.
And did that other lady name a single Socialist country?
- 6 months ago
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hawk5000
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dirtymilk
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hawk5000:
Yeah seriously, I really can't believe people that uninformed exist.
- 6 months ago
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dirtymilk
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MilchMann
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hawk5000:
I would like to see that lady pay for her own hospital and doctors personally... if she can... great, that is her perogative... if she can not... I am going to piss in here IV bag if I ever see her at a hospital... she started it, fuck it.
And no, ever country she named was socialist... they just so happen to be communist as well. Kinda of like the difference between a republic and a democratic republic... huge fucking difference.
- 6 months ago
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MilchMann
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chasingame
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Wow... This sure shows what kind of brain power these people against public health care really have. They obviously have the louder voices. It's just too bad that they are so oblivious to truth and reason.
- 6 months ago
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chasingame
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JonRaymond
- This comment has been removed.
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JonRaymond
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crob80227
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Healthcare is not like selling lawn chair at Wal-mart.
The people ranting that they don't want to "pay for other people who are fat and lazy" shows just how fantasically ignorant they are of how healthcare is administered and paid for!
When a 19 year old kid gets in a car wreck, has no insurance or really, really crappy insurance and recieved $75,000 worth of ER services AND DEFAULTS ON HIS HOSPITAL BILL ---- how does the hospital recoup that money?
They raise rates.
Under the current system that kid is under no obligation to buy insurance nor pay his hospital bill. I mean, if he is only making $8/hr and can't pay back the $75,000 bill there is nothing anyone can do. The money simply isn't there.
So the kid currently gets "free" healthcare because he doesn't pay his bill.
Under single payer everyone pays for healthcare via taxation....EVERYONE from the guy making $8/hr to the CEO making 1 BILLION dollars pays into the system.
Which is more fair?
The current system wherein the hospitals are going broke because the little old ladies they send their $100,000 hospital bills to default?
Or
The single payer/public option one wherein everyone pays into the system via taxation?
- 6 months ago
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crob80227
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QuestionGeek
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crob80227:
And that is what rich people don't want, because they claim it's socialized medicine.
- 6 months ago
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QuestionGeek
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resolute
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crob80227:
We already have socialized health care. It's called Medicare.
I asked my mom does she like Medicare and she said yes. I said, "Mom, that's socialized health care."
Did my son like seeing medicare deductions on his first paychecks? No. I told him he was paying for grandma's health care.
He said, "Oh."Yes, we need a single payer system. Add those who don't have health insurance to Medicare.
Somehow I think's it's too simple.
- 6 months ago
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resolute
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carmalite
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crob80227:
To the parasites feeding off the denied coverage, it is the same as Wal Mart.
People, especiially the worker bees, are something to use and kill if necessary for a profit. - 6 months ago
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carmalite
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lifestudentno83
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I really like the opposing viewpoint comparisons.
It really allows people to see what this heath care reform is about, and who the people opposing the viewpoints of health care reforms.
- 6 months ago
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lifestudentno83
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lifestudentno83
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"Health care is a right, not a privilege..."
This is so true. - 6 months ago
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lifestudentno83
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QuestionGeek
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lifestudentno83:
Apparently it is NOT a right in the U.S.A. Wake up to reality.
- 6 months ago
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QuestionGeek
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lifestudentno83
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lifestudentno83:
Yeah. I guess we should just give up on trying to get people health care because people die anyway.
YOU wake up. You don't like America the way it is get off your ass and do something instead of complaining and whining.
- 6 months ago
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lifestudentno83
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vladbox
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lifestudentno83:
Yes its a right for you UNTIL your fatness start growing the hateful cancer inside you and you will find yourself broke and unable to survive.
Hahaha. Go on with this the more these Rightwingers do it, the faster the kill themselves S L O W L Y
- 6 months ago
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vladbox
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Found_Avenue
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Well done, Jon. Thanks for posting these.
- 6 months ago
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Found_Avenue
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JonRaymond
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PASADENA CA - Health care protesters gather.
- 6 months ago
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JonRaymond
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JonRaymond
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On Wednesday July 22, 2009 President Obama held a press conference to explain his proposed health care plan and what was being considered in Congress. This film was shot at a Pasadena, California rally during and immediately after that conference.
- 6 months ago
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JonRaymond
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stine1
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JonRaymond:
i really makes me upset that people actually compare our governement to the nazis... there is such ignorance in our world
- 6 months ago
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stine1