Atheist

If you say god is nature, or natural, I can swing with that.

If you say god is supernatural, or beyond or above what is natural, than I disagree.

I once had a friend who thought that before the bigbang, there was god. Then he/she/it exploded outwards and became the universe, became the stars, the comets, the planets, the rocks, the plants, the animals, the people.

This has been my favorite interpretation of the god-person idea.

Though I personally don't agree with it, I find it to be quite appealing and romantic.

Word!

It must suck not to have faith in the ressurection. I would live like a hedonist, kill people I didn't like, and kill myself, because if when we die, there is nothing afterwards, it means we have lived for nothing....

LG you speak the truth, and sometimes I wish I was a quietist on the topic.

But then again, I have fun chatting the whole thing up. Some people take it way too serious.

UncleCharlie

your remarks reveal a serious lack of character. One should not do wrong (e.g. kill) because it is wrong. To not do wrong because you are afraid big dady in the sky will give you a spanking is morally immature.

I think you are a better person than you give yourself credit for.

Amen.

First, before I break down your statements, I'd like to ask what did your rant have to do with this video? Did you even watch it?

"Do the atheists here then think all who are spiritual are delusional?"

No one here(on this post) has said anyone is delusional. Also, there's a difference between spirituality, god an religion. You're insinuating that atheists aren't spiritual people. Of course thats absurd, Buddhists are spiritual, humanists can be spiritual, need I go on?

"That our Founding Fathers who were for the most part Deists delusional as well?"

I know that and I respect them for that(I'd also bet that a good deal of atheists on current know that as well, Saladin, Delia, etc). In fact I did a mid-term paper on it. Deism is a respectable thought process that bases itself off of reason and generally believes that god does not intervene in the affairs of humanity..

"There are great people of all beliefs and non beliefs who have done great things for the world"

Agreed is anyone here at this moment denying that?

"Morality is the key to character"

Morality is relative term Jan, it's moral for Muslims to force woman to where a bhurka, it's immoral to be a homosexual in many religions. Hell, speaking of morality you've insinuated that I don't have any morals.

"Those who are atheists who cannot acknowledge that are no better than religious fanatics who can't acknowledge the same. "

I agree and disagree with this statement. It's true, to a certain extent but I don't remember a war in the name of atheism(don't pull a Stalin, or Hitler reference, because you know that wasn't about atheism, and Hitler was a Catholic anyway).

"and actually am tired of others lumping all Christians or for that matter people of faith into their neat little compartments. It is actually offensive."

Wonderful, you're offended. You certainly don't represent the majority of Christians in your beliefs or doctrines(at least not in the US) . It's wrong to generalize but to deny that many Christians are alike and have similar beliefs regarding homosexuality, abortion, god, Jesus Christ,evolution, etc etc etc is just foolish.

Of all people to talk about extremism it's wholly hypocritical of you. You have a very black and white view of the world, you tend to insult people who question or disagree with you, and you generally come off as angry. It's Ironic to a certain degree you've generalized about atheists in your statements. You've insinuated that I and others don't have morals(I'll pull up the posts if you want).

I'm not perfect, and all atheists aren't. It's a fact of life, humans aren't perfect. There are some anti-theists who, on current, do not treat believers fairly. But maybe it's time that you look in the mirror and see if you give others a fair shake as you say you do.

If it has nothing to do with the video why did you respond? Just describing my well meaning comment and questions as a "rant" while you run on for miles simply to insult me discredits your obnoxious false response regarding me. It would also appear that you and a few others here think you own this site and can dictate your own moral views upon others. And what I feel about certain topics is not anger as much as it is righteous indignation and outrage at the current condition of our planet and the deterioration of humanity as a whole. What's the matter? Does it bother you that a "christian" actually proves your own biases wrong?

"If it has nothing to do with the video why did you respond?"

Your right, I should know not to respond to your comments.

"can dictate your own moral views upon others."

Where have I dictated my moral views upon others? If you make a claim like that, prove it.

"and what I feel about certain topics is not anger as much as it is righteous indignation and outrage at the current condition of our planet and the deterioration of humanity as a whole."

Righteousness is a relative term and yes Jan outrage is anger

1 b: to violate the standards or principles of 2: to arouse anger or resentment in usually by some grave offense

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/outrage%5B2%5D

"Does it bother you that a "christian" actually proves your own biases wrong?"

Well no, because you haven't proven anything. You've thrown accusations around and haven't backed them up. And Jan, one of my best friends is Christians, and he's proved me wrong many a times when it comes to certain issues.

It wasn't my intent to offend anyone by posting this.

The truth is like it says under the video:
"this is NOT an argument for atheism... It's a defense of atheists."

Why do we need defense? If you've watched the video you have seen where in the Christian Bible it is written:
Atheist are "Fools, they are corrupt, their deeds are vile, there is no one who does good."
And the president of the United States states:
"No, I don't think Atheist should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered as patriots, this is one nation under God."

So you see, we need a little defense on our part.
And again, no offense intended.

You may not have meant it as an offense in posting it, but for the video to intimate there are more 'christians' than 'atheists' in jail says what? That the majority of Christians are criminals? To prove what point? Is that how some atheists seek their own defense by tearing down others? So when you come here to lament the unfairness and corruption of the prison system and sentencing laws, does that apply to Christians as well many of whom are black and more than likely there because of unfair sentencing standards, prejudices, etc? Is that even a thought, or is just sticking it to the 'christians' the only MO here?

And my original comment was generally speaking based on a comment above about the "rest of us letting go of our deliusions." But of course, the self appointed head of the atheist threads Current89 can't help but jump on it and give the usual arrogant insulting response which certainly does not project an image of civility for those he deigns to speak for.

Personally (besides never being in jail or in trouble with the law at all,) I am not into organized religion and believe more in Gnossis, and yes, the words of Jesus Christ the man which I do live my life by. I don't see where that is either delusional or an impediment to a promising future for anyone.

So yes, I was a bit offended by some of the video in context (however, not regarding those who were featured as I personally believe Carl Sagan to be one the most brilliant men who ever lived) and the comment I originally responded about and chose to respond on that. Believe me, I won't make that mistake again here.

You're absolutely right about the unfair sentencing standards and prejudices of the prison system. The MO here is not just sticking it to the christians. The real MO is how you felt about the prison stats (offended right?). Now put the shoe on the other foot and you can imagine how Atheist feel about not being considered citizens, or being called "corrupt, vile, and people who do no good" by the Bible. Do you not think Atheist get offended too?

And yes, Carl Sagan is my hero too (see my profile)
and yes I believe in his quote at the end of this video.

"It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."

yea...regarding the afterlife I think our founding fathers were delusional. on the other hand, for their time, they were pratically enlightened. especially in america.

/raises_hand

Delusional:
1. an act or instance of deluding.
2. the state of being deluded.

3. a false belief or opinion

Delude:
1. to mislead the mind or judgment of

http://dictionary.reference.com/dic?q=delusional&search=search

If you convince yourself of a "truth" that isn't true, you are delusional.

Thank you. That comment just made my day!

Mine too

:) 501(c)3 ?

When you say "put religion behind us" are you talking about the elimnation of religion completely or the power religion has over government?