We need Universal Health Care not Health Insurance
source: http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/11/15/163935/45
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- matea
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Well what's the difference between getting insurance and just health care?
Well insurance is going to cost you way more. If you're sick and you get some kind of basic insurance plan under a new administration, it may not cover way you need - that kind of insurance will require much more money, especially depending on how in "risk" you are.
"It's simple really. This need is being driven by the profit motive, rather than the altruism of the first fire departments, or the "protect and serve" motive of our police departments. Why is that? How did it come to be that altruism is not the driving factor of the practice of medicine? I don't really know, and in all honesty, it's not why I come before you today. Rather, I come to you simply with the proposition that health care IS properly a basic need that is at least as important as fire and police protection. In both those instances, you do buy recovery insurance, and perhaps there is a place in my grand scheme for health recovery insurance. I contend though that the quality of treatment of a life threatening condition should not be determined by what you can afford to pay. The time you spend waiting for diagnosis should not be determined by the inverse of your bank balance. No family should ever be forced to choose between being at the side of a gravely ill loved one and being able to pay for the best possible care."
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- News and Politics
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antoniusestrillo
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glad to have a view like this. health problem today is already increasing and the health budget is decreasing. well to make this nice view and hopefully concern turn into a national government program to realized it.
- 3 years ago
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antoniusestrillo
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justright
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The world laughs at the current medical policies in the U.S. Hopefully this situation will change soon.
- 3 years ago
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justright
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soleil10
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One way to lower medical cost is to use a local doctor that you trust and
1)Purchase you medication in Canada. It will be at least 60% off. You will pay the same price as if you buy in the USA with prescription coverage (if you have coverage on your own).
2) Have surgery overseas (see google)Insurance companies have global strategy. Do the same. Do not let them and the government trap you in their scheme
A national single payer system was a good idea 25 years ago. It is now behind th times in many ways
- 3 years ago
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soleil10
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uppityprogressive
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Sign up and join the push for single payer health care along with other progressive policies that will serve the people instead of the rich...what a concept.
- 3 years ago
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uppityprogressive
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uppityprogressive
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Single payer is the only way. We can not afford not to do it. Toyota recently placed a plant in Canada because the workers are covered by CDN health care, making business less expensive for them.
The economic system is breaking down, businesses are closing people are being laid off, poverty programs are being cut. This is looking more like the 1st Great Republican Depression all the time.
We must demand single payer health care, nothing less is acceptable or adequate. It would be the quickest way to boost the economy if individuals and businesses no longer had to spend the big bucks on health insurance and on the results of not having it.
And to be clear, single payer health care is not socialized health care, it is a socialized payment system. Socialized medicine looks like the VA where all the providers work for the government.
- 3 years ago
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uppityprogressive
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kermodebear
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uppityprogressive:
Amen to that! From a Canadian who lives and is employed the USA!
- 3 years ago
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kermodebear
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synclaire
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If we have billions to give to financial organizations, fund wars and now bail out the auto industry, then they can do something good for the people! It's up to the people to force the government to change because they won't on their own.
- 3 years ago
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synclaire
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RevolutionSoldier
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We should not wast money on insurance when a single payer plan will provide better care and be munch cheaper than the current system.
- 3 years ago
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RevolutionSoldier
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matea
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My extended family is from Croatia and even they have universal healthcare. My grandparents have had everything from lung cancer to osteoarthritis and they have received the care they needed without charge.
Now I'm not saying its without problems, but are you serious in saying that Croatia has been able to put this as a priority .... but the US just can't?????
- 3 years ago
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matea
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guest
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Have any of you ever read the horror stories from many people who can't get the medical care they need in countries with socialized health care? I'm certainly not saying that the system in the US is free of problems either. But why would we want to move to a system that has been proven in many countries to be even worse?
- 3 years ago
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guest
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neocongo
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guest:
I have. They're called "urban legends."
- 3 years ago
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neocongo
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boyinfidel
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guest:
I live in a country with what you would call 'socialized' health care. I've never heard a horror story from anyone. I can tell you that if you talked to any Canadian on the street they would tell you that our health care system is one of the things that makes this country great. Sometimes I have to wait in line for an hour to see a doctor, but if i need surgery, a CT scan, a cast, an implant, ANYTHING ... its quick and free. The only thing i have to pay for myself is prescriptions and dental work, but my super-cheap company-paid health plan covers that.
You'll never hear of a Canadian who needed surgery or care and was turned away.
- 3 years ago
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boyinfidel
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guest
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guest:
"9/6/07 Toronto Star
An MRI in May 2005 revealed a tumour in her brain. Her family doctor couldn't expedite appointments booked with specialists for July 19 and Sept. 19, 2005. As the tumour pressed on her optic nerves, her vision deteriorated. Afraid to wait any longer, she went to the Mayo Clinic in Scottsdale, Ariz.
Worried the tumour might be cancerous, McCreith and his family wanted an MRI. He was given an appointment date four months later. McCreith went to the U.S. and paid $494.67 (U.S.) for an MRI. Armed with the scan, he saw his Ontario family doctor, who referred McCreith to a neurologist. He was examined on Feb. 8, 2006. He was referred to a neurosurgeon but would have to wait three months.Unhappy with this, he returned to Buffalo. In early March, during a biopsy, the tumour was found to be malignant and surgically removed."
"11/29/06 Ipsos News Center
Ottawa, ON –According to an Ipsos Reid survey among the general public, a majority of Canadian adults rank a patient wait times guarantee as more important than any other of the Government’s priorities. Of the five policy promises made by the Government of Canada during the last federal election, 42% of Canadians said that “a patient wait time guarantee that would reduce wait times for key health services” was the most important to them personally. This compares to lowering taxes (19%), restoring accountability to Ottawa (14%), tackling crime (14%), and implementing a choice in childcare program (9%)."
Interesting, Neocongo, that you say how happy Canadians are, yet 42% of those surveyed here seem to feel that they wait too long to receive health care services.
- 3 years ago
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guest
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neocongo
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guest:
Nevermind. After wading through muck links connected to freerepublic I found the information to which you refer. Really dodgy I might add.
Most interesting is that 42% of Canadians are more concerned about wait times than the 19% concerned about taxes. Interesting statistic on which I would be more inclined to dwell.
Anyway. Isolated cases, many of which have nothing to do with an actual wait time.
- 3 years ago
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neocongo
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neocongo
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guest:
Let's see. Wait longer, or have no healthcare or be unable to pay for it if you did.
Pull your head out of corporate america's bung, and start thinking in the majority of Americans' interests.
- 3 years ago
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neocongo
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kermodebear
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guest:
Have you lived in Canada and participated in the health care there? After I tell most Americans that as a Canadian we have the best health care and health care administration, they like to talk wildly about some of these stupid odd stories that they hear from stupid American journalists who have like you never lived in Canada and participated in health care there. Yes, a few years ago there were some wait lines for certain surgeries but my government has that covered now.
- 3 years ago
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kermodebear
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guest
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guest:
So, what you are telling me is that I shouldn't believe everything that I read or hear in the media? Hmm, interesting thought. . .
- 3 years ago
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guest
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kermodebear
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guest:
It seems like you would rather listen to most in the media who have also never experienced living and participating in another country, besides America. The media for the most part is the degradation of society in the Western World.
- 3 years ago
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kermodebear
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neocongo
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The only people in this country who can't afford universal health care are the insurance companies. And when it happens, there will be no bailout for them. But I am certain our universal health system will be happy to pay for their euthanasia meds.
- 3 years ago
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neocongo
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shadyk
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you bring up a good point with the fire and police service - if you call the fire department cause youre house is on fire, they dont ask you for your fire insurance information...so why would they in healthcare?
- 3 years ago
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shadyk
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unimatrix0
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Yes we can. We can afford universal health care. If we can socialize the financial industry we can certainly socialize the medical system. The time is long overdue. Obama and the democratic majority can make it happen. The time is now. Yes we can.
- 3 years ago
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unimatrix0
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philvoydanoff
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unimatrix0:
That or maybe he/she is inspired by Obama to make a change that would actually make a difference.
- 3 years ago
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philvoydanoff
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cadsuch
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And we are HAVING a financial meltdown so that we WON'T be able to demand universal healthcare.
It concerns me why we feel we must declare that healthcare is a right as a human being. This is a capitalist democracy (sort of) and we have a market place that decides who gets healthcare and who doesn't. Even in universal healthcare we would still have a mechanism set up to determine need.
What we DO need, is to establish that a capitalist democracy has to have a free open market place character. And, a system that has established a monopoly healthcare system, where communities have healthcare systems with CEO's that strut around and congratulate themselves because they were so clever as to be able to CREATE a monopoly, and are therefore able to make the highest return for their investors, only because they were so clever as to be able to esteblish a monopoly, we do not have a capitalist democracy. What we have is the scene of the crime!
Since when is it alright for us to ignore the capitalist democracy rules of promoting compitition? Promoting competition is what caused us to BE the leader of the free world. Leaders of other countries sign their children up on list to come to our country to go to school to learn how to BE the leader of the free world. And we have been electing governments for decades that will promise to ignore the rules of our capitalist democracy that have made us the leader of the world. Does anyone still wonder why we are no longer the leader of the world any more?
- 3 years ago
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cadsuch
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boyinfidel
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cadsuch:
OR it could be argued that promoting a capitalist regime mentality is what got your country in this mess. the current system of healthcare in America is immoral at best. Since when is the health of every American NOT a basic human right? A country's strength can be measured by how it treats those in need.
Capitalism must become a little less selfish if the people under its wing are to survive.
- 3 years ago
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boyinfidel
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Saladin
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The author is right, but there is absolutely no way that our country can afford something like that right now.
Even before the bailouts, we couldn't afford it.
Obama's plan, while entirely inadequate to the 46 million who don't have health insurance, is a decent band-aid to alleviate the problem while we recover from this Republican regime.
- 3 years ago
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Saladin
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metalcookiesxy70
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Because of the financial problems we are having, it will take a very long time to get started with a plan to have universal heath care..its the bailout that is stalling and bringing down many financial plans and bussinesses..
- 3 years ago
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metalcookiesxy70
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JohnA
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Wall Street bailouts are pretty pricey too.
- 3 years ago
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JohnA
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trut
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yeesh. Thats too bad. I guess invasions may be kind of expen$ive.
- 3 years ago
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trut
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JohnA
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Unfortunately we can't afford either one at the moment.
- 3 years ago
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JohnA
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matea
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JohnA:
yes but who thought we could afford the war without this first?? :(
- 3 years ago
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matea
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JohnA
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JohnA:
You'll get no arguement from me. Who cuts taxes in the middle of a war?
- 3 years ago
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JohnA
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mayalynn
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Obama's universal health care plan would still maintain health insurance companies.
We need SINGLE-PAYER health care, and completely eliminate health insurance companies and the for-profit nature of the health industry.
- 3 years ago
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mayalynn
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SheriD123
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I have a 12yr old daughter who has had medical problems from the time she was born. I had to put her on medicaid because no insurance company would take her because of pre-existing conditions. So now the state of Texas wants her dad to get insurance on her. As soon as they check her medical records they denied her. So what are you suppose to do? Recently I got lifeinsurance on me and my oldest daughter with no problem, but my youngest daughter was denied. I hope that Obama will fix this while he is in Office. Because I know there are other people out there with the same problem that I am having. I am a single mom with no place to turn except for medicaid. What makes it even worse if I make any more money the she will be denied. In the last 6-8months she has had to have MRI, CAT Scans, Hearing tests. So tell me what insurance will pick up the bill on that.
- 3 years ago
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SheriD123
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trut
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In Canada, you pay $60 per month per person if you are making over $25 000 year. Excep[t Alberta where we pay nothing because oil royalties pay for all premiums for all Albertans.
- 3 years ago
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trut
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Uzael
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trut:
I pay my taxes. I don't pay anything extra per month for health care.
- 3 years ago
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Uzael
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kermodebear
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trut:
Go Canada Go! It's got the best health care and best administration system in the world. I am a Canadian and I know what I am talking about. Co-payments is an absent word from our system. I pity the Americans who are co-paymented and gouged to death by monthly health care payments. No wonder there are millions of American citizens and illegals who cannot afford health care. This is a human tradegy. The US can wave a big stick but cannot figure out a health care system. Shame, shame, shame! If the USA wants to adopt our system I am sure our Federal Government would love to consult.
- 3 years ago
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kermodebear
