Tech | July 10, 2008 | 77 comments

See-thru solar panels could double output

source: http://blog.wired.com/wiredscience/2008/07/see-through-sol.html

Image
huffamoose2k
If there's one thing most people know about solar cells, it's that they are too expensive.

Now, MIT researchers think they may have found a way to double the performance of solar arrays with cheap dyed glass and some tricks borrowed from fiber optics.

Their so-called solar concentrator could be placed on top of existing solar arrays. It could capture some wavelengths of visible light and guide them to high-voltage solar cells on the edges of the array, while still allowing the infrared light that largely powers current solar systems to pass through.

"If you stick one of these on top of existing solar panels, we think we could nearly double the performance of these systems with minimal added cost," said Marc Baldo, the lead researcher on the work.

The new research, published tomorrow in the journal Science, is another major advance in solar energy, a field that's received renewed interest due to concerns about climate change and rising fossil fuel prices. The new MIT technology marries the science behind two of the most promising ways of harnessing solar energy: light concentrators and thin-film solar cells.
Companies like SolFocus, which has raised $95 million, are using mirrors to concentrate sunlight on small amounts of photovoltaic cells. They can generate a lot of power, but rely on expensive sun-tracking mirrors. Another hot research area of solar research is thin-film solar, which uses dyes to print solar cells on cheap plastic. Putting the two technologies together could be a new way of making solar power cheaper. Current PV generation costs about 20 cents per kilowatt hour, several times more expensive than coal, wind and natural gas power generation.

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77 comments // See-thru solar panels could double output

  • echoz
    • 0
      echoz  

    • "If there's one thing most people know about solar cells, it's that they are too expensive."

      I wonder who's version of "expensive" we're talking about...because in the "understood" sense, you could continue to say that again, and again, and again, as it's always made to be the "truth" in a world that thrives on nothing more than a sickening profit motive while holding out the dignity of fellow man to be nothing more than a pipe dream... Who are the greedy? Who are the selfish, content to look the other way? Who is it that tells us what we can or can't be, and we like sheep go along believing there is no other way.

      But there is a better way, and we all KNOW it instinctively, intuitively...we know it. We don't have to look the other way. We can choose, if we remember there is a choice, even if it is "just" personal...

    • 3 years ago
  • victimofcoal
    • 0
      victimofcoal  

    • Analogy; a closed mind is like a closed parachute, it just doesn't work. billions spent to secure oil in Iraq, not billions spent to break America's addiction to oil. Bush thinks drilling for more oil is how we break the addiction, so I say, let the crack addicts grow there own coca, and make their own crack, that will break the addiction, much like with oil . Break the addiction with death seems to be the objective on both oil and crack. Maybe green industry will get a chance to put those 432,000 newly unemployed workers this year, back to work.

    • 3 years ago
  • ebdotkom
  • Bigdog_mike
  • Wetdog
    • 0
      Wetdog  
    • Bigdog_mike:

      I spent some time in Death Valley last summer---I discovered that black paint stores thermal solar energy quit readily----and quite a long time too.

      Be careful what you sit down on if you are wearing shorts.

    • 3 years ago
  • KD0BQM
    • 0
      KD0BQM  

    • For anyone with a few days and the patience to read over 800 pages of very interesting history, may I recommend "The Prize, The Epic Quest for Oil, Money and Power" by Daniel Yergin. I have just finished it and am still digesting. Fascinating, to say the least. According to Wikipedia, Dr. Yergin "is currently at work on 'a new book on oil and geopolitics.'" I can't wait!

    • 3 years ago
  • powerup
  • jitterysquirrel
    • 0
      jitterysquirrel  

    • The key word in this headline is could. Oil will provide the bulk of the world's energy for the foreseeable future whether the greenies like it or not. A lot of these alternative technologies are pipe dreams. These solar panels might also turn out to just be a idea without a foundation. Right now, nuclear power provides the only viable alternative to petroleum products. We should build more nuclear plants to provide that clean plentiful energy that solar promises but doesn't deliver on.

    • 3 years ago
  • TommyP
    • 0
      TommyP  
    • jitterysquirrel:

      If we had nuclear fusion I would agree but we don't yet have it and would end up with vast amounts on nuclear waste on our hands that generations would have to deal with and that sort of situation where we leave a legacy of harm without representation for future generations is what we wish to avoid.

    • 3 years ago
  • twodee
  • Wetdog
    • 0
      Wetdog  
    • jitterysquirrel:

      Tommy----I hate to have to break the news to you so abruptly, but we do have nuclear fusion energy available right now.

      It is called sunshine.

      We didn't even have to pay for the reactor, it came free with the house when we rented it.

    • 3 years ago
  • TommyP
    • 0
      TommyP  
    • jitterysquirrel:

      yes we do have it in that form, what I meant was in a reactor on the earth so as to produce energy when its night, fission just doesn't cut it with all its waste and is not a viably sustainable energy source where as fusion reactors could be

    • 3 years ago
  • Wetdog
    • 0
      Wetdog  
    • jitterysquirrel:

      The sun is open for business 24/7, it is only night where you are at.

      Wind, ocean waves, and hydro power are simply extensions of solar energy.

      I'm not stubbing you here to get technical or arguementative. I'd just like for you to think a little larger. There's nothing weak or wimpy about solar power---it is spread out sure, but put enough of it together and it can do some pretty awesome stuff. A hurricane is solar power. A tornado is solar power. A hurricane can suck the ocean up into a bulge that is 200-300 miles across to a height of 10-15 ft. That's a LOT of very heavy water.

      Put a lot of small streams together and you have a river. If you've ever seen a river like the Missouri or Mississippi in flood stage----it is breathetaking the amount of energy passing in front of you----and every single drop of all that water and energy was put there by the sun.

    • 3 years ago
  • 1Eco_Media
    • 0
      1Eco_Media  
    • Image

    • Solar will be used on a large scale more and more as the cost comes down. Ideas like this help that to happen sooner.

      Those who still value OIL have little or no interest in the need to slow global warming.

      clean sustainable solutions seem more in line with
      ANY THOUGHT OF DIVINE SPIRIT to me.

      To each his/her own.

      In my thought she rides her own BIKE.
      Woman's Bike Company, Made in America
      see the link...

    • 3 years ago
  • csmonut
    • 0
      csmonut  

    • Ipodrulz, money is what drives technological innovation. If it weren't for the possibility of turning a good profit, we'd still be in the dark ages.
      The US has always been a country that one could become rich if they had the right idea and put it to use at the right time.
      BIG OIL and Bill Gates have made good contributions to this country, and the world. It is not their responsibility what the people use it for.
      It is OUR responsibility a humans to continue to ask for and use sustainable and renewable energy resources.
      If we quit using the products, and companies see their profits dwindling, they'll change their strategy to meet the demand of the people.
      How many people are drinkng water from plastic bottles? And why?

    • 3 years ago
  • torybart
    • 0
      torybart  

    • This is awesome. I still cannot understand why we don't harness the sun's energy to its full potential. I saw a stat that said that one hour of earth surface energy from the sun would power the entire world for like a year... not sure how accurate that is but it was something absolutely ridiculous like that.

    • 3 years ago
  • bishopobispo
  • Wetdog
  • Vierotchka
    • 0
      Vierotchka  
    • Image

    • The photovoltaic dye was discovered and invented by the Swiss twins Andreas & Toby Meyer, many years ago, and many years before they created their company (see link). At the time they invented this, they had immense difficulties in getting industries interested in their invention - it was in the late eighties and few people were concerned by global warming or interested in alternative sustainable and non-polluting sources of energy.

    • 3 years ago
  • huffamoose2k
  • SamuraiDave
    • 0
      SamuraiDave  

    • eventually oil will be used up at the current rate of consumption. Looking for alternative sources of power is a logical step forward. Following Mr. Burns (whom I suspect to be by his handle a sarcastic devil's advocate) thinking we never would have let go of steam (of course that might not have been a bad idea all things considering).

    • 3 years ago
  • LuckyPenny
    • 0
      LuckyPenny  

    • This is a fascinating discussion. First, I have to say, mrburns, when people know better, it's their responsibility to DO better. Yes, petroleum products fairly rule our lives right now. Is it prudent to continue that practice when we know there are valid renewable alternatives to oil? Alternatives that don't do damage to the planet or it's inhabitants? These alternatives are out there, ready to go ... who or what do you think is holding them back? Could it be "big oil"??? Or maybe it's "the blind patriots". Mrburns, you need to wake up and smell the octane. Twodee's on the sensible track. Open up your mind and let the solar energy in, man.

      This is a hot topic that we regular people ought to get more educated about and become more active. Great article huffamoose2K!

    • 3 years ago
  • ipodrulz
    • 0
      ipodrulz  

    • I bet you just like every other "magical product" that comes out of any lab it'll take years and years to implement. And when it is implemented it's only destined to fail because of poor consumer reaction. People are very skeptical about new technologies. And obviously new technologies has their wrinkles and limits but when there seems to be low interest in the possible earth-saving product laboratories just axe the whole project. People have GOT to STOP using the "green" ACT to JUST gain money.

    • 3 years ago
  • huffamoose2k
    • 0
      huffamoose2k  
    • ipodrulz:

      being green is not about making money, in the true sense. Hollywood is trying to make it the hot new fad to follow, so i can understand why you might think that.

      Many companies are jumping on this wagon because it is the socially and ecologically responsible thing to do. They dont want to just make money. Green products cost more because they cost more to produce.

      Sometimes you have to sacrifice a little green to save the Green you know what I mean keen bean? :)

    • 3 years ago
  • regularrf
    • 0
      regularrf  

    • Most people don't understand how they work,they are
      not pleasing to the eye and it seems that the output
      is low a lot to do for little.What I would like is every house with a wind mill and solar panels(small ones)that go on the roof.Large enough to supply power for that one house solar panels placed to get full effect of the sun.
      A way to store extra power.If this could be done and proven to the American public as the older people moved
      on or out the new home owners would convert.

    • 3 years ago
  • stopnoise
    • 0
      stopnoise  
    • regularrf:

      I am totally with you and would be great to have a good fit house wind power and solar that would produce enough power to free a 3-4 bedroom house from the Grid. Our wishes for it!

    • 3 years ago
  • TommyP
    • 0
      TommyP  
    • regularrf:

      The problem with small wind turbines is that they don't really produce much energy, they ideally need to have sustained wind that isn't affected by turbulence. Within a built up area this is inevitable unless they are put on extremely large poles to clear any surrounding obstacle. What would be ideal would be for large wind arrays (onshore and offshore) to be built and houses to have both types of solar technologies attached to them along with either ground or air source heat pumps.

    • 3 years ago
  • damnneargenius
  • huffamoose2k
  • twodee
  • Vierotchka
    • 0
      Vierotchka  
    • damnneargenius:

      Twodee, that is not necessarily the case with photosynthesis-emulating photovoltaic dyes - the Swiss inventors of that dye said that buildings could have all their windows fitted with this dye and produce most of the electricity they use.

    • 3 years ago
  • twodee
  • Jaded2784
  • ProjectDRAFT
  • jubal
    • 0
      jubal  

    • Localized power production and distribution of alternative electrical production through wind and solar is certainly the goal we must strive for and propose at public meetings in our local towns. Encourage them to get on the band wagon and pioneer these technologies.

    • 3 years ago
  • WhiteCrow22
    • 0
      WhiteCrow22  

    • Solar energy is more now than it has ever been, and it will not be so expensive if it is done in mass, which is what mr burn's Big Oil is deathly afraid of. There are new thin film solar collectors (approx 1/4 inch) that are produced in long rolls for steel pan and flat roofs, or shaped like asphalt shingles that are made to be used as roofing material, and that can also be used as siding. These flexible PVC panels can be hit with a hammer, have holes drilled in them, they can be cut to fit, they can be glued to virtually any surface, all without diminishing their performance. They actually work best in lower light conditions like at evening or dusk, or when it is cloudy, or when there are shade trees blocking direct sunlight, so no expensive tracking solar foci are required. As this product begins to be produced in mass, significant economies of scale will be achieved that reduce its cost, perhaps like a rock falling through space to hit you on the head mr burns.

    • 9 hours ago
  • stopnoise
  • huffamoose2k
  • tldiaz99
  • Enjoy_Cannabis
  • Inofuilwell
    • 0
      Inofuilwell  

    • Mr.Burns,

      You should look into getting a new avatar instead of the drilling rig. Perhaps a cartoon likeness of Mr. Magoo would suit your online persona more accurately. The ostrich with his head in the sand is over-used.

      TwoDee isn't whining she's just explained very well, what is facing us. It is you who are whining.

      When Boone Pickens has all the water rights bought, leased and tied up by 2025, it could be you who were wishing you'd given things more thought all the way around.

      And by the way, your analogy about Pizza Hut does not deal with an eventual depletion of tomatoes.

      To all the others who are thinking, I remember using a magnifying glass to burn words into the bark of a tree.

      Even without solar voltaic concentration. there is no reason that the concentration of sunlight through mirrors, collection or magnification couldn't boil water and create steam.

      Twodee suffers fools much more tolerantly than do I. Especially when they are also overbearing.

      Perhaps you'll gain other converts to your one-dimensional and reactionary view of life with your pleasant personality.

      Also, if you'll indulge me, what exactly is a hippocrite?

    • 3 years ago
  • barkway
  • Inofuilwell
    • 0
      Inofuilwell  
    • Inofuilwell:

      Ever hear of Mesa Petroleum? He also owns and is putting a lot of money into Mesa Water. They own wells all over the Edwards Aquifer in Texas but more importantly, they own enough of th water rights to drastically cut down on the available water running underground in that huge aquifer that supplies much of the drinking water for rural West and South Texas.

      Boone also gave $165 Million to the OSU golf team with the stipulation they re-invest it in his hedge fund.

      Boone's a hustler from way back.

    • 3 years ago
  • TaylerPERRY
  • queenofit
    • 0
      queenofit  

    • I always think back to this part of The Graduate when I think about the flood of new plastics that we have an endless supply of.

      "After the war, the new plastics that had been developed entered the consumer mainstream in a flood. New manufacturing techniques were developed, using various forming, molding, casting, and extrusion processes, to churn out plastic products in vast quantities. American consumers enthusiastically adopted the endless range of colorful, cheap, and durable plastic gimmicks being produced for new suburban home life" from wiki

    • 3 years ago
  • barkway
    • 0
      barkway  

    • Nice! We've been exploring going off-grid but the output didn't seem worth the cost and effort. These may chnage that.

    • 3 years ago
  • xplayhousex
  • twodee
    • 0
      twodee  

    • mrburns, you are right. oil is in just about everything and we are using it right now even as we type words on this plastic keyboard and read the glowing words on the screen. Many of us in the developed world can't just stop using,touching eating,drinking something that has not benefited from oil. That does not mean it is wrong to look at doing something else. big oil companies should look to sustainable technologies because it would benefit more than your family to do so. What can big oil say about the land they rape in Alaska, The Amazon, and many other places? What can big oil do for those families whose way of life has been destroyed for the extraction and the spilling of oil? If your God blesses Big Oil than your God blesses the destruction of life. I am not familiar with that God. It is not hypocritical to bash big oil for all the corruption and greed that has run through the veins of it's empire. This is an awakening of human reason and spirit. This is human life looking at it's own reflection and realizing it's imperfection has taken us far from being right in the world. There is no shame in admitting our mistakes. There IS shame in denying a natural enlightenment available to every living thing for yet another destructive feast of the human ego. The REAL whining and complaining is just the ego thrashing around in it's last moments for fear that it will have no place in an enlightened world. I am happy your family has had the chance to experience a better life. Please take another look. There may be an even better one than you think.

    • 3 years ago
  • huffamoose2k
    • 0
      huffamoose2k  
    • twodee:

      Thank you twodee, You put it perfectly. I dont hate oil, I just think there are better things that can help more people for a longer time. I'm thinking of the next 100 generations, not just my grandchildren.

    • 3 years ago
  • WhiteCrow22
  • menmykoko
    • 0
      menmykoko  
    • twodee:

      HAH! Take that Mrburns. LOL. Very well said. I especially like that thrashing around part. Hee Hee. Yes, It was a wonderful discovery in its day and certainly the world has benefitted and progressed much more--Duh! That's not the point now that we are aware of alternatives (for the past few decades albeit--nevermind that they have been squelched by the oil companies for fear of profit losses). Not mentioning that oil companies stifled other forms of energy research in the form of lobbying I am sure was deliberate. Knowingly stating something like "god bless big oil" is spitting in his children and his children's children and his childrens childrens children faces because they will be the ones who will be facing the environmental consequences of what he thinks is so wonderful. But he is either too stupid or too afraid to admit he is wrong. Or he is just trying to get a rise out of the rest of us. or all of the above.

    • 3 years ago
  • mrburns
    • 0
      mrburns  

    • The reason why I always put "god bless big oil" is because It feeds my family and provides a better life for us. It keeps america running and you are using it right now in some form, yet you constantly hippocritically bash it (and use it)

      Oil companies put out a product and do a good job at it, why should they do something else when their product is working.

      Why should pizza hut invest in McDonalds?

      If you want it start your own business and market it yourself. Quit whining and complaining and do it yourself.

      God bless big oil
      God bless america

    • 3 years ago
  • huffamoose2k
    • 0
      huffamoose2k  
    • mrburns:

      I use oil because society forces me to. But I try to save oil-bearing products as much as possible. I am very environmentally sound, and I always push it on my friends to use reusable bags and to bike to work and things like that. I understand how much oil has done for us. But I am against these companies squeezing every penny out of us because the oil supply MIGHT go down. I also understand that it feeds many people, but it is also killing the planet.

    • 3 years ago
  • sapere_aude
    • 0
      sapere_aude  
    • mrburns:

      Oh No! I'm a hippocritapotamus. I can criticize big oil all I want. I do not use their products by choice, it is forced upon me. Their governmental ties and buying power have limited the development of technologies that threaten their profits.

    • 3 years ago
  • huffamoose2k
  • Vierotchka
  • Wetdog
    • 0
      Wetdog  
    • mrburns:

      You have every right to feed your family and make an honest living. I'm all for that.

      That's exactly the reason that I support biofuels.

      Oil is $147 a barrel, and going up. Oil is running out. We are using it faster than we are finding it. One day it will be gone, and you will be out of a job, like it or not.

      If you are making biofuels, you would be providing the same valuable service to us all. And you can KEEP providing that service as long as you want, and your children can too, and their children can too.

      And we can all KEEP using your service just like we are now---the same way we are now.

      I don't want to put you out of a job---I want your job to be there for a long long time to come--I want you to be producing fuels that come from renewable sources that don't pollute. I want you to keep the 18 wheel diesels and the fast sporty rag tops on the road just like they are now---I just want you and your kids(if that is what they want to do) to be able to keep it that way for a LONG LONG time by switching to renewable fuels.

      Nice thing about biofuels, they will always be made right here--there won't be any reason to have to be shipping them half way around the world, the raw materials are already here, abundant, and will never run out. They are just waiting for a person like you to come along and turn them into biodiesel and ethanol.

      If you will do that, we'll both be happy campers.

    • 3 years ago
  • TommyP
  • Wetdog
    • 0
      Wetdog  
    • mrburns:

      Tommy P---B-100 biodiesel is being produced right now from saltwater algae in Rio Hondo TX in a farm with a 4.4 million gallon per year capacity. That replaces petroleum diesel at the rate of one gallon B-100 replaces the need for 2.3 gallons of petroleum crude.

      Ethanol is being produced from celluosic plant waste right now in LA and WY. There is a plant being constructed in Soperton GA that will produce 100 million gallons per year of ethanol from logging and millwork wood waste. Many paper mills produce ethanol as a by product of pulp treatment in paper production.
      Ethanol was produced commercially from wood as far back as the 1890's in both the US and Germany.
      Spain produces 750 million liters/yr. of ethanol from cellulose and plans to double prodution in the next 2 years.
      Brazil provides 80% of its transportation fuel needs with ethanol produced from sugar cane grown on just 2% of available farmland---AND it is the largest ethanol exporter in the world.

      I don't know of too many people that eat saltwater algae or tree limbs.

    • 3 years ago
  • clintisdakoolest
  • huffamoose2k
  • Buttercup87
  • barkway
  • Elligirl
  • mrburns
    • 0
      mrburns  

    • Twodee and huffamoose I agree and am not talking about you two, but I think it is funny how other people bash oil companies for profits, and items like this get a pass for being expensive.

      God bless big oil
      God bless America

    • 3 years ago
  • huffamoose2k
    • 0
      huffamoose2k  
    • mrburns:

      Why god bless big oil? They are not using enough of their profits towards these types of technology. They make somewhere arounf $40 Billion in profit and spend around 10 Million on renewable resources. They might be making and effort, but not enough. They are making their reign last as long as possible.

    • 3 years ago
  • sapere_aude
    • 0
      sapere_aude  
    • mrburns:

      The reason oil companies get bashed while expensive technologies such as this get a pass is because these technologies are renewable. Oil isn't.

      Oil companies can't control the sun, its up there for everyone.

    • 3 years ago
  • twodee
  • huffamoose2k
    • 0
      huffamoose2k  

    • It should be a law that all new buildings HAVE to be built with Solar panels on the roof. We could break up small communities into localized power grids.

    • 3 years ago
  • shroomfairy
  • bogginblazer
    • 0
      bogginblazer  
    • huffamoose2k:

      that would be great. but what would the cost be. and who for that matter whould knnow how to do the install. im all for dont get me wrong. i would love to get away from coal. but how long till it hit main streem.

    • 3 years ago
  • pirho338
  • huffamoose2k
    • 0
      huffamoose2k  
    • huffamoose2k:

      To Boggin: Solar technology is already in use in many different public sectors. Some Darming communitites in Norther Cali are for sure doing it as well as Sonoma Statue University's Recreation Center.

      And the money problem... It might be a big chunk up fron but the free energy for the rest of your life kinda makes up for it.

    • 3 years ago
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